Posted by psgels on 31 December 2008 with categories: Anime Reviews, Mouryou no Hako


The past fall season aired a lot of good and great series, but none of them was as good as this series: Mouryou no Hako, Madhouse’s latest masterpiece. This is one series that did just about everything right. Obviously it’s not for those who don’t like people talking over and over again, but it’s perfect for those who are looking for mature and complex anime. This is how mystery should be done!

I honestly can’t recall any other anime apart from a Mamoru Oshii-production that puts more emphasis on talking as this one. The series follows a string of bizarre murders, and the people who try to solve it. This whole mystery is multi-layered, it’s full of flashbacks and references, you’ll never know when something that passes the screen is important for the future. There are lots of scenes that don’t necessarily have any direct meaning, but instead are there to flesh out the setting or throw the viewer on a side-track, and yet the series itself never loses track of its goals, and everything comes together in the end in one of the best endings I’ve seen.

Another big selling-point of the series is its cast of characters. They hardly get as much screen time or background as your average anime, and yet they’re utterly amazing. The animation knows exactly what it needs to do to show their subtle movements and gestures in order to flesh them out while many other things happen, and the background that’s there is meaningful and has a huge impact. Every character has his or her own distinctive presence, with the best ones being Kanako and Akihiko, both for very, very different reasons. The entire cast is colourful and a delight to watch, despite the huge amounts of talking within this series.

Also, if you thought that shows as Code Geass is disturbing, then you haven’t seen anything yet. I refuse to spoil anything here, but like a few other Madhouse productions, this series breaks taboo after taboo. This is nothing near your average tame detective story.

Then the visuals: they look utterly incredible. Especially in the beginning episodes and episodes, the characters all look crisp and very detailed. The animators throw the most beautiful shots and visual effects at the viewer. Combine that with an awesome soundtrack, and you’ve got some amazing production values.

The only possible turn-off is, like mentioned above, the large amounts of talking: if you don’t like it, then it’s going to be hard to enjoy this series. There are two particular consecutive episodes, where nothing else happens apart from three guys, sitting in a room and talking to each other. This anime isn’t afraid to take risks, even though it might turn off some people.

So overall, this has been an amazing series. The script is fresh and creative and has a huge impact. There’s a lot of symbolism, both visual and in the storyline, and an excellent recommendation for those who look for a short mature series. The storytelling is strong yet subtle, and it’s yet another masterpiece by Madhouse.

Storytelling: 10/10
Characters: 9/10
Production-Values: 9/10
Setting: 9/10

22 Responses

  1. supertauren says:

    I WILL WATCH THIS SHOW!

  2. L.A says:

    I thought…

    The stroy was okay,
    Characters were really mediocire,
    and Animation was fantastic

    If you like this kind of detective or the mystery series, I recommend you to watch Ghost in the Shell SAC.

  3. Windspirit says:

    “Also, if you thought that shows as Code Geass is disturbing”
    >> LOL.

  4. zakuro says:

    I wholeheartedly agree with you! The best of 2008! (If ‘Shinrei-Gari/Ghost Hound’ ended early in 2008 counted as a candidate, I’d put this one as the second… but I think GH should be considered 2007.)
    Actually the ‘only talking, nothing happening’ episodes 6th & 7th were the ones completely blown my mind! The camera work (well, can I say ‘camera work’ in animation? I believe so!) in the two eps were extraordinary! I’m so hoping Aero will stick to work on ep. 7 & beyond.

  5. PJ says:

    I watched the first two episodes and I thought the show did a poor job of making the story “digestable”. The girl got pushed into the path of the train, there’s a box of limbs (near the same place she was transferred to since I remember the people driving to check it out and then ran into the hospital), the box in the head, etc. It seems like every element is sort of nonsensical, there’s no sequence and everything’s “just there.” I know the point of the show is to reveal the connections, but when you throw too many characters, things happening and scene changes with different characters – it just becomes extremely annoying. I didn’t watch far enough, but I read on a summary that the girl who got pushed also lost her limbs? I mean, you might as well summarize the story randomly: a dog sneezed on a butterfly and that caused a girl to lose her eye, which was found by a man who turned into the serial killer.

  6. Requiem says:

    I’ve been wanting to watch this series since it was announced but sadly there are no subs for it.

