Posted by psgels on 24 June 2009 with categories: xxxHolic, xxxHolic Shunmuki



Well, in case you haven’t heard yet: they’re planning to make the next xxxHolic OAD, to air in 2010. Aand I guess that this episode is the point where xxxHolic stops being xxxHolic, and starts becoming Tsubasa Chronicle’s back-up show (which I assume to have its next OVA announced soon as well). I expected this episode to deal too much with TC, but in the end there was only a small bit about Sakura, and thank goodness there was still lots of WatanukixDomekixHimawari.

The way in which Domeki kept waiting for Watanuki for about six hours was a bit repetitive, but on the other side we can finally see Himawari’s development kicking off. There is this unique triangle between the three of them, in which Himawari is finally ready to crawl out of her shell. The scene with Sakura was also surprisingly solidly done, and neatly answered some questions that Tsubasa Shunraiki left hanging.

But yeah, there were continuity issues as well. Was I the only one surprised at the Rain Sprite’s sudden change of hair-color, and nobody noticing it? That’s really the big problem with the xxxHolic and Tsubasa anime series: the really bad management. When the decision was made to animate these two series, nobody really bothered to look at the big picture. There was nobody who took charge and thought about how they could make this work best. Instead there were too many parties that took too much assumptions: Bee-Train assumed that CLAMP wouldn’t mind it if they went with their own story since the manga hadn’t finished yet, CLAMP assumed that Bee-Train would simply follow the manga’s storyline for three seasons, Production IG assumed that there were not going to be any Tsubasa Chronicle references, so they left all of those out. And so the continuity became a complete mess when they tried to recover these mistakes. For people who haven’t read the manga like myself, anyway.

In any case, I’m not in the mood of writing a review for all of these different series, OVAs, et cetera, but I will provide this list of my opinion on the various adaptations of the franchise:
– Tsubasa Series 1: solid manga-adaptation with strong characters, although it moved really slooow.
– Tsubasa Series 2: lots of fillers that were really fun to watch at times (my favourite being the chibi-episode), and just okay at others, but really ruined the continuity of the series, up to the point at which Clamp made Bee-Train return to one of the previous worlds to show that dead people can’t be brought back to life.
– Tsubasa Movie: for some reason I rated it really highly, but thinking back it was just a boring filler that really wasn’t anything special.
– Tsubasa Tokyo Revelations: Awesome visuals, though tried to cram a bit too much story in too little time.
– Tsubasa Shunraiki: blatantly skips two very important manga-arcs, making it impossible to follow for non-manga readers like myself, and the chapters that were animated were rather boring and hardly anything developed.
– xxxHolic Movie: awesome mystery-movie that even though it has nothing to do with the continuity, stands out with really imaginative visuals and very naturally evolves and lets the viewer guess what the heck is going on.
– xxxHolic Series 1: excellent series about modern folklore, discussing a wide range of thought-provoking topics.
– xxxHolic Kei: while still about modern folklore, the characters become much more central and this series was an awesome character-study of the three main leads.
– xxxHolic Shunmuki: the weakest part of xxxHolic to be honest, but that’s mostly because the others were simply that good. Mostly building up for future OVAs.

Rating: * (Good)
The plot didn’t really interest me, though I really liked Himawari’s growth.

17 Responses

  1. DmonHiro says:

    “Tsubasa Series 1: solid manga-adaptation with strong characters”….that is the largest portion of bullshit I’ve read in a while. They took out all the comedy, all of Sakura’s personality, stayed in the SECOND FREAKING VOLUME for 5 episodes, removed all the comedy, took out most of Sakura’s personality, advenced the story with the speed of evolution, and worse of all they took out all the comedy, and pretty much all of Sakura’s personality, and in doing so, LOST 50% of the manga’s charm. I DREAD to think what you think a BAD adaptation is, let alone what you consider WEAK characters. FUCK YOU BEE TRAIN

  2. James says:

    I agreed, this es the weakest part of xxxholic, but it´s still a good one, in my opinion. Now, about eh mess in terms of continuity I´m also agreed with you, but, it´s not too hard to follow, even if you don´t read the manga.
    I´m just wondering about what will be the plot in the next xxxholic OAD, I just hope they´ll show the TRUE kohane arc THAT would be VERY interesting, but again, if that happens there´s will be references to tsubasa, but interesting ones!

  3. lialiakicks says:

    Tsubasa series 1 & 2 were absolutely dreadful. BeeTrain did a horrible job adopting the series IMO. To add to what DmonHiro said, they basically 4Kids’d the show. Tsubasa isn’t really kiddie stuff. I would have preferred it if Production I.G did BOTH Tsubasa and xxxHolic first series at the same time. >_

  4. Nomus says:

    This is funny. You state, that you are NOT a manga reader. But before it you write, that “Tsubasa Series 1: solid manga-adaptation”. lol How can you know? I can understand, that reading the same thing you just wathced can be boring. Listen, you are making good reviews, people listen to your opinion. But from time to time you start to loose objectivity, because you don’t want to read manga. Sometimes adaptions are better, sometimes – originals are. To know this you must look at both. At least a little.)

  5. miken-chan says:

    Eh, the first season of the TV series of Tsubasa was…bearable at best. After 3 episodes into the 2nd, I just dropped it. What really got me back into the series was the Tokyo Revelations OADs, though the new OADs aren’t really helping me get into the series any more. Since, from here, everything in Tsubasa gets more and more confusing. Plus, the plot twists in the skipped-over Infinity and Seresu/Celes/Whatever were both surprising and changed the mood of the story just as much or even more than Tokyo Revelations.

    As for xxxHolic, it’s managed to stay at least decent if not better throughout all of its forms, so I can’t really complain there. XD;;

  6. chan says:

    The problem for you is that you don’t read the manga, so that makes your review lose a lot points based on your lack of knowledge of the original work. How can you tell weather or not the crossover between xxxHolic and Tsubasa is bad when you don’t even read the manga? How can you tell how much they crossover if don’t read the manga? Your quote alone that xxxHolic is just the dumping ground for Tsubasa storyline is incorrect as the crossover is pretty much equal in terms of shared information.

    The whole problem with xxxHolic cannot be blamed on Production I.G. but again on Bee Train, as because Bee Train decided to do the Tsubasa anime they didn’t allow I.G. to put in any references for Tsubasa, because Tsubasa was slated as a young children’s show, and xxxHolic is not. That was also the reason for the lack of crossovers in xxxHolic Kei, a bit of research can go a long way.

    Oh and in the manga Ame Warashi’s hair is blue, its just that when the anime was made they didn’t know this. Before you do anymore reviews you really should just try to read the manga for both series, as well as do a little research. Otherwise your review will be littered with inconsistencies, or you’ll just look like you don’t know what you’re talking about, to readers who have read the manga.

  7. kagura says:

    Seriously, some people commenting here shoud realize that if they want to criticise something, they should be less rude and more constructive in their criticism, otherwise no one will care much about their opinion, if not consider their comments flaming and trolling :/

    As for the Bee Train’s anime, I have similar opinion to psgels (before you start bashing me: yes, I HAVE read the manga). I’m pretty sure that when BT started working on the anime, they had no idea in which direction the manga would go. They were probably expecting something like the second Cardcaptor Sakura, which you really can’t blame them for, since the TRC manga WAS rather light and innocent before the Acid Tokyo arc. So, since they probably weren’t expecting the gouged out eyes and cut off limbs that follow later, they decided to direct their anime at a slightly larger audience, kids included. Taking all this into consideration, I think they DID manage to do a fairly good job.

    And here’s the last piece of advice for all those anime haters and manga worshippers out there: go and read/watch Cardcaptor Sakura – you’ll see how a REALLY good manga/anime by Clamp should look like; ’cause, as much as I love TRC, I’m still far from being unable to see its numerous faults, which I wish also for you all :P

  8. DmonHiro says:

    Number 7, your argument about them not knowing what direction Tsubasa would go fails. They took out the humor….what possible reason could they have for doing that, except for “Bee Train doesn’t do comedy” BS. There is no way to defend the Tsubasa anime and not look like a moron, especially if you’ve read the manga. There is NO excuse for what the did to Tsubasa, and I hope they pay for it (financially). I have NEVER heard of a manga creator SAYING that they disown the anime. There was Bokurano (another piece of shit adaptation),but at least there the anime director told the manga director he didn’t like the story, and was going to change it. The manga artist told him “ok, just don’t revive the children”, witch he didn’t. He also told the manga readers to not watch the anime. Bee-Train fucked up, and there is no good excuse for it. The only thing good anime the anime was the music, and we all know who to thank for that.

  9. kagura says:

    Number 8, I’m sorry, but I don’t agree with you about the whole “taking out the humor” thing, since, as far as humor goes, the only thing I noticed them taking out, were the drinking sessions the main cast happened to have from time to time, and that’s the only thing I can’t forgive them ;) If you could give some more explicit examples of what they supposedly took out, then maybe I would reconsider your arguments…
    As for Clamp not liking the anime adaptation… well, they have every right for that, but it’s partially their fault for not talking it over with the animators beforehand and not stating it loud and clear as for what they expected from the anime. As far as I know, Bee Train doesn’t specialise in anime for kids, so they could’ve done something entirely different with TRC, if only Clamp had talked it over with them, right? Why did it take them so much time to actually do something about it if they didn’t like the anime so much? They should’ve intervened after the end of the first season…

    Anyway, I’ve no idea why I’m actually talking to someone, who calls me moron so blatantly, but oh well, it’s not like I have anything important to do at the moment…

  10. chan says:

    1) They took out that comedic world where. the characters were about to be sacrificed.

    2) They tried to make Sakura’s wings into a positive thing (FYI she can’t fly with her wings)

    3) They took out most of Shura’s scenes, as well as a lot from Piffle.

    4) Oh and it was pretty obvious from see Seishurou that the series would become very dark. Bee Train just decided that they wanted to make it into a children’s show depsite this fact.

    5) Giving Sakura powers which she doesn’t have in the manga.

    6) Making incorrect assumptions about Faye’s past

    7) Making incorrect assumptions about his relationship with Chii

    Also when Tsubasa was originally slated to come out CLAMP literally had several projects going on at the same time you can see from chibi Yuto’s livejournal account. Bee Train actually offered to do Tsuabasa CLAMP didn’t ask them to do it.

  11. kagura says:

    I agree with you about taking out that one world and those scenes with Sakura – I also think they should’ve just left them as they were. But then again, it’s only common sense that anime adaptation will NEVER be 100% the same as manga. Some scenes will be left out and some will be added. And taking out a few scenes isn’t what makes a bad anime, at least in my book.

    As for Seishirou, he definetely WASN’T the reasone why Tsubasa would become very dark in the later chapters. On the other hand, he definetely was FAR FROM the original Seishirou from Tokyo Babylon. In my opinion, Clamp pretty much butchered his character in TRC, sorry :/

    About giving Sakura powers she didn’t have in the manga or making incorrect assumptions – well, as I already said, if Bee Train and Clamp had actually talked things over, they would’ve probably avoid some of the misunderstandings. The argument that Clamp had several projects to work on and that they didn’t ask Bee Train to do Tsubasa just isn’t enough for me. If you want the anime adaptation to live up to your expectations, then you have to at least talk some things over with the anime creators. If you leave them to do whatever they want, then you have no right to complain later.

    I’m not trying to say that the Bee Train’s anime is the best thing invented since Christmas or anything, I’m far from it. I’m actually quite aware of its faults. But I can also see its good points and don’t think it deserves even half of the criticism it gets from the manga worshippers. The manga itself isn’t that great either. I’d been Clamp fan long before Tsubasa, and I can tell that TRC is rather… mediocre among their other works (but I love the characters – they are pretty much what saves the manga for me)…

    Anyway, trying to persuade me any further would probably be useless. I already have my opinion concerning Bee Train’s anime, you have yours and let’s just leave it at that :)

  12. Nomus says:

    To kagura:
    “flaming and trolling”? Not much of it here. Just some TRC fans.) Of course everyone can have his own opinion. But you can compare manga and anime version. And psgels said it’s “solid manga-adaptation” after stating a few times, that he doesn’t read manga. I don’t get it.( As much as I like this blog, I have to critisize it from time to time.)

    Anyway, yes, it’s hard to follow TSR-anime without reading manga now. But CLAMP like to release random animations based on their works!) Take Clover or CLAMP in Wonderland for example. So, maybe it will be better to read the original or drop this series.

  13. chan says:

    Kagura: The reason I used Seishourou as an example is because his appearance was a sign that the characters from X and/or Tokyo Bablyon were going to be involved and if you know anything about those two series you would realize why it such a dead giveaway

    Again CLAMP didn’t have the time to do this. And since Bee Train volunteered for the project it should be their responsibility that the series follow the manga, as they were the ones that offered to do it in the first place. In fact the simple fact that CLAMP took away their rights to the Tsubasa is kind of an insult, as it means that they couldn’t do the job that they volunteered to correctly. Try as you might, at the end of the day Bee Train is still to blame. Oh and by the way CLAMP did give Bee Train some pointers, and instructions from time to time on what they should and should not do, and apparently Bee Train didn’t follow them. For instance if you look on the web you can find storyboards drawn by CLAMP for the Tsubasa anime. That was one of problems with the Bee Train adaptation is that CLAMP did tell them the direction that Tsubasa would be heading in, Bee Train just didn’t want to go there. They voluntarily did the Tsubasa anime knowing the direction it was going in, and yet still went along with the idea of making the anime G-rated. That’s actually not CLAMP’s fault.

    Also its not that you’re opinion is different from mine that’s the problem its just what you’re opinion is based on.

  14. kagura says:

    Nomus: when I said “flaming and trolling”, I was referring to the first comment only. Maybe I overreacted a bit, but I felt that “that is largest portion of bullshit I’ve read in a while” or “fuck you (whoever/whatever)” weren’t exactly the expressions you should use in a civillized conversation ;)

    About psgels not reading the manga and then stating that the anime was “a solid adaptation” – well, I’m sure that he based his opinion on what he’d heard from people who actually read the manga or the info he’d found on the net. He probably meant that most of (yes, MOST OF, not ALL) the events from the manga were included in the anime, in almost exactly the same way as they were in manga (plus some fillers and stretching some things out – sadly, an inevitable thing in most of anime adaptations), which is basically true. OK, I shouldn’t really speak for him ;)

    Chan: Yes, I’m aware of why you used Seishirou as an example, but it was kind of funny to me, since, sadly for me, he was HARDLY the reason of Tsubasa becoming darker in the later chapters…

    I don’t agree that it was Bee Train’s “responsibilty” to follow the manga. As far as any adaptation goes, it’s always up to the people adapting to decide on which approach to take with the source material. The adaptation can be either 100% faithful or 100% different (or everything in between), all depending on the visions in the heads of the animators and their feelings about the original.

    First you said, that Clamp hadn’t had the time to deal with TRC anime adaptation, then you said they actually DID give some directions. As for me, I think it was probably one big misunderstanding on both sides. After all, if Clamp had indeed hated the anime so much, they would’ve already taken the rights from Bee Train right after the season one. But they did it only after Bee Train had blatantly changed the original storyline and it’d become clear that they were going to take an entirely different approach on the series. Since their views on TRC grew too far apart from each other, further Clamp-Bee Train cooperation became impossible. But it DOESN’T MEAN that Bee Train’s anime was bad as a whole. And, to be honest, I’m glad that Clamp took the rights at the point when it looked like the anime actually had every chance to really get bad in the future (those last fillers were undeniably the weakest part of the entire show).

    OK, so now I already forgot what my original point was :P I probably just wanted to say that anime isn’t as bad as many picture it to be or something like that, but it got lost somewhere along the lines. But don’t worry, that’s pretty much all I had to say :)

    Seriously, and it was supposed to be a post about xxxHolic :P
    Sorry, psgels >_

  15. chan says:

    @ Kagura
    Anime adaptations do not need to follow their manga. However in cases such as this one when the animation studio volunteers for the job, and promise to make the series follow the manga.

    I also think that the flaw in pgsels xxxHolic Tsubasa OAD reviews are that pgsels doesn’t read the manga versions which is the target audience for the OADs, and then complains about being confused. When part of his confusion actually comes from Bee Train adaptation being outright adaptation decay, yes even the first season which outright nerfed Sakura, and Faye’s personality.

    You do know that CLAMP writes the scripts to some of their animes right? In fact they wrote the script for the xxxHolic anime. During that time they also admitted to not having the time to review the Tsuabasa anime, which is why they didn’t take away the rights during season one.Simply put they didn’t even watch season one when it originally aired. They didn’t catch up to the series until it was in the middle of the second season which is when they confronted Bee Train about the anime adaptation, and Bee Train stated that they would make the Tsubasa anime follow a different route. After that Bee Train lost their rights to the series.

    However, in this doesn’t change the fact that CLAMP in the Bee Train anime adaptation’s initial stages had told Bee Train the direction the series would be headed, means that Bee Train was not naive of Tsubasa’s dark nature.

    I tend to like pgsels reviews and I agree with the vast majority of them. However, this one I cannot if only for the fact he himself is ignorant of the necessary source material needed to understand the OADs, and yet still insists on reviewing it, even though he knows that he isn’t the target audience. Because these OADs are not for people who only watched the anime. In fact watching the anime will do nothing more than make you even more confused.

  16. Ebod says:

    Just a small correction, while CLAMP did write the script for some of xxxHOLiC’s anime episodes, it was only SELECT episodes, so around 70% of the scripts were still done by the animation group.

    Also, Cardcaptor Sakura is not exactly the best example of a good manga adaptaion as nearly all of the episode scripts were written by CLAMP and all the character designs and clothes that Sakura wore in each episode was designed by CLAMP as well.

  17. shamu_orka says:

    “the chapters that were animated were rather boring and hardly anything developed.” True, nothing really special happened in Tsubasa Shunraiki: SPOILERS – Kurogane understood the meaning of true strength; Fay stops being angsty; we learn that Fay still wishes to resurrect his dead twin; FWR’s true wish is revealed; we learn Sakura is a clone; Sakura seems to die; Sakura confesses her love to Cloney; Cloney finally shows some emotions; we learn Watanuki is Syaoran’s “other self”; Fay says he knew Sakura was a clone the entire time; Tomoyo says she never buried the Ginryuu with Kurogane’s mother; Fay doesn’t want to die anymore. That, if you ask me, is not much of character developement. We do not learn anything that will be important in the later episodes, right?

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Lenlo
Have to say, Flip Flappers ep 5 was pretty good. I love atmospheric settings like that.
Lenlo
Looks like an Epee. The large bell guard, the fact that they are focusing on thrusting attacks instead of slashing (mostly). Fencing is alot of fun. Be prepared for some bruises though, as some people put their full body weight behind their thrusts.
SuperMario
I have one last dumb question, Can you tell what types of blade of Juri in Utena? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fGsVSSUv_i0
SuperMario
@Lenlo: the more you described the more I found fencing interesting. I might take a look around my town to see if we have Fencing here (the curse of living in a small town).
Lenlo
Blades are slightly different, yes, but mostly just in their guard and how much they bend. Sabers bend easily, Epee's not so much. Surprisingly Epee is the slowest, because people tend to be more careful. Saber is actually the most aggressive of the blades, atleast at my skill level
AidanAK47
That's all they had to do. Just stay inside and let it pass. But for some weird reason they just keep panicking over nothing.
As far as time/alternate world stuff goes this was ridiculously underwhelming. Just finished another movie called triangle and now that's how you do Time travel mindfuckery.
AidanAK47
@Mario, I am not fond of movies where people make stupid decisions for no good reason. For example:
"We should just stay inside"
"No, staying inside isn't realistic"
WHY IN THE HOLY HELL ISN'T IT REALISTIC.
SuperMario
Showed that movie to a bunch of friends last year and I remembered one of the girl just shut off the movie after 15'
SuperMario
@Aidan: too bad. I found Cohenrent really funny and entertaining. Some of their twists are stupid but I was actually invested in much of their characters. Maybe because I always love movies about a bunch of characters in an isolated setting
SuperMario
@Lenlo: sounds like Epee is the most "all-out-attack" and aggressive one. Their blades are different as well I assume?
AidanAK47
Just watched a movie called coherence and man, what a bunch a pseudo-intellectual garbage that was.
Lenlo
For Right of Way, its basically Person A attacks, Person B parries, Person A hits, Person B hits, Person B gets the point because they took right of way with the parry. Saber and Foil both have that, but Epee does not. Epee is simply "Whoever hits the opponent first, doesnt matter where, whole body is target area"
Lenlo
Theres Saber, Foil and Epee. The main difference is this thing called right of way, but there are other smaller ones like how Saber can hit with the edge and Epee is allowed to hit the entire body, instead of just the chest like Foil
SuperMario
For news, Blood Blockade Battlefront getting second season next year. As it was one of my favorite last year I'm really lokking forward to this second season
SuperMario
@Lenlo: that sounds great. From what I know from fencing there are 3 different types of blade right? So what are the differences between them? (Fencing 101 here)
Kaiser Eoghan
Although a fantasy sports thing could also generate interest, such as combining sports together to create something totally new.
Lenlo
@SuperMario, Fencing was great. Favorite sport ever and it helped me stay in shape in College. I find Epee to be the best blade, mostly cause I fenced it, but its a very intense 3 minutes. Unlike sports like Soccer and such which is alot of sustained running, Fencing is 3 minutes of Dont-Stop-Moving then wait till next match. Gets really fun once you figure out your own style.
SuperMario
haha, I wouldn't mind either if each episode focus on a single sport/ character/ country. Or even the positive aspects like role models, sports inspirations and stuffs
Lenlo
That Olympic anime sounds great.
Kaiser Eoghan
And it would be a good excuse to have characters of multiple backgrounds included too.
Kaiser Eoghan
Could be an 13 episode ova series with 48 minute episodes, and if its to be an ensemble character drama you could have 10 minutes to a each character (the ones being focused on in that episode) in each episode.
Kaiser Eoghan
Ah yes, aswell as cheating it could also get into "stage parenting", "abuse", "Disabilities" and also the general politics of sports, the backroom stuff.
SuperMario
I'll be the first in line if that olympic anime ever come out. Could be interesting to see the interactions between athletes in different sports, and then fans/athletes/coaches relationship, then the gold rush, doping... So much to talk around to
Kaiser Eoghan
I don't think theres ever been a manga about hurling either. Hey heres an idea, someone do an ensemble drama anime that deals with the olympics, fit in multiple sports that way.
SuperMario
Personally I find Australian football much more exciting than rugby. Or crickets.
SuperMario
@Kaiser: ha! Interesting that you mentioned Gaelic football, because in Aus we have AFL (Australian Football League), that really similars to Gealic Football to the point sometimes we have the 2 national teams compete each other with modified rules
Kaiser Eoghan
Hmm, lets see, sport under-represented in anime? Fencing, golf , Gaelic football, bowling, boat racing.
SuperMario
Hey, fencing is actually really cool. How did you like it Lenlo?
SuperMario
You have your point there Topgavin, as I clearly remember many instances where players' legs, backs or even necks got snapped during rugby's tackles. But in regards to Rugby I never really care about it. That and car racing
Lenlo
Its mostly the type of injuries you get that differ I think. Football you get concussions and broken bones and such, while in Rugby you probably get alot of bruises and cuts. Granted I have played neither, I was a Soccer man in highschool and fencing in College
Lenlo
American football has alot of rules, and really is just a bunch of millionaires running around chasing a ball. Rugby however, as Topgavin said, has no pads so when you get hit you get hit HARD
AidanAK47
I never ceases to surprise me just how high and mighty visual novel fans can be over Mosaics present in localized games. I mean they are literally complaining about not seeing genitalia yet the way they phrase it, it's like they are fighting against great injustice. If these VNs were Nukige they might have a point but in most cases the sex scenes in question are pointless and shoehorned in.
Topgavin
@Mario Rugby is more extreme *because* it has no protective gear. No hiding behind helmets and cushioned shoulder pads when ya get bowled over.
SuperMario
@Lenlo: I'm no expert but isn't American football a variation of Rugby? And I believe american football is more extreme, considering they have to wear helmets, protection gears and all that
Lenlo
I dont think theres alot of manga about it because its simply not that popular outside the US. As far as it being a battlefield, eeeeh? Not really? You want a battlefield watch Rugby.
SuperMario
I can think of other cool sports that could be interesting to see in anime: Kick Volleyball (Sepak takraw), Bossaball (combined soccer, volleyball in a trampoline), or in the same vein of skate figures this season, why not pole dancing competition???
Anonymous504493
What other sport is cool and popular that remains original to write about by now? There isn't a lot of manga about it compared to anything else.
Anonymous504493
American football looks like a battlefield with a visible battleline and everything. Id like it if there wasnt so many darn commercials.
Lenlo
I mean, its a sport. Far cry from best, but its definitely a sport.
SuperMario
@Vonter: or maybe because american football IS the best sports ever?
Kaiser Eoghan
@Vonter: Most likely due to the middle section of the original anime being the most popular bit.
Vonter
Can someone explain me how Cobra, is apparently getting an anime around some sort of space american football? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=54kNWPr43zE
Kaiser Eoghan
@Mario: Its not safe enough a film for me to properly recommend. Even to exploitation fans, they might find it too slow others would be too sensitive to it. Really una vita violenca, mamma roma, accatone, hawks and sparrows are what Pasolini is really about.
SuperMario
Now that you watched Salo, would you recommend the film to other people? I personally think it's a masterpiece but it's one of the title that I think people would break up with me if I show them this movie
SuperMario
@Kaiser: even him as a director, both Braveheart and Apocalypto don't do much to me, will see if Hacksaw Ridge going to change my mind (but I'm not to fond with war movies in general). La Notte is in my sooon-to-watch list for years, haha
Kaiser Eoghan
@Mario: Mel Gibson as a director, not as an actor =)
Kaiser Eoghan
@Mario: Thats why I prefer the neo-realist/quasi-neo-realism stuff as it deals with the worse off in society. But Antonioni was the master of being able to do films about angsty well-off people, L'aventura, the passenger and La notte for example
Kaiser Eoghan
@Mario: Its not so much that I dislike post 50s fellini moreso I feel that his throw everything at the screen and hope what sticks method can be hit or miss.
SuperMario
While I don't really mind his later stuffs because he was masterclass, I have a pretty hard time for Paolo Sorrentino's later works. The thing is I don't care much about the high class society so everything is just ridiculously over the top and glamour and I'm tired of it.
SuperMario
I haven't watched nights of cabiria but I did watch La Strada and boy, I was sad for few days after watching it. Fellini mentioned that he was inspired to make this movie when seeing a woman pushing a cart from behind. The film really carry that sense throughout its running
SuperMario
Michael Haneke put Salo in his top 10 films. Quite understandable when you think about it. Still for me one of the movie that affected me deeply.
SuperMario
I really admire Elle for its ability to maintain its sharpness because under other inexperienced directors it could easily becomes a mess. Mel Gibson, really? He's one of the few actors that I absolutely dislike
SuperMario
@Kaiser: The Red Turtle remains one of the the most refreshing time I had this year in cinema, but then again I haven't watched much films lately. Agree with you on Sonia's performance, and I still think they could cut out the first 20' of the film because it feels out of place compare to the rest of the film
Kaiser Eoghan
Debating whether to bother catching up on I am a hero or watching the film adaptation. I haven't read it since they got rid of that one female character.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Mario: I've a feeling you'll like nights of cabiria, Fellini was cranking out some solidly effective social-realist dramas in the 50s before he fell into self-indulgence.
Kaiser Eoghan
Now I have that sound euphonium compilation film downloaded, I should get to that sometime.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Mario: I also finally watched Salo, I ended up meeting it pretty much halfway. Some parts still retain the ability to effect a modern viewer, having seen his other works though its crazy just how different Salo is to them.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Mario: Seeing I, daniel Blake tomorrow and rogue one in a few weeks.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Mario: I hope Mel Gibson and Isabelle huppert win at the next oscars.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Mario: I liked the red turtle for its visual style of storytelling and animation even if I didn't get as emotionally attached to it as others did. I also watched Aquarius nd was pretty much blown away by Sonia Braga's performance. Elle is now one of my favourite Verhoeven films and its a miracle he managed to maintain such a great balance successfully throughout the film.
SuperMario
I don't care for the sequel of Code Geass at all. Why Spice & Wolf still hasn't got season 3 though is what really bugged me. From what I know their manga and LNs are selling very well
Anonymous494677
I wonder why that is...
Kaiser Eoghan
Ah, they were always milking code geass though what with those bajillion-million-billion manga spinoffs.
Kaiser Eoghan
Still say I was more fond of the character chemistry in spice and wolf as opposed to everything else.
Kaiser Eoghan
I'll likely pass on the code geass sequel, the memory I have of it has already led to its appeal dimishing for me, I don't want to ruin things further watching an un-neccesary followup. Still avoiding utawerