Posted by psgels on 18 November 2007 with categories: Les Miserables - Shoujo Cosette


Okay, I don’t care about the cheesy parts. This episode was absolutely magnificent! Just when I thought that this series had passed its best part, it comes and delivers such an incredibly awesome episode. Obviously, spoilers are going to follow.

If this was a regular anime, this would be about the time where the adults step back and let the youngsters take over. In this episode, it’s the ENTIRE OPPOSITE, as it features the final epic conflict between Jean and Javert, and the younger members of the cast take a step back and only get a few small minutes of airtime. At the end of the previous episode, Jean had a badly wounded Marius with him, and indeed, Jean finally stops running away and agrees to go with Javert if he brings Marius to a hospital.

We then switch to Javert’s carriage, where I absolutely loved the conversation Jean and Javert had, and to make things even better, Jean explains what exactly made him change so much. It turns out that the words of the bishop brought him in a huge confusion, and he lived a miserable life of a drifter at that point. Then he got accidentally mistaken for a thief, and scared a child away because of it, and that’s what made him see the light.

Javert finally has this moment when he realizes that Jean still has Fantine’s last wishes in his mind, after all these nine years. Marius is dropped off at the hospital, and Javert leaves Jean behind when the latter wants to say his final goodbye to Cosette! Later, when Javert realizes what exactly he had done, he really sees the light. Literally and figuratively, and I adored the amount of depth that he got with his little monologue.

Immediate changes in personality are often hard to do, and they often feel forced, but for me, this episode was awesome, both for Jean and Javert and more than half of the scenes had me crying at the screen. I’m not sure whether it was done this way in the book, but one way or the other, this episode was outstanding.

And right now, I’m wondering what the creators have been planning for the final six episodes. Will it be one long aftermath, or will Thenardier return one final time? The latter would be awesome.

33 Responses

  1. angedemystere says:

    Wait . . . exactly HOW did this episode end?

  2. psgels psgels says:

    The episode ended with Javert, letting Jean go and telling his colleagues that Jean died.

  3. Irene says:

    …no.

    NO. NO, NO, NO, NO. JUST. NO.

    I…

    …and here I thought that letting Gavroche survive was the worst thing they could’ve done. I…just…

    angedemystere, if you value your sanity and your grasp of canon, for heaven’s sake don’t watch this episode. It will only end in tears. I don’t know who that man was who “saw the light” at the end of this episode, but he wasn’t Javert.

    I…I’ll write more when I’m more coherent. Right now I’m going to go console myself with Philip Quast.

    Singing “Javert’s Suicide.”

    Repeatedly.

    …aaaaaaaaaargh.

  4. R says:

    Yep, I predicted this was going to happen. Oh well.

  5. Irene says:

    I stand corrected, R.

    *crawls into a corner and rocks back and forth, whimpering*

  6. psgels psgels says:

    I somehow suspected that with this episode, the creators would divert from the novel somehow. Ironically, the moment where Javert saw “the light” was the only part that really felt out of place, now that I’m thinking back. It’s a shame, if there was anything that would have made this episode even better it would have been the suicide of Javert.

    But then again, this remains a children’s anime, unfortunately. I can understand how a suicide can be a bit too much for the younger viewers, compared to a regular murder.

  7. Irene says:

    This is why I was pretty dubious when I first heard about Shoujo Cosette. Les Mis isn’t children’s material. It’s gritty and realistic and not at all fluffy (unless you count the bits with Marius and Cosette in), and to cut any of that out would be to do the original work a grave injustice.

    It isn’t in Javert’s nature to “see the light” and simply walk away – and that’s the understatement of the year. Mizzies have slightly different views on why, exactly, Javert commits suicide, but I think all of us agree that the last thing he’d do is survive that confrontation with himself.

  8. angedemystere says:

    You mean . . . he just walked away, and THAT’S IT?!

    WHAT THE HELL?!?!

    If they just leave it at that without some kind of explanatory follow-up, I’m going to scream. Oh, dear Lord . . .

  9. Irene says:

    What irritates me most is that he spent half his bloody monologue staring meaningfully at the Seine, as if to get our hopes up that he’d actually jump. That’s sadistic, that is.

  10. GuruLazer says:

    You have to be kidding me… I’ve waiting the whole series for the ‘off the rails’ moment, and now…! *goes off on a Quast rant*

  11. GuruLazer says:

    I don’t speak any Japanese so don’t know what was said in this episode, but do you think it’s maybe possible that after going to the police post the story will continue as normal? Maybe?! *hopes die*

  12. Tania says:

    I don’t like the way this serie keeps on . Actually I HATE it !!! First, everything showed isn’t written in the book , I thought since Mabeuf and Eponine had died ( a huge sacrifice! ), that’s because japoneese anime always follow historical facts so they just can’t do otherwise. Like Versailles no bara of Riyoko Ikeda for exemple, have you seen this one? Well, nearly everyone dies in this one and Mary-Antoinnette and the king don’t survive due to a miracle! It a great anime! A manga – anime isn’t especially for children , everyone knows it . Actually they’re more for adults or teenagers. Because some are even forbidden till 18 like Elfen Lied. So it can’t be an excuse to ruin everything, there has to be something else, I HOPE SO!!! And besides ,les miserables isn’t a children’s novel and I’m sure they know it. So it’s not supposed to be a chidren’s show because they wouldn’t understand anything. Well, let’s get down to the serie, the fact Gavroche and even Javert survive, THAT’S JUST UNFORGIVABLE!!! It really is!!! I could have forgiven them if Eponine had survived as well! She’s the only one whom I really wanted to see alive at the end and find happiness even if I knew that’s not in the novel. But I wanted that so much !!!But why did she have to die while almost all the others who are also supposed to die will live happily ever after. It not a disney movie, come on! But it really looks like all the characters are going to form a big family. It looks like Gavroche is going to live with Cosette like if she were his mother or something! Valjean is going to look after them! Now I’m sure no one else would die and the serie would keep on making mistake after mistake for children’s sake. Well,then why do they have to show all this blood in the 41st episode. Till then it was extraordinary work but the end is just a big disappointment! They almost wasted everything. How could they do that? I keep telling myself that something happened between the 41st and the 42nd episode. Maybe a change in the team. But I still cannot understand!
    However,I’ll watch it till the very end, I have no more hopes but it will be so funny to see how they’ll manage to conclude because there’re only six episodes left! They should hurry!

  13. psgels psgels says:

    Tania: the thing is that most anime (including Elfen Lied) air after midnight, when all of the children are already asleep. Les Miserables airs at 7:30, where most children are able to see it, just before they head to bed. I’m not sure if you’ve seen other World-Masterpiece Theatre-series, but I can imagine how they’d deal with the same mature themes, put into a children’s context. Indeed, they won’t understand everything, but it’s series like these that will make an impression on them.

    Also, from the perspective of someone who hasn’t read the book, I don’t really things that the changes that have been made ruined it. You can read above how much I enjoyed this episode, and at most it felt a bit cheesy when Javert “saw the light”. I’m not sure about the others, but I’m not going to let these small details ruin such a magnificent anime.

  14. Tania says:

    Well, you have a point. If I hadn’t read the book , I would certainly liked this one . And yes , it’s true that some things are well done . But it’s hard for me to accept that a character that I loved more than all others has passed away. Try to understand my point! Well despite that thing, I find it’s a good episode , really. But don’t you think that if Gavroche and Javert survived it would be even better if Mabeuf and Eponine survived as well, don’t you think ? Well, I know that sometimes I really get attached to some characters so I can’t have an objective point of you. But you’re right! The way Javert has finally seen the light is remarkable! After all these years of searching Jean. And I liked the way he managed to understand Jean somehow and to give up. When Jean comes back to the carriage, Javert is gone. That was a good point. And I liked the way Cosette sang the song to Gavroche, the one she sang when they were children. I’m glad they managed to see one another and they’re finally together now. Well when I try to pull the book aside and to forget the way Eponine died , I think it is a good episode. So I actually agree with you on that point.

  15. psgels psgels says:

    Well, I can see your point, yeah. It would have been great if both Maboef and Eponine had a bit more airtime as well, instead of getting killed off so early, because their characters were just too awesome at times. But yet, I think that their deaths would have been more necessary to show than the one of Gavroche and Javert (do note that I’m saying this without knowing how both the book and anime will end).

    Because the characters we knew and loved through the series died so early, we get shown the cold and hard reality of the revolution, and Les Amis are basically engaging in something that can quite easily kill them. Compare this with a similar anime that refuses to kill off its characters: there’s no sense of tension because well, the characters won’t die anyway, so why should we bother to care for them? Of course, I say this without knowing what kinds of effects the deaths of Gavroche and Javert had in the book. Were there people who cared about them? Did their deaths influence the people around them in any way?

  16. Tania says:

    psgels : Yeah, I’ve come to realize that what you’ve said was true. So I’ll just try to enjoy watching it. I suppose I could. And yes despite everything, it is a magnificent anime! You’re absolutely right! And I’m sorry I haven’t put myself in your place before writting. Because I quite agree with everything you said. Even if I’d rather they followed the book. But it’s in this anime that I found the character that I loved the most. And it remains my favorite show even if I don’t agree with everything that occurs in the end due to my reading. So I wanted you to know that I’ve read your comment above and practically agreed with everything. It just that when you’ve read the book, it’s hard to accept the way the anime took.

  17. Tania says:

    psgels : Well I don’t remember just everything but I would say that Gavroche hadn’t much people who cared about him. He was a street boy who was quite rejected from his family, his mother hated boys and contrary to the anime , he hadn’t known Cosette because he was just a baby when she was with the Thénardier and they had never become friends and hadn’t Chouchou to support them. So it’s much more sad for them both. I don’t remember anyone who would cared that much about Gavroche and certainly not Cosette. But his death is important in the book and quite a symbol of Revolution and people protest against starvation and poverty. So he fought for what he thought was right. And Javert is a determined and obsessed by the law man who would never accept the fact people could change and that’s what important in his death. I don’t how to put it. But to accept that would ruin all the concepts he lived for. He would rather die than admit Valjean’s change. He’s a cold man who fallows the law without taking into account his feelings or his heart. I wondered if he even had one . So, this change in his personnality even if it’s interesting in the anime could never have been possible the book. Even if both characters haven’t had friends ( or at least I don’t remember them to have some ) , I would say their deaths are quite as important in the book and I would say even more important because they’re symbols especially Gavroche. But you’re totally right! Mabeuf and Eponine’s deaths may be more important than the other too. Because those two characters were exeptionnal and I don’t know for you but when Eponine died my heart broke apart. I kept telling ” please don’t die! I don’t want you to die ! I care for you so much!” Maybe it sounds stupid but her death seemed so real! I even invented something about her. She survives because Mont Parnasse saved her. And I just kept telling myself it’s a character and not someone real but it didn’t help . I don’t remember to ever have felt this way while I was watching an anime. And I cried when Mabeuf died . That must be it . I’m pretty sure I wouldn’t have cried for Javert but even if I never liked Gavroche as much as I liked Eponine , I liked this character too so I would certainly be sad . It’s not like if I wanted him to die. But Gavroche’s death is important in the book, that’s for sure.

  18. Tania says:

    psgels : Well I don’t remember just everything but I would say that Gavroche hadn’t much people who cared about him. He was a street boy who was quite rejected from his family, his mother hated boys and contrary to the anime , he hadn’t known Cosette because he was just a baby when she was with the Thénardier and they had never become friends and hadn’t Chouchou to support them. So it’s much more sad for them both. I don’t remember anyone who would cared that much about Gavroche and certainly not Cosette. But his death is important in the book and quite a symbol of Revolution and people protest against starvation and poverty. So he fought for what he thought was right. And Javert is a determined and obsessed by the law man who would never accept the fact people could change and that’s what important in his death. I don’t how to put it. But to accept that would ruin all the concepts he lived for. He would rather die than admit Valjean’s change. He’s a cold man who fallows the law without taking into account his feelings or his heart. I wondered if he even had one . So, this change in his personnality even if it’s interesting in the anime could never have been possible the book. Even if both characters haven’t had friends ( or at least I don’t remember them to have some ) , I would say their deaths are quite as important in the book and I would say even more important because they’re symbols especially Gavroche. But you’re totally right! Mabeuf and Eponine’s deaths may be more important than the other too. Because those two characters were exeptionnal and I don’t know for you but when Eponine died my heart broke apart. I kept telling ” please don’t die! I don’t want you to die ! I care for you so much!” Maybe it sounds stupid but her death seemed so real! I even invented something about her. She survives because Mont Parnasse saved her. And I just kept telling myself it’s a character and not someone real but it didn’t help . I don’t remember to ever have felt this way while I was watching an anime. And I cried when Mabeuf died . That must be it . I’m pretty sure I wouldn’t have cried for Javert but even if I never liked Gavroche as much as I liked Eponine , I liked this character too so I would certainly be sad . It’s not like if I wanted him to die. But Gavroche’s death is important in the book, that’s for sure.

  19. angedemystere says:

    I think you are very right, Tania, in that Javert and Gavroche’s deaths, although not the type to make you cry (well, okay, they’re two of my favorite characters, so I probably would), they are strongly symbolic of the themes that Hugo was conveying through his novel: innocence and grace. What is really ironic about Gavroche’s death is that when he dies, he’s laughing. I forget exactly what this signifies, something about how even when innocence is destroyed, it gets the last laugh on this world of pain and suffering. I don’t know. As for Javert, his suicide is essentially the antithesis of Valjean’s reaction to the bishop’s act of mercy. Rather than give in to the power of kindness and forgiveness, Javert rejects Valjean’s gift of grace; he doesn’t know how to handle it. Although I must say, I think Hugo had it in for Javert from the start. He really did not like the police force and was using Javert as his allegorical representitive for this collective body. However, due to his (and I am using someone else’s words, can’t exactly remember whose) “great talent for characterization,” he ended up making Javert an intriguing character and not quite the cold-hearted, one-sided villain we initially are led to believe. And I suppose Hugo didn’t want to make the police force seem purely evil, just very insensitive to the sufferings of the poor and disadvantaged.

    All in all, though the concept of Javert not killing himself is extremely shocking, I am not quite ready to pass judgment on this series. The questions that are most important right now are: What is going to happen to Gavroche and Javert? Will we actually see Javert again, or is he gone for good? Will Gavroche stay with Marius and Cosette? Will he be reunited with his “boys”? Will he return to his former life as a street urchin? These are going to be crucial issues that I hope the creators will be able to resolve adequately. I’m keeping my fingers crossed . . .

  20. Irene says:

    And Javert is a determined and obsessed by the law man who would never accept the fact people could change and that’s what important in his death. I don’t how to put it. But to accept that would ruin all the concepts he lived for. He would rather die than admit Valjean’s change. He’s a cold man who fallows the law without taking into account his feelings or his heart. I wondered if he even had one.

    I beg to differ on this matter. Javert doesn’t kill himself because he can’t accept that Valjean has changed. Hugo himself says that Javert understands this, though he doesn’t come to that decision without a struggle. Javert kills himself because he realizes that he couldn’t possibly turn Valjean in – not after he’s come to realize all that Valjean has done – but, on the other hand, his moral code won’t allow him to simply let an escaped convict go free. For the first time, he’s confronted with a situation where doing what is right by the law would, in fact, be morally wrong. Simply rejecting the law is no easy matter for Javert; after all, these are the rules by which he’s lived for fifty years. Like angedemystere said, he can’t handle that – so he decides to remove himself from the problem.

    There’s another explanation for Javert’s suicide which I think is almost as valid – that he both accepts that Valjean has changed, and that the right thing to do is to let Valjean go. But, looking back on his past, he has to wonder how many other lives he’s ruined as a result of his misguided efforts to maintain order. Which isn’t to say that Javert’s an incompetent policeman in the slightest – quite the reverse, in fact, as intelligent, honest men are hard to come by in any profession – but he must have made a few mistakes of this caliber before. Fantine’s case, for example, comes to mind. We know from his behavior in M-sur-M that he’s as hard on himself as he is on everyone else – just look at his attempt to resign after he “mistakenly” suspects that Madeleine is Valjean – and, in his mind, that can’t go unpunished. But “How to resign from God?” he wonders, and he resigns from his post as inspector the only way he knows how.

    Either way you look at it, Javert doesn’t kill himself because he’s cold and heartless. Javert isn’t even cold and heartless in the book. Like angedemystere said, I’m sure Hugo might’ve meant him to be, but Hugo was simply too good a writer for that, and his “great talent for characterization” (was it AmZ who said that? or Sythar? I can’t quite recall either xD) transformed Javert into the snarky, talented man we see in the book. There’s the Javert Hugo tells us about, and then there’s the one Hugo shows, and frankly the one Hugo shows – which I’m far more inclined to accept as the “real” Javert – is anything but cold.

  21. angedemystere says:

    Ah, a fanfiction colleague! Yeah, I kinda thought it was one of those two authors. Was it Synthar who called them Poignant!Javert and True!Javert? I’ll have to check. You have hit the nail on the head, Irene. It is true that he tries to leave emotion outside his role as policeman, but it’s not because he’s cold-hearted, it’s because he believes that’s the best way to carry out his duty. Now, I know this is a weird place to mention it, but there’s this story called “Vendredi Bizarre” on fanfiction.net where Valjean and Javert switch bodies. Total crack fic, but surprisingly useful in showing how compassion and forgiveness can be a problem in law enforcement. At one point, Valjean (in Javert’s body) tries to arrest the Patron-Minette and fails miserably. XD It’s like they say, “Truer things have been said in jest.”

    Anyway, the reason Javert is my favorite character is that even though he appears to be one-dimensional, he’s actually a very complex character. There’s so much we don’t know about him and what it was in his past that made him the way he is. He’s not a hypocrite, either, which is why I’m worried that the creators will ruin Javert’s character in this anime by having him let Valjean go and be totally okay with it. If he’s not going to kill himself, they should AT LEAST have him resign from the force.

    I actually had the cute but incredibly unlikely and completely uncanon idea of Javert adopting Gavroche and his “boys,” making a sort of parallel with Valjean and Cosette. This would also resolve the problem of what will happen to these gamins once Gavroche recovers. Completely impossible, but so cute to think about.

  22. Tania says:

    angedemystere and Irene : Yes , I absolutely agree with you! By the way, when I mentioned concepts Javert lived for, what I meant was precisely his duty to the law and by ” cold ” I meant he blindly followed the law like you said for Fantine’s case ( for exemple ) without considering disadvantaged people. So by cold I didn’t meant bad. Actually, I don’t think we could ever say that one character is bad in the book. Life hasn’t been easy for all of them but they’re not bad themselves. Life made them what they are.

  23. Tania says:

    psgels , I wanted to thank you again for the blog you have created. It’s so great! Thanks to you I discovered anime I didn’t even heard of before , the best ones. So thanks again.
    By the way, I watched this episode again and I started to think it’s a really good one.

  24. Tania says:

    psgels , I wanted to thank you again for the blog you have created. It’s so great! Thanks to you I discovered anime I didn’t even heard of before , the best ones. So thanks again.
    By the way, I watched this episode again and I started to think it’s a really good one.

  25. angedemystere says:

    Actually, I don’t think we could ever say that one character is bad in the book. Life hasn’t been easy for all of them but they’re not bad themselves.

    Well, except Thenardier. ^^, I think he’s as close to “villain” as anyone gets in this book. But that doesn’t mean he’s not enjoyable to watch. I put Madame Thenardier as second-most villainous to her hubby because she genuinely loves her daughters. Thenardier’s motives are mostly self-centered (moreso later on when his family is dirt poor). So, yeah, there’s the whole nature vs. nurture issue going on there – to what degree can we blame people’s wickedness (strong word, I know, but sounds better than “badness”) on their personality, or their environment? No, no one is 100% evil, just as in real life, but there are certainly people who tend to lean to the dark side rather than the light.

    Well, I finally saw the trailer for the next episode. Is it just me, or was Javert’s name mentioned, like, three times? At least it looks like Gavvy’s all better.

  26. AmZ says:

    Confucius say: “I never said that.”

    :)

  27. angedemystere says:

    AH!! lol

    Well, I did get to see the episode, and my cerebral cortex exploded. At the part where Javert “saw the light,” I had a sudden flashback to Jim Carrey’s “How the Grinch Stole Christmas.” It was one of the most awkward things I have ever forced myself to watch. I tried to do it a second time, and I just couldn’t. The rest of the episode was fine, just not . . . that one little part. Oy. I think I would have enjoyed it more if I actually understood what was being said. Somebody has got to sub this episode!

  28. Sythar says:

    You know… I was just about to say that it wasn’t me either when I went and checked. Blow me down, but both quotes can be laid firmly at my door. Fancy that. ;-)

  29. angedemystere says:

    And we are eternally grateful for them. ^^

    BTW, I am grieved by the fact that no one’s posting here anymore. This was a lot of fun.

  30. Sieglinde says:

    WTF?

    Javert MUST die!

    Come on, people. In Japan, suicide is an accepted and admired thing… they are not f***in’ Catholics! Japanese kids hear the story of the 47 Ronins as an evening tale. So why the hell have they let Javert live?! This is just laughable.

  31. p51 mustang says:

    Tt is possible that Javert commits his suicide “off stage”, right?

  32. psgels psgels says:

    Unfortunately not: we see him at one of the later episodes.

  33. angedemystere says:

    And the last two episodes where he regains some of his badassness (in a good way). I still haven’t figured out why they took this route. Maybe because they really wanted Thenardier to be the ultimate villain and have Javert redeem himself like Valjean. BUT THAT’S NOT THE POINT OF HIS CHARACTER! As much as I love him.

    Irene: [i]There’s another explanation for Javert’s suicide which I think is almost as valid – that he both accepts that Valjean has changed, and that the right thing to do is to let Valjean go. But, looking back on his past, he has to wonder how many other lives he’s ruined as a result of his misguided efforts to maintain order. Which isn’t to say that Javert’s an incompetent policeman in the slightest – quite the reverse, in fact, as intelligent, honest men are hard to come by in any profession – but he must have made a few mistakes of this caliber before. Fantine’s case, for example, comes to mind.[/i]

    That seems to be the road the anime took with sorting out Javert’s motive for both wanting to commit suicide and for finally accepting mercy into his life. I don’t think he thinks of Fantine specifically during his mental maelstrom on the bridge in the book, but he does in the anime. He certainly acknowledges that Valjean is a good man now, which mainly causes his confusion. Someone had the English subbed episode on youtube at one point, but it has since been taken down. :(

Leave a Reply

CHANGE USERNAME
AidanAK47
@Anon, I actually liked that aspect. It made the history of the world feel real.
Anonymous1409027
It's compressible, as there are many episodes of buildup, but that's where so many of the interesting details and depth of planning become evident. Some of those episodes read like a history textbook though, so we'll see how the new adaptation handles them,
Anonymous1409027
*pleasantly
KTravlos
Tytania was ok.
Kaiser-Eoghan
On the Amakusa Shiro reference in the fate review, I've seen a film about him from the 50s , theres also an old josei manga where the protagonist ends up becoming essentially regarded as him.
KTravlos
Hi Kaiser. Supposedly this is a re-imagining of the original story. Thus independent of the OVAs (old serieis). What exactly re-imagining means is something I and you do not know. We shall see. But it does mean that you do not need to watch the old series to enjoy this one. The OVA was definetly more expansive than the novels. So my guess is they will stick to the novels.
Kaiser-Eoghan
There's another anime, called Tytania based on his novels but I haven't seen that series.
Kaiser-Eoghan
As in condensable in the way nothing much is lost? I assume there are fillers in the original?
Kaiser-Eoghan
I'm indifferent to the aesthetics of the new version. What I'm hoping for is that it will be accessible to newcomers and that I'll be able to jump on to the old series where the new one leaves off. I've seen very little of the original and it was a long time ago, is there any way the story is condensable?
KTravlos
The fact that they stayed away from the disgusting new manga is great. I am not too keen on the CGI ships, but they also did not rankle. It looks like it will honor the spirit of the old series, and I cannot ask for more. I am a massive LOGH fan. And the new video out gives me hope of revisiting one of the greatest sci-fi/historical settings out there. I am happy.
AidanAK47
I hope they are using the old anime as a base and not the new Manga adaption. As that Manga adaption is seriously lacking.
AidanAK47
@Anon, I like that they blinged up the space battles which is good because those things could get tiresome. But I really hate the design of Yang Wenli. They made him look so much younger and bishi. I don't think i could take this guy seriously if he started one of Wenli's signature hypothesis.
Anonymous1408919
Thoughts on that new LOGH PV? My expectations were low, so I'm presently surprised. Obviously they made everybody pretty boys, and Mamoro Miyano is voicing Reinhard I believe. But art and animation actually looks pretty decent overall. It's a PV, and LOGH's best quality is it's story and characters, so we'll have to see if they remain faithful or not. But it's nice to see it get a visual overhaul.
AidanAK47
By the way this site has the first chapters but check the other versions to find them.
http://mangapark.me/manga/tsurezure-children-wakabayashi-toshiya
AidanAK47
@Mario, Indeed. It's also a pity that over half the couples in the manga were not featured. We only got a small taste of Patricia.
SuperMario
Or maybe I'll try to read the manga. The last time I checked it online, the site doesn't have its first few chapters
SuperMario
@Aidan: man, Tsurezure Children sure is sweet. Really sad to see it ends
AidanAK47
So that's the end of Tsurezure Children.
....I'm gonna need a second season. Now.
....NOW GODDAMNIT! NOW!
KTravlos
As I said I understand the criticisms to RE:Creator, but ultimately I enjoyed most of the show. It could had been better, and it is a missed chance. But I have seen worse.
Kaiser-Eoghan
I gave up halfway through, there weren't even enough action scenes and those that were didn't justify waiting around for.
AidanAK47
Could have at least delivered on the action but that was rendered pointless due to the majority of the cast turning good and Altair being a complete cheat character.
AidanAK47
It would have been really fun to see characters discuss their stories with their creators or indulge in what our world has to offer but they really glossed over that part.
AidanAK47
It really should have gone deeper into the whole meta aspect introducing anime characters to the real world. Like they did with Mamika's powers being ridiculously destructive when outside a kid friendly setting.
AidanAK47
@Puran, I at least like the message of the final episode. But as for the show itself it was just missed potential on a lot of levels. I wanted Anime Genre battle royale and instead got a secondhand Shirobako with a crap shounen anime attached.
Kaiser-Eoghan
I have been forgiving of Anno as I've gotten older.
Kaiser-Eoghan
I also just re-watched gunbuster, I'd previously dismissed the ova after a few episodes when I was a teenager, I'd found it too slow, didn't have that issue with the 90 minute version I just finished. I've never see the sequels.
Lenlo
Ill have to finish Creators... at some point
Kaiser-Eoghan
I've been dipping back into the Lupin franchise, Gold of babylon was particularly screwball, kind of ridiculous comedy caper/adventure thing you just have to run with....turns out it was directed by a live action filmaker I especially like who made bizzare noir films in the 60s.
Puran
So that explains why Meteora had so much air time in Re:Creators. It's her story....

I hated the ending and I disliked the anime overall.
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Mario: It was a genuine surprise to see that Assayas decided to make a film framed around hentai =P
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Mario: I loved how incoherent demonlover was.
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Mario: The criticisms I'll give wind river, is a slight inconsistent performance from Renner and that very awkwardly inserted flashback scene.
SuperMario
@Kaiser: on Wind River, I agree it's a well-executed case of the week drama, although there are some plot pregressions that I don't get (how did they find out about the man's corspe again?). About Demonlover, man, the film gives me a chill down my spine. Heartless. And a bit misogynist.
SuperMario
@Kaiser: as much as I loved Wong (yeah I too prefer him over Malick), sometimes I do think Western cinema give him too much praise that sadly overshadow other Asian directors.
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Mario: Wong is important to me as a hong-kong filmaker, he offers something entirely different from the whole Woo/Lam Hong komg movies.
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Mario: On a more positive note Maggie Cheung did mention that she felt her early work with Wong was when she first truly became a proper actress.
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Mario: ....I had no idea he had such a sad background.
Kaiser-Eoghan
*investigation drama
SuperMario
@Kaiser: that film also marked/ signified a rather sad period of Hongkong showbiz. Leslie Cheung badically lived the live of the protagonist and commited suicide in 1997. His girlfriend on screen, during the filming, was kidnaped, raped and taken topless picture. The damnest thing is that everyone knowed the culprit but did nothing, and in the press it was just deemed as "kipnapped and assaulted"
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Mario: Wind river was a big surprise for me, just goes to show that with the right execution an ordinary police drama movie can be elevated higher.
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Mario: Thats the interesting thing, tracking a directors career.
Kaiser-Eoghan
Just binge watched the new dominion tank police ovas , admittedly these are kind of reptitive and extremely silly but its hard to hate on something so shamelessly fun that made me feel like a child again.
SuperMario
@Kaiser: you said it there. DoBW is rather raw and unpolished but that's one of the reason why I am drawn to it more compare to his other works.
AidanAK47
In all honesty, it would be nice to finally see a continuation after fusion as all games after that have just been adding chapters in-between.
Vonter
Finally I wonder, if Metroid Prime 4 will definitely branch out of the main Metroid's continuity. It's curious how an interquel subseries is still going to add things in between the first and the second entries in the main franchise.
Vonter
AidanAK47 - I think is nice we can see both takes. Especially since neither one despite a few qualms are still very solid entries for this franchise. I just hope Metroid moves forward, as IMO this is the only game that really needed a facelift do to the heavy limitations of the gameboy. And I hope the secret gallery at the end is teasing how the producer plans to move the plot forward.
AidanAK47
I thought it might be like that but it's good to know they are at least on a close level. I didn't really want Samus Returns to replace AM2R as the "Definitive" version of Metroid 2. Mostly because a lot of love was put into AM2R andit came at a point when it felt Nintendo didn't give a crap about Metroid.
Vonter
Like Zero Mission there's something added to Samus Returns but I'll just leave it at that.
Vonter
I think both have strong points. Samus Returns have better boss battles, gameplay mechanics and more intense action pieces. AM2R IMO has more atmosphere, takes advantage of elements Nintendo don't even try like the Federation subplot, and the ending portion narratively has more heart in AM2R, while in Samus Returns it feels mostly like "the final level".
Vonter
I also did got lost a couple of times in Samus Returns and aside from the big water section in AM2R, the latter is more linear game.
Vonter
I think the controls in Samus Returns bring more to the table though. The 360 aiming makes for better ways to shoot enemies and some of the bosses take advantage of that. If it weren't for the 3DS giving hand cramps because you're holding L and R at several points it'll be completely the most ideal way to play.
Vonter
AidanAK47 - AM2R is very good, I think it has the advantage that because it uses sprites IMO backgrounds and enemies are more vibrant and easier to appreciate. The Federation soldiers are better executed in AM2R and that secret section with the ship is very eery.
AidanAK47
@Vonter, How does it stack up to AM2R? I bought it and am still waiting on it to be delivered but I have the feeling that AM2R would be the better game when comparing.
Vonter
I took me 12 hours to 100% and I've heard the best ending is beating it in less than 4 hours. I think unlike Zero Mission item percentage don't matter, it's mainly to unlock an art gallery.
Vonter
My main criticism is this being a 3DS game. Small enemies can be hard to see or appreciate. And I think the 3DS wasn't made for heavy action packed games like this or Smash Bros. I got the rubber from the circle pad come off in two occasions. Also unless there was something big in the background, several areas felt lacking in detail. Still Samus and the bosses look good.
Vonter
In terms of difficulty, the game has the enemies packing more damage than in other 2D Metroids. Is difficult in the sense than you can't tank damage as in other iterations, you have to be aware of enemy behavior and bosses mainly get easier do to familiarizing with their patterns, since I did die a lot each time I faced a new boss. And got used to kill them faster as I went along.
Vonter
Ok, so I beat Samus Returns. It's quite good. Unlike Fusion that had dialogue at midst the gameplay. Samus Returns only has a prologue of exposition and any cutscenes mainly accentuate the reactions of Samus confronting a new enemy. The level design is dense, despite having isolated areas like in Fusion and the original Samus Returns, each area is very mazelike.
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Mario: =< Awww I kind of like demonlover actually despite all its flaws, it had great sound design and had this cold, clinical, un-nerving mood to it.
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Mario: Days of being wild does feel a bit un-realized/un-polished/rough compared to his other work definitely but its probably the rawest I've seen from him and that has its appeal.
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Mario: Haven't seen farewell my concubine come to think of it. Regarding the scifi element I felt I embraced it more further into the film when it started to intermingle more.
While I am more forgiving toward Malick's recent films than most, that decline in quality means I have to pick Wong.
KTravlos
by the way in RE:Creators we probably will be getting a future series focusing on the hunt for Magane :p Meteora probably playing the role of detective. I also bet her novel will be wordy and heavy in exposition :p
KTravlos
i.e his end game might had been a cross-species revolution against him anyway. We will see
KTravlos
In Bahamut Chris proves to not be totally evil, but he is totally crazy. That said I am seeing one of my hunches getting supported, the hunch was that his cruelty towards daemons was with the purpose of bringing them down enough that they would be willing to work with humans as euals (As they are in Jean's army) and thus via that create a more unified world. I
KTravlos
RE: Creators has come to its end. I know the problems everyone has with it, and while it failed to raise to the level of exceptional show, I loved it. As I said, it had been years since a show kept me so excited episode after episode. They blew it at some point, but ultimately for me this is an en-joyful show, and one I would happily binge watch in the future again.
SuperMario
@Kaiser: question for you though, between these two directors, which one do you prefer: Wong Kar-Wai or Terrance Malick?
SuperMario
@Kaiser: if you enjoyed both 2046 and In the Mood for Love, by all mean check out Days of Being Wild. The trio forms a loose trilogy and Days of Being Wild was the first film that Wong began his unique unconventional style. It's one of my personal favorite of Wong and it's a chance for you to watch the late Leslie Cheung acted (you might watch him already in Farewell My Concubine)
SuperMario
@Kaiser: 2046 is indeed a passionate film, and one of his best looking film. He tried something different in 2046 too, experimented with scifi (one of the best part in the film for me)
SuperMario
@Kaiser: it's stritcly Wong Kar Wai's romance we're talking about, since I don't find the rest of Chinese take on romance that interesting. Romance or melodrama is one of his main theme throughout his career
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Mario: It was slightly overly long however.
I've also seen chungking express, in the mood for love and fallen angels. I think this Chinese take on romance is really clicking with me.
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Mario: I also thought it was a very passionette film and I love how Kar-wong-wai uses the music in it. I also think its one of his best looking films.
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Mario: I had a look at that Chinese film 2046, very effectively melancholic take on fleeting relationships while also successfully being quite sensual while staying classy and without ever showing too much. Tony Leung and Maggie Cheung are two beautiful people =P
SuperMario
for those who still want to catch up with 18if, episode 11 has a huge recap, while wrapping up the show with a new overarching plot. Hopefully they don't pull another Matrix here
SuperWooper
It's shounen-y for sure. The competitions have been my least favorite parts of the show so far. If you're still watching, you might appreciate it more once the Tenpei Cup is over.
Anonymous1399692
Damn Ballroom looks so good. But I really can't enjoy it despite that I want to. It has too many of these typical shounen moments and plot points I can't stand.
Anonymous1399684
Omae wa mou shindeiru
Lenlo
Mononoke is actually what made me find Ayakashi. Also a good show.
SuperMario
Regarding Ayakashi, I only watched the Mononoke segment
SuperMario
"It was a long, long trip, and we're coming finally to the end of the journey. Thank you, Manoyama and Chupacabra. And thank you, 5 EURO" - Sandal-san.
Lenlo
Ayakashi was great for me Kaiser. I enjoyed my time with it
Vonter212
@AidanAK47 - The hard aspect has been commented in several reviews with bosses being able to easily kill you. (Although in my experience it might be just getting a pattern). In terms of length most 2D games can be beaten under 3 hours. This one seems to clock at at least 6 to 15 if you want to collect everything. Then again, we'll see in subsequent playthroughs.
AidanAK47
`@Vonter. It's out now but I don't remember seeing anyone claim it's the longest hardest entry 2D wise.
Kaiser-Eoghan
Going to watch new dominion tank police next and read violence action and Oddman 11.
Kaiser-Eoghan
It took me years to get round to it, but I finally watched Ayakashi and as expected like most anthologies, again its mixed, the first is a solid ghost story that improves after a weak start, but that third one with the cat spirit was great, really liked how experimental that looked.
Vonter
Soo a new Metroid comes out this week. It is said, it's the longest, hardest entry in regards to the 2D iterations. Still not as great as Super, and depending on your fanaticism it might or not be as good as Zero Mission.
SuperMario
But they didn't pull that scene off too well. It's just... unmemorable. In fact the whole show is very unremarkable. Now only 1 episode left I might as well finish it but I won't give it a full review
SuperMario
Koi to Uso has been disappointing so far. Episode 10 featured the sequence that i was looking forward the most in the manga: the former classmate tells the one sided crush of the main girl from her POV. For a romance that contrived and manipulated like this one, hearing this from the third person's perspective prove to be more powerful
Vonter
@HelghastKillzone - Good luck with that. I almost had my car's engine damaged since it has been raining heavily where I live. Had to ask for help the next day to pull it out of mud. Still not as bad as the other three cars that did get stuck in the water.
HelghastKillzone
Dealing with work and the total loss of my car really sucks at the moment so I'm quite tied up for this week.
KTravlos
I do agree to a point, but to be frank all the episodes of Princess Principal to date have been so solid I have a hard time deciding. Episode 5 though was still the best from a holistic point (action, direction, music etc) was the one introducing Chise
SuperMario
Agree. Dorothy has the biggest heart out of all the spy girls. Also "help" that her episodes are all melodramatic.
Amagi
This episode of PrinPrin showed again that Dorothy is the best character by far. Not just herself but her episodes as well are better written than the rest if you ask me.
KTravlos
It just hit me. The characters in Princess Principal may be very well working for IngSoc :p
AidanAK47
@Kaiser, in the seven chapters it's only really two of them that contain dark shocking content. Chapter three being the biggest one in that regard.
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Aidan: I read a comment where someone said subahibi shocked them more than saya no uta. While I haven't played it yet, I have seen some of a letsplay...it lleft me thinking....how many hours until this actually gets good/truly unhinged .
AidanAK47
After Reading SubaHibi, Made in Abyss's dark turn didn't shock me too much. Maybe I just got desensitised. I will have a review of SubaHibi hopefully up in a week though to clarify my feelings on it after just finishing it, It was interesting but disappointing.
KTravlos
well, well. Both Made in the Abyss and Virgin Soul do not hold back. Grim! RE:Creators is warping up. Comparing with these other shows I can fully appreciate the problems people have with it. But still I am glad I am sticking to the end. Altair's voice actor by the way did great.
AidanAK47
@Helghast, And Kings Field was the Demon Souls before Demon Souls came out.
KTravlos
having binge watched several of this season's shows I would say Princess Principal is the most rounded. Made in Abyss is good. Kakegurui and The Reflection as SuperMario said will depend on your tastes. There is also Shouko no Altair. You will like it if you liked Tanya Saga of Evil, or Legend of Galactic Heroes, or Arslan Senki or manga like Vinland Saga, Gunka no Baltzar, and especially Historie
Anonymous1385641
Jesus...me watching this weeks Made in Abyss https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ogzsWhZcmM
HelghastKillzone
So... Demon Souls was the Dark Souls before Dark Souls came out.
SuperMario
@anon1385426: the safest bets aside from Made in Abyss are Welcome to the Ballroom and Princess Principal. Kakegurui and the Refection are for more acqurired taste
Anonymous1385426
Aside from Made in Abyss, what's the best anime this season?
Lenlo
@KT, the pacing and the framerate early on are my two biggest issues. Later on the story starts to get abit more engaging, and they start doin things I didnt expect, but the pacing is still there. Some akward pauses.
Lenlo
Look, Berserk and Dark Souls are both amazing. But I only have 3 Dark Souls games, and 38 Berserk volumes. Im clearly biased
KTravlos
I sat down and watched the first 4 episodes of The Reflection. It is an interesting attempt, and I can see the people making it having fun doing so. But I did notice a pacing issue. For some reason the episodes felt like they dragged a bit too long.
AidanAK47
Dark Souls is the Berserk of Video Games.
Amagi
Dark Souls really went all Berserk if you ask me
AidanAK47
I am not one for putting down law but can we never ever compare anything to Dark Souls ever again? Cause it's actually become really tiresome how everything is the dark souls of something.
Lenlo
No other sentence has made me want to watch Made in Abyss more
HelghastKillzone
I guess we're finally at the point where Made in Abyss goes all Dark Souls/Bloodborne.
Amagi
Apo's Jack the Ripper had at least a nice idea behind it, it's just the clothes that are a bad choice. But there are just too many lolis for the sake of fanservice in that game. I accept it if there is at least a reason for this but it's usually just random.
Amagi
@Aidan: Same here. I was never a fan of genderbendings and turning historical people into lolis. The first one I can accept with people like Arthuria because it added a lot to her character, but most of them are just plain and generic. I just see no reason why pirates, grown up men or Blavatsky would ever appear as little girls. Especially since popular beliefs should influence their appearance.
SuperMario
On Altair, one commenter did an excellent job of poiting out the appeal of that show; and frankly the show is wearing on me now.
SuperMario
@Travlos: I'm glad you enjoy Princess Principal. I'm quite surprised myself that in the latter half the show slowed its pace down which mean the focus is switched from action to more characters interactions; which I greatly enjoy
KTravlos
Well I binge watched Princess Principal. That is a very good show. I was surprised. Good animation, good music, the art is good, hell I even did not mind the protagonist art. But what I really like is the stories. All the episode were pretty solid and interesting.
AidanAK47
Just won a fight by the skin of my teeth thanks to my Lancer, Cu Chulainn. You the man Cu!
AidanAK47
@Amagi, Been playing Grand Order myself. It's rather fun. There are some good original character in it but I notice with Quantity certain figures designs were pretty terrible. I thought Assassins of black was the worst but some Grand Order servents manage to top it in terrible. Why all the bikini's?
Amagi
Fate/GO has quite some interesting original characters there. Wish we'd see them in some actual manga or anime series with more backstory someday. - I also like that we finally have an overpowered, interesting and competent Hassan with King Hassan for once. His design is metal AF too.
KTravlos
Binge watched Altair. The pacing of the show is a problem, but in general the raw material is good. Altair is sympathetic, and the world is interesting. But I do feel this is the kind of show that would had gained by a Monster or LOGH type treatment. Also, man it is scary how accurate they got some of the traits of Greeks (Phoenicians in the show). I am a Greek, I should know! :p
KTravlos
forgot to mention. I saw the 91 Days special. Three side stories that give some depth to the events in the main anime, but nothing that goes beyond it's end. Still they were in general ok to good.
SuperWooper
It's got Jude Law playing "this kind of huge robot butler called Charles, who is also a rocket ship." What could possibly go wrong?
AidanAK47
Anime with Jaden Smith? Um..I don't know about this.
SuperMario
@Kaiser: one of the good thing about SoL shows like Centaur and even 18if is that their episodes are self-contained, so you can just jump right in to watch the good ones and ignore the rest
SuperMario
I just love Chise's presence so I might enjoy the last episode more than anyone else. But yeah I'm quite satisfied with Princess Principal right now
AidanAK47
Actually I am quite surprised Princess Principal hasn't gone off the rails yet. Might even turn out to be a fun show in the end. If the man can make it to the finish line without a misstep.
AidanAK47
Hey I am having fun with my Shows. Made in Abyss is still quite excellent and Fate/Apoc is picking up. Even started playing Fate/Grand Order.
Lenlo
Man, sounds like I was the only one to have a good week with their show. Reflection really stepped it up this week in pretty much every category. Not sure it will last, but hey. Ill take one
Kaiser-Eoghan
I'm so disappointed in 18...if. Perfect opportunity to capitalize on something with a dreamlike feel to it and be creative only it ends up getting held back.
Kaiser-Eoghan
And I see Vonter and Mario are seducing me into watching Centaur.
Kaiser-Eoghan
*can't
Kaiser-Eoghan
I can'y see myself giving re creators a second chance, and from skimming these conversations, why should the show only get going at the end? It just sounds like too little too late.
AidanAK47
Honestly that's what Re:Creators biggest issue is. It builds up these great interesting idea's and then refuses to capitalize on them.
AidanAK47
Then it would be a battle to win over the audience and he who entertains them the most would get the most power. Just think of how many interesting ways that would take the fight. Like Altair could lose power and have to win over the crowd with her backstory and theatrics. A hero could purposefully get beaten to hell just so they can get a powerup from saying a boastful speech about kicking ass.
AidanAK47
@Anon, Exactly. Now there is an interesting fighting element. Imagine if both Altair and the heroes had to fight with the limitation of keeping the audience entertained. Altair couldn't pull out overpowered nonsense because the audience wouldn't approve and her power would drop. Same goes for the heroes.
Anonymous1378112
On the other hand I am not a fan of this whole final arc. It's just not believable to me to gather such a big audience who will do nothing but watch and accept everything you show them. Not to mention that the show is technically live acting to them. Considering how much anime fanbases already hate the DN movie and stuff I doubt many would sit there and accept that
Anonymous1378112
@Aidan: This made me pretty angry. like, they wasted a ton of screentime with these boring info dumps and now they're just irrelevant and the enemy just fucks over it
AidanAK47
Actually the last development was actually a screw the rules moment as well. So the only way to beat Altair is to just chuck aside the rules established with the last 20 episodes.
AidanAK47
You don't need to give Altair a creator in order to to limit her. You just need her to obey the rules the entire series has spent time setting up. Altairs actions are just handwaved with "Screw the rules! I am a OC" audence acceptance doesn't seem to make a difference.
AidanAK47
@KTravlos, The creators have incredibly limited power as while they can introduce anything, it won't be effective unless the audience approves of it. Altair can pull whatever she wants without limit. If anything I don't understand why the audence isn't shouting for her to get nerfed seeing as some random indie character is wrecking fan favourite characters.
Vonter212
@SuperMario - Centaur Worries is the equivalent of Every Flavour Beans. You don't know what you're gonna get, bad, good, cringe, cool, deep, superficial, etc. While the gore isn't that graphic, it is still violent for this kind of show and the alien part has some disturbing body horror, for this show. The shock is mainly because of how light hearted everything else is.
SuperMario
I just watched Centaur, it was heavy as hell, but really poetic in tying these 2 half episodes together. God, it's excellent. And I don't mid the show's constant tonal shifts at all
KTravlos
@Aidan I have to disagree with you. Altair's overpowering does not bother me too much. a) If you think about it, it is their only choice, as creators also have immense power. There only other option would be to give Altair her own Creator, but that would turn this to just a Fate copy. So I am ok with what they have done. b) they do explain it world-wise so it does not come out of the blue
KTravlos
A nice overview of the alternative history genre, but more importantly the work of Kawaguchi http://www.animenewsnetwork.cc/the-mike-toole-show/2017-09-04/.120893
SuperMario
@Vonter: the manga has gore and alien? Really? Now that's interesting
SuperMario
... genre often does. For me its unfocusness works for its benefit. We don't know for sure what we gets each time and that's the main reason I still looking forwards to it every week
SuperMario
@Vonter: I haven't caught up with Centaur's this week but I heard it tackles Holocaust so I'm all in. It's not something cute girl
Vonter
Wow, Centaur Worries, took some really heavy themes this episode. The softy in me, found them powerful, but the cynic in me thinks it might have been a touch manipulative, since this show has interesting ideas, but lacks focus. One episode is cute, another progressive, another ecchi, and another the holocaust. Makes me wonder if they'll show the gore and the aliens from the manga.
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(Note: Since psgels didn’t give his final review to the first season, this review is for the entirety of Eccentric Family. If I had to grade the second season alone, it’s 90/100). Doesn’t matter how you look at it, the Eccentric Family is a unique show, in a way it feels and tastes like no […]

Little Witch Academia TV Review – 80/100

The Little Witch Academia series has been something that’s a long time coming. Ever since Studio Trigger made the original Anime OVA back in 2013 I have been hotly anticipating the time when it would be fleshed out into it’s own anime series. I love both the original OVA and the enchanted Parade so this […]

Window Horses (2016) Movie Review – 87/100

In Window Horses, or its full name Window Horses – The Poetic Persian Epiphany of Rosie Ming, many characters keep asking the main protagonist, a Stick Girl in an otherwise fully formed character designs, why is she wearing a chador, in which she’s unable to reply. It’s her first trip to go overseas, so she […]

Kobayashi-san chi no Maid Dragon (Winter 2017) Review – 74/100

I remember back in the first impression of last Winter season, I regarded Demi-chan as a better Monster Girls slice of life subgenre over this one. But as the season progressed, while Demi-chan run out of its steam quickly, this one picked up its pace after an underwhelming first episode to become a much more […]