  7. Koh-san says:

    As a followup to my comment for episode 13, I re-watched some parts, and it’s becoming clearer. Reading the English wiki entry for the author Natsuhiko Kyougoku, with its bit about the tsukimono-otoshi, indicates to me that this story strikes a delicate balance. There’s just a slight bit of science fiction in the form of advanced medical technology, and an extensive grounding of supernatural lore, but the story itself is an elaborate, fact-based, detective story. All the talk of spirits by Kyougokudou is to be taken primarily as a metaphor for human psychology. The irony is that Kyougokudou sees himself more as an exorcist than a detective. Yet his brilliant mind sees the connections with the clarity of the best of the empiricists. I’m going to need to watch this again. All the clues are in the show, probably. It’s just not spoon-fed to the audience in a simple-to-digest summary at the end. Also, his sister Atsuko does a lot of legwork for him. His friends Kiba, Sekiguchi, and Aoki also feed him information. He doesn’t divine things in a vacuum.

  8. zakuro says:

    Actually, ‘ve posted a few long comments, and others are posting interesting ones at this blog.
    Be warned: ‘spoilers’ included in the comments there!

  9. chanpon says:

    Just finished this series (with the last 7, subless) and I was blown away. I’m dying to get subs for the last half so I can re-watch and catch all the little details I missed, and I stumbled onto your blog looking to fill in some gaps in what I could make out.

    I wholeheartedly agree with you! What a fantastic story – it certainly makes the audience work and think, and I love it. A complex and provocative mystery with a fascinating cast of characters. I appreciate that you can’t watch 2 episodes and label everyone that appears; they’re actually multi-dimensional vs. one-note stereotypes. Loved the atmoshere that was part melancholy, nostalgia and old-fashioned horror rolled into one. I bought the OST to this and highly recommend it, if you liked the music to this show.

  10. zir says:

    Can you upload the ost?

  11. Mark says:

    Ghost Hound was shit, IMO. It offered some promise in the beginning and then totall fell flat on it’s face by the end. I went from intrigue to total disgust and disappointment in a matter of moments. It’s not deserving of any award, except perhaps “Most glaring failure to deliver on it’s promise (of 2007)”

    Mouryou, I agree, seems quite awesome, so far. I’m only on episode 7 so I’m only a bit past the halfway point (due to fansubbing progress) but it seems to be a pretty multi-layered mystery, which I always like. The supernatural and mythological/occult elements also raise interest levels.

    Though I didn’t understand many of the cultural allusions made in those two ‘talking’ episodes, by the second one I was beginning to grasp what they’re getting at, and I can pretty much say my mind = blown.

    The symbolism and the whole mouryou figures as things existing on borders, etc, and the whole box thing is really beginning to make my mind question wtf is going on. I’m coming to expect a lot from this series (so far the only fall 2008 show I find myself caring about) I just hope it manages to deliver in the end, unlike Ghost Hound.

  12. zir says:

    I think Ghost Hound was good, but the ending was kinda dissapointing.

  13. kiyosuke says:

    i have to say i wish that a) i knew japanese or b) subs would come out with episodes past 8. i may have not looked hard enough but i couldnt find subbed eps so i just watched a few raw and finished it by reading these reviews. i really liked this anime and wish i could have finished watching it subbed. it really takes a lot out and by reading these reviews it makes me want to watch it more, reading how good the ending sounded. i guess ill just unfortunately have to wait but until then ill try watching the rest of the eps raw~ thx for the reviews :]

  14. Solaris says:

    So no subs since January… Isn’t this one of the best 2008 series? What else are subbers subbing? Damn!!

  15. Shinkun says:

    It is extremely difficult to translate! :(

  16. specracer says:

    Sweet now that the subs are almost done I can pick it back up

  17. windy says:

    Well, personally I found this series both amazing and way too difficult to understand the whole plot even now that I watched it with subtitles! Too many characters involved, too many diverging facts and occurances, actually I don’t think I got it all right, was it really Yoriko who pushed Kanako, then she IS the “first culprit” isn’t it? Why, because she believed in afterdeath and found out her friend wasn’t “perfect”?! I believe the logic here is particularly twisted. There are a lot of questions unresolved here and there which really disturbs me. Why Kanako ever told Yoriko ” she was her and all that incredible stuff” is still a big mystery for me. Then okay, Amemiya ( at least I managed to get that he had a crush on Kanako, why? Did he fall in love with her while he was raising her along with Youko?! Kinda hard to swallow, all this!) turned out to be behind the abduction of Kanako ( at least of her head)and Youko’s father behind all the other murders, yet again can’t be sure of that one! Then Kiba, or whatever, the one who was thought to be the culprit and who was discovered dead and dismembered, what was his part in it, he killed Yoriko, why the hell ( did he read about her friendship with Kanako in the newspapers, at least I don’t see how else, whi did he accost her and why was she on the list of ” people to be killed”? Did he thought that he may recreate the same “masterpiece” with her head as it was done with the head of Kanako by Amemiya?! And when he went all berserk after seeing Kanako’s shot at the restaurant, it was because he remembered having seen her head “inboxed” in the train?! With all this, I wasn’t able to enjoy this at the fullest, way too confusing and tangled. But nevertheless , it’s still a memorable series for me, really if only they had taken more time to explain all the dubious situations we were put into and had extended this series to at least 26 episodes, that would have been the right choice, because the pace would have been slowed down which would enable us to “follow the tracks” and not to be blown astray on the way! But, yeah, taken that aside, a gorgeous series with lots of creativity and brilliant thoughtfulness behind.

  18. midenz says:

    It was such an amazing series, at first it felt boring, but I’m glad I picked it back up! It’s amazing in every way! Oh did you watch episode 14? I was just wondering since you didn’t have it blogged

  19. mdv says:

    midenz…
    dude… there’s only 13 episodes.

  20. mdv says:

    nvm… it’s a Special…

  21. Fai says:

    So I finally re-watched this series 3 years later (marathon), and not only am I completely blown away, but I also think this has been perhaps one of the most solid story I’ve watched in the past year.

    To anyone who still has questions remaining, I would probably recommend to watch the series again as well as most of your questions have been answered.

    SPOILERS SPOILERS
    To answer some of Windy’s questions:
    – Yes. Amemiya did “kidnap” Kanako because he was obsessed with her
    – No. Kanako’s father was not the one who killed the other women. That was Kubo. He became envious of Kanako’s head in the box and wished to recreate that, not realizing that it would take some really heavy scientific technology.
    – Youko was killed because she was next on list of followers who believed in Kubo’s father (the priest). Although she didn’t follow the cult, her mother did, and once her mother was unable to pay her dues, she was targeted. The list was written in alphabetical order. Although now that it’s mentioned, I wonder how Kubo knew that Youko was friends with Kanako.
    – and yes. I think that’s why he went berserk.
    END SPOILERS

    As psgels has noted earlier, a lot of the things that develop in this series is quite subtle, and that’s what I love about it. The great thing about Mouryou no Hako is that it trusts the reader to fill up the rest of the storyline instead of spoon-feeding us every single message.

  22. GravityBomb says:

    As much as I normally agree with you, I have to argue with you on this one. I don’t really think that this series was 92.5 worthy. (Now don’t be hating guys, I’ll give my reasons :)). Maybe like 75 or so, but not as high. (And I know this is from 2008, but my anime club just watched it this fall semester.)

    To me, this is a series that demonstrates bad anime direction or choice of material to adapt. While I’m not saying that they should’ve spoon-fed us the story or what have you, but even to me, who loves talky shows a lot, this was just a lot of talking heads 70% of the time and suffered from massive ‘Take Our Word For It’. I mean, when you sit down and think about it, the story alone is amazing. No lie there. But the way that it was handled was just batshit insane. Characters that just kind of drop in out of nowhere and then just disappear from the show or return in random spots. The imagery seeming to try and replicate Utena’s weird symbolism. But what drove me nuts was the two episodes dedicated to exposition dropping all about the mouryou, at which point I actually stopped reading the subs and started spacing out. And while the ending episodes were really the better ones, when you info dump about the whole plot in 23 or so minutes while having barely resolved any of the more important aspects beforehand or resolving things that no one really cared for, it says a lot. To me, when that happens, you did something wrong.

    I say this a lot to people, but in this case I think it’s totally justified: this should have been a 26 episode series, and even if it didn’t want to be that long, a few more episodes would have helped a lot (I know that’s not possible, but one can dream). Or, if nothing else, some parts should have been narrowed down and others expanded upon to flesh out the story and motivations more. It just seems like the staff had no idea what part of the story to focus on. It starts out with the whole creepy science building thing, then just whips around to the cult, then u-turns right back to the ‘hospital’ after leaving it out for around 6+ episodes. While I get that adapting a novel that was very detailed (I’m told) can be challenging, there are better ways to adapt a story and this just kinda falls flat.

    While this is a very interesting show and the story is great when you piece everything together, Ryosuke Nakamura (who isn’t a bad director) just kinda fumbled with it. I’ve actually noticed that no one who worked on this series is bad at what they do, it’s just that this series is what I would consider one of their weakest.

    Again, I’m not ragging on anyone who liked the show. Far from it. :) I love the character designs and the show is beautifully animated. It did a great job at creeping me the hell out. The leads are all entertaining to watch (even in their weirder moments) and you wanna know how the whole thing is going to be resolved by these guys, which is really important to a mystery. But the direction was just…everywhere, the choices on what to emphasize odd, the unnecessary two episodes info dumping on the audience when it could’ve been done in easily 6 minutes or less (leaving more room for the actual story) per episode, it seriously needed a more focused path/cutting out the bits that were just unnecessary, and sometimes this series was just too subtle for it’s own good.

    It’s definitely worthy of a 75 (or so)/100 for being unique. :)

    Thanks for reading anyone and please (again) know I’m not bashing!

Leave a Reply

CHANGE USERNAME
Kaiser-Eoghan
Lenlo! Only one more episode of steins gate 0 and we're free!
Amagi
Man, Beastars is pretty damn good so far, I only wanted to check out the first chapter and now I am at ch. 30. I like how it adresses a bunch of different social issues by using an anthro-animal setting and how real it suddently gets at certain plot points.
SuperMario
@Niello: I watched Aguu first episode. While it has some really neat ideas (including the ritual that is creepy and awesome at the same time), it's the lackluster visual and the stiff character acting that kill my desire to check any more episode of it
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Mario: I do think starlight can be too abrupt though at times and could focus longer on certain things, then again it is only 12 episodes.
Niello
I wish I can edit those grammar mistakes...well whatever.
Niello
From that point on, the show is more of a family drama with problem sparked from supernatural shounen shenanigans, and this is where the show really shines. It turns into one of those story where it constantly change your perspective of the characters as you know more about them.
Niello
The interesting bit is how the first couple episodes give you the impression that it would be a more episodic story with enemy of the week. However, after the initial set up and they went to Hong Kong, it has been focus on one single arc.
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Niello: I suppose there will always be a show I missed or didn't notice on the seasonalcharts.
Niello
That's coming from someone who hate the premise. I went in thinking it would be absolute shit. It's still not great, but I'm impress that it has something that still make it worth watching.
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Niello: I don't think I know what that is.
Niello
Aguu really surprised me this season. It has tons of flaws, but of all things I didn't expect to see great character developments and dynamics. It's definitely appreciable for how the characters were handled feel different from most anime. The twists are well done as well. It didn't go in the direction I initially expected it to at all. Over all, I think it's actually worth watching.
Kaiser-Eoghan
Come to think of it her name, Hikari, i think it means light.
Kaiser-Eoghan
*like it
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Mario: I liked it when a show surprises me like this.
Kaiser-Eoghan
Although Mahiru probably had the most backstory to her. Glad you agreed on how they handled the rivalry between Tendou and Claudine (aka Croissant-chan)
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Mario: I noticed that and I think it could have been followed up on .
Kaiser-Eoghan
I really do love that shot though, it really shows and symbolizes and goes with "how she's lost everything". Actually I liked how the symbolism in this show was clearer at times than expected.
SuperMario
My best girl is Banana. Try to protect all the girls by rewinding the time, Madoka-style? Count me in
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Mario: Hikari is best girl, flat is justice never forget *hides*
Kaiser-Eoghan
I hope we see more of that shot from episode 11, the one on the bottom right.
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Mario: Thanks for covering the show. Probably wouldn't have seen it otherwise.
SuperMario
@Kaiser: i've never heard of the prequel manga. It's still about Karen and Hikari, I suppose?
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Mario: Theres a prequel manga for shoujo kageki, I haven't read it though.
Kaiser-Eoghan
Odd hearing French spoken in an anime series too, I wonder how accurate it is.
Kaiser-Eoghan
Looking forward to the ending this week.
Kaiser-Eoghan
Thought the animation could have been a bit better! The English dub is okayish to me.
Kaiser-Eoghan
Surprised how endeared I ended up getting into this show.
Even though I liked the central relationship I wish it had more screentime, but I liked what I got and the expanded focus on the other girls was something I enjoyed aswell so I don’t mind so much.
I do want a bit more followup on that “betrayal” moment though, but Mario as you say, this show does hit its emotional moments.
Kaiser-Eoghan
different enough as not to become stale, the ones that come to mind best for me was the doubles duel and particularly that really goofy one in episode 6.
Eventually even though the show can be a bit vague/meandering, the character interactions had more point than I thought and they grew on me.
Kaiser-Eoghan
On a second go through and now that I’ve caught up with it, the standout for me are definitely all the weird stuff with the stage battles and Giraffe guy, regarding the duels, even though the format of this show is repetitive, the duels themselves feel that they are
Kaiser-Eoghan
I initially put off watching shoujo kageki starlight, mostly down to feeling it was one of those “wait and see” shows, based on the first two episodes. I also at first thought the character interactions were meandering and asinine.
Kaiser-Eoghan
*in an old
Kaiser-Eoghan
And as another random fact, a young Swedish actor from film called death in Venice was the basis for the design of an old shounen-ai manga.
Kaiser-Eoghan
Now anon, that reminds me, Ash was apparently based off River Phoenix.
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Anon: You cheeky fiend =P
Anonymous2824999
If they ever make a live action Banana Fish, they should cast Kevin Spacey as Dino.
Kaiser-Eoghan
I didn't know double decker was supposed to be related to tiger and bunny.
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Mario: I'll be starting shoujo kageki in a few hours.
SuperMario
Needless to say, while this season has been a bit underwhelming, I have like 3 favorite shows that might end up on my Top 10 of the year list.
Kaiser-Eoghan
Donkey VietKONG.
Kaiser-Eoghan
SUPER-MAOrio =P
SuperMario
Regarding RErideD and Double Decker, I'm in no rush checking them out now. Will do that after this season wraps up
SuperMario
Regarding politic, my dad was a Communist so he was pretty tight-lipped when it comes to the topic. Most of the things I learned from how the system works is by listening to him and his colleagues talk over while drinking
SuperMario
Regarding Ash, yeah it strikes me the same as Ash is is way too perfect in everything (the new talent we found out the last few episodes: superhacker). When he said to Eiji that he never wanted that "gift" in the first place, I honestly don't know which one he was referring to
Kaiser-Eoghan
I may aswell finish it given that that its the last episode.
AidanAK47
So Planet With ends and the madman actually did it. Besides needing a bit more of a epilogue, that was a great finale.
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Animosh: I try to understand, make sense of the other sides views within reason.
Kaiser-Eoghan
I really want a successful fantasy go on an adventure style show though, I feel like I'm genuinely in the mood for one, I've actually considered watching some old ovas of that nature.
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Animosh: The most common thing my father and I talk about is Brexit really and how once upon a time we actually went after tyrants.
Kaiser-Eoghan
And even though I have the God thing, never became a burn the witches kind of person. I do want to put the far right/fascist people in gulags though lol
Kaiser-Eoghan
The Kaiser thing, now that I think about it is actually really odd, I speak minimal German, am no monarchist and am a leftist. Yet even though I hate the bougoiuse , I love aristocratic costumes lol
Kaiser-Eoghan
Then again, it may not be overly odd, there were Maoist priests.
Amagi
@Kaiser-Eoghan: This is pretty common here too. Organized religion isn't popular but most people believe there is a God and, depending on the person and cultural background, that parts of the holy books are true (or not, if they're real agnostics), usually in a metaphorical sense though.
Kaiser-Eoghan
*upbringing
Kaiser-Eoghan
That mixed upbringoing of having a communist father and religious relatives is an interesting thing.....for all of the exploitation I watch, I ctually feel nunsploitation is going too far lol I also sometimes check with my dad before watching certain things to make sure it isn't "too anti-left/anti socialist".
Amagi
@Animosh: No problem. I think it depends a bit on how people were brought up decades ago. It's probably different nowadays, no idea. The arguing was kinda fun though, especially for the teen me (I bet I annoyed the shit out of my father).
Kaiser-Eoghan
Yet having no regard for organized religion.
Kaiser-Eoghan
I however am a mutt though, believer in some kind of a God to an extent....while also having communist sympathies.
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Animosh@Amagi: As it stands neither my mother or brother are communists, actually my mother while very left wing would criticize my father when going "too communist". My parents and my brother are the only members of my family who could be considered leftist/non-religious.
Amagi
@Animosh: Planet With definetely needs some sort of epilogue OVA. You can somewhat guess the dragon's story but it's not the same as seeing it and there are still a few of semi-loose strings like the people who are still dreaming.
Animosh
@Amagi: my apologies for my presumptuousness. ;) My mother occasionally also participated in political discussions, but yeah, for some reason it's often men who have strong political opinions and are not willing to admit defeat in discussions.
Amagi
Also I don't spoil anything but the last minutes of the first episode just feel stupid. I think/hope there will be an explanation later for how something has worked so perfectly that shouldn't have worked at all. In general it seems to be a show that tries hard but can't deliver for some reason. I won't completely judge it yet though.
Animosh
Planet With also wrapped up things nicely. Unfortunately the dragon remains a bit underdeveloped, which makes it difficult for me to care about his fate, and I would have liked to see at least the main ship officially confirmed, but other than that it was an excellent finale that satisfactorily ties up all loose ends. This is how you do a one-cour.
Amagi
Regarding RErideD I have conflicted feelings. As said, the premise sounds pretty good but the budget is damn dab, especially for the beginning of a show. There is a scene in which the MC is so badly animated you can't even recognize what's going on at first.
Amagi
@Animosh: funny enough I am female, but yeah somehow these discussions only exist with fathers while the mothers are just trowing the towel and say "fuck it", I mean it usually doesn't change anybody's mind so it's more of a hobby I guess.
Animosh
It's a bit late, but Hanebado is finally giving me what I wanted from the show: tense, well-animated badminton matches. The match does feel a bit rushed, the overexplaining can be annoying and there's still plenty of melodrama, but it's a lot more enjoyable than what we got in the previous weeks at least.
Anonymous2822860
will be seeing what kind of flaws Ash has. Also, I think this way of characterizing him also fits into the narrative. This strength that Ash has is what pushes his gang members away and see him not as a normal human, but a "king."
Anonymous2822860
That was some interesting insight on Ash as a "perfect" person. While I do think that Banana Fish shows that Ash is an extremely capable person time and time again, he cannot win this "war" alone. There's too many enemies and too many things that need to be done. Also, I think as we get further on into the second cour, we
Anonymous2822162
Also, it's neat watching the first few episodes again after what goes down throughout the first half of the series; you get to see all of the characters together before everything blows up in their face.
Anonymous2822162
When I say perfect characterization, I should say I mean the way he's characterized as this perfect supremely capable person. The other characters do help reveal other aspects of Ash though: Eiji is his age and allows him to be a normal teenager; Max is like a surrogate father and lets him act like a son; Arthur and Dino are kind of evil inverses of that.
Anonymous2822162
When I say perfect charac
Anonymous2822162
Anyways, not to hate on Ash because he's still a fantastic main lead and anchors the whole show. It's just that because he loses sometimes I push some of the problems of his perfect characterization to the side, but when you actually think about it, he seems more like a character than a real person.
Anonymous2822162
Also the fact that Ash has been through a super tragic backstory doesn't help a lot: it seems like the writers are trying to make him a character who has been through all the tragedy in the world and has overcome it and became the most skilled person in the world. I will say though that any onscreen tragedy is 100% believable, it just some of the flashbacks that are a bit too much.
Anonymous2822162
I guess that slightly cheapens Ash's character on retrospection: of course he is still the charismatic lead, but he feels a bit too perfect at everything. Dino must have taught him quite a bit, but Ash is skilled in, like, everything. It just seems a bit too much.
Anonymous2822162
Like the whole Yut-Lung Shorter Eiji situation was beyond Ash (in fact he still knew something was off but couldn't pinpoint what); that wasn't really a mistake Ash made, it was just that he couldn't have known the secret connections Yut-Lung had.
Anonymous2822162
Something I noticed about Ash is that he is, as some of you pointed out, a Gary Stu but it doesn't immediately jump at you. The thing is that Ash still loses quite a bit, so he doesn't seem invincible, yet at the same I think the majority of his losses were beyond his control. It doesn't feel like he makes mistakes, rather that other people outmaneuver him due to factors beyond him.
Animosh
@Kaiser & Amagi: I also had lots of political discussions with my father. Didn't know that was such a common occurrence. Boys will be boys I guess? And he's actually a former Marxist too, having grown up in the 60's-70's and all. Now he's just a boring socialist though. ;)
Animosh
RErideD seemed really promising in theory: an original time travel anime written (at least in part) by Abe, with the director of Steins;Gate in charge? Count me in. But unfortunately the reviews so far seem to be uniformly negative. So I'll probably avoid it for now.
Kaiser-Eoghan
Four episodes of RErideD: Tokigoe no Derrida got uploaded at the same time earlier.
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Lenlo: Yes, although probably just for the Saturday, usually the best day to do so because thats when the sellers are there, usually everythings gone by Sunday. Friday is generally anime pub quiz.
Lenlo
Its just a saturday, so busy. And Kaiser, nice. Gonna go to the con at all?
Lenlo
As a writer for it, I dont believe so?
Anonymous2818178
is this site dead?
Kaiser-Eoghan
There is an animecon here in two weeks. That eyepatchwolf youtuber will be there.
Kaiser-Eoghan
I still have old single issues of fushigi yugi, inuyasha, Ah my Goddess, narutaru laid around.
Kaiser-Eoghan
They used to realease them like single American comic book issues in the west.
Kaiser-Eoghan
I'm not talking bound volumes but actual 20-30 pages chapters and these would be expensive.
Kaiser-Eoghan
Who remembers RENTING anime dvds and RENTING videogames? Does anyone else remember buying each individual manga chapter as they came out when the official English translations rolled around?
Kaiser-Eoghan
Anyone willing to post their desktop? https://ibb.co/buc4Zz
Kaiser-Eoghan
Or things like Mischief makers .
Kaiser-Eoghan
I know vonter mentioned Mystical ninja 64. But I remember after I'd moved on from the snes to the N64 when I was younger, growing up with that obscure castlevania game on it, or stuff like those 3D bomberman games no-one cared about. Or obscure stuff like body harvest, jet force gemini, blast corps , turok, quest 64 and shadowman.
Kaiser-Eoghan
I love coming across those online lists of literally WHOtier, WHOcares , games literally only YOU liked and heard of/played. Makes me feel less alone.
Amagi
I was also always discussing about politics with my father. Whenever we started with this my mother just said "porca putana" and went into another room to watch tv in peace.
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Animemosh: lol I have daily political discussion with my Marxist-Leninist father just like that =)
Kaiser-Eoghan
Oh I should state, even though I'm not as bothered by the modern setting, I actually do prefer the cold war narrative.
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Animosh: The documentries name was Battle of Chile by Patricio Guzman.
Amagi
Especially since I don't think that the typical BF audience is of a kind that would lose interest because a series is taking place in the past. It was just written for the 80s, people can't just change that without changing the story itself to some degree.
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Animosh: I thought the anime did such a good job with Shio's backstory , that I didn't miss what was omitted. The anime is now up to date with the scans. I do agree that Satou's obsession with Shio is non-pedophilic but I think the scene itself is kind of going to give the wrong message.
Amagi
@Animosh: one of the many reasons why I would have prefered Banana Fish's original setting.
Animosh
By the way, apparently the backstory of Shio's mother - which supposedly is really tragic - was largely skipped. Guess I'll have to read the manga.
Animosh
I get what they're going for, recreating the ritual and all, but I also thought the Shio-Satou moment was a bit forced. I still think their relationship is platonic though. Satou has never been shown to lust after Shio: she just fills her with warmth and happiness. They're more like messed up siblings than (romantic) lovers.
Animosh
@Kaiser: sounds interesting! Chile is an excellent example of the kind of Cold War intervention that I really don't see happening today. Although you never know with an impulsive narcissist in the White House.
Animosh
End of monologue. Sorry about this. :p
Animosh
Long story short: I think the Banana Fish conspiracies fail to adequately represent the current situation. At the very least, it fits the Cold War world order much better.
Animosh
That includes the US (backing the Kurds and the rebels), but also Turkey and the Arab states (Sunni rebels), Russia and Iran (Assad), and so on and so forth. You can't act like this is the fault of one party. Hell, I'd say Russia and Assad are more responsible for failing to a peaceful resolution when they had the chance.
Animosh
As for Syria, it's a mess, but the US is only one of many parties responsible. And oil isn't particularly important in this conflict. It's a civil war that's been made much worse by the influx of money and weapons from many different parties vying for regional influence.
Animosh
So what does it do? It gives military and financial backing to militias with shared interests (which is much less than Russia does, by the way), orders drone strikes, and perhaps the occasional tactical strike. But overthrowing countries and setting up puppet regimes? I don't see it happening. That's basically declaring war on the other big powers.
Animosh
And even when it does intervene militarily, it rarely goes all out. The US has learned from Iraq and Afghanistan. It doesn't want to be dragged into another endless conflict, or see its efforts end in another brutal civil war that destabilizes the region.
Animosh
So although the US occasionally still intervenes militarily in other countries' affairs, other means of pressure are now more popular. The sanctions against Iran and North Korea are a good example of this.
Animosh
The current landscape is much more complex. America is still powerful, of course, but relatively speaking it is in decline, and that means it can get away with much less. Today's world is closer to a multipolar world, with many sides fighting for influence. And because the ideological conflict is much less pronounced, the US is much less willing to go against its purported values.
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Animosh: Coincidentally I recently watched a series of Chilean documentaries regarding the murder of Salvador Allende and the installation of the Pinochet Junta.
Animosh
And that meant both that America was far more powerful than it is now, and that much more intervention was considered acceptable - including shamelessly backing dictators that oppressed and exploited their people. After all, a defeat meant evil would prevail.
Animosh
Obviously the US still interferes in other countries. Quite a lot, actually. But there's a big difference between its current policy and that during the Cold War. Back then the geopolitical landscape was very different. It was bipolar, with two big Isms (capitalism and communism) fighting it out.
Animosh
@anon: not sure if this is the right place for a political discussion, but whatever. I like politics, so here we go.
Kaiser-Eoghan
*was no exception
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Animosh: If, out of the many moments in happy sugar life that I'd consider unsettling, it would be the one's with the aunt and this weeks episode was an exception. That last part of the episode will be interpreted as shoujo-ai bait by people though.
Kaiser-Eoghan
Looking forward to Angels of death next week, I think we're getting answers, glad to get answers on bad guy even if he is a simple villain.
Kaiser-Eoghan
Now this is an interesting coincidence as last night I just got done watching a documentary about cyberwarfare against Iran.
Kaiser-Eoghan
Thats alot more detailed than what I was going to say. I was just going to say that it reflects current foreign policy.
Anonymous2808488
however the current stalemate in Syria is a reflection of the intransigence of the monied elite to not let go of ill-gotten gains, constantly provoking conflict with Russia/Assad/Iran
Anonymous2808488
Its a documented fact the US/EU promoted the Arab Spring/ISIS rebellions and it was stopped by patriots with a conscience
Anonymous2808488
replace with the mexican cartels/Hezbollah, and oil money promised to Cheney-connected Genie enerrgy
Anonymous2808488
its a pretty accurate description of the current reality minus a couple silly things like the mafia and mind control drugs
Anonymous2808488
You guys realize this plot is unfolding in Syria just replace drugs with oil money
Lenlo
Its hokey in the now, but in the original context the series was written, the Cold War, I think it could fit really well.
Animosh
@Kaiser: what felt awkward to you? I thought the pumpkin stuff in particular was pretty hilarious. Eiji is an evil guy. :p
Animosh
Yeah, the conspiracy stuff feels a bit wacky in the present. But in the context of the Cold War, it makes perfect sense. The USA supported plenty of bloody coups after all, especially in Latin America. Hell, they even backed the Taliban in their war against Russia.
Kaiser-Eoghan
In the future I want to make a bigger effort to follow MORE of whats being covered on here seasonally.
Kaiser-Eoghan
http://kissmanga.com/Manga/Red
https://manganelo.com/manga/red_naoki_yamamoto Two history manga, wonder if they'll be fully translated.
Kaiser-Eoghan
I imagine most will probably agree with you anon though. I have alien taste/opinions. I also love conspiracy stuff =P
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Anon: Originally, in the manga version of that part, it was attacking communism in south America.
Anonymous2805624
I don't know; I kinda find the whole Middle East stuff a bit hokey; maybe that's just me.
Lenlo
Im about to watch it. Looking forward to it
Kaiser-Eoghan
I know its only one line, but that they still mention skip and shorter, even its just their names, at least the show keeps them in mind.
Kaiser-Eoghan
With episode 12, Banana fish has successfully contemporized its political/cospiracy aspect for me . Eiji is semi-uselful. Humour in this episode for the first time feels awkward, fast pace kind of means that the quieter slower scenes , though I still enjoy them, feel slotted in.
Lenlo
Most of my emotions this week came because of the original and my love of it, not this one
Lenlo
I agree, Steins;Gate 0 had all the potential, and there are some specific episodes that realized it. Like this episode had a lot of touching scenes cause it slowed down to play up Okabe's relationship with Amadeus. But most of the time, it fails to reach that potential. So as a whole it just feels... lacking
Kaiser-Eoghan
Plebs, not combining both into a single dessert.
Anonymous2802297
I'm talking about that sweet saccharine Chocolate Mousse, the Ganache, or the Chocolate Gâteau. Your puny muffin stands no chance. Mwahaha!
Anonymous2802297
Blasphemy. As a proud American, I can't stand for anything less than pure unadulterated diabetes-inducing sugar in chocolatey cake form. Anything less is an insult to my great nation. /s
SuperMario
@anon2801739: that's a nice analogy but I can't say I agree as I prefer chocolate muffin much more than chocolate cake :)))
Anonymous2801739
Steins;gate 0 is all potential but generally it's wasted. Whenever it actually seems promising they manage to jump plot points to boring nonsensical melodrama for a century. It was supposed to be a chocolate cake. Instead what we got was a muffin with tiny chocolate chips buried few and far between. Yeah it's still sweet at some points, but most of the time you're chewing through pointless fluff.
Lenlo
Like I said in my last post on it I think, the pacing is fucked
Animosh
I did like that the lab members finally acted like scientists again, methodically thinking through their options and all, and there were some pretty touching individual moments and nicely tied up ends. But mostly I'm just annoyed by all the unfulfilled potential of this show.
Animosh
I also hated the backtracking in the beginning. Don't make such a big deal of The Return if you're going to throw it out of the window in the next episode.
Animosh
I really don't understand Steins;Gate's pacing. It slows down to a trickle in the largely irrelevant middle part, and now that things are finally getting somewhat interesting again it just speeds through everything without building things up properly? I don't get it. And how on Earth are they going to resolve everything satisfactorily in one episode?
KTravlos
Reinhard (old series). Ash is interesting and depicted well, but not close to Reinhard. There is something noble in Reinhard, something beyond charisma.
Anonymous2797046
In a charisma battle between our two favorite Blond Boys (doing what blond boys do), who'd win: Reinhard or Ash?
Kaiser-Eoghan
Kind of felt this is what prelude penultimate episode/calm before the storm episode should be and I liked quite liked the ginko and souya scene, but I'm still eh, I shrug at this.
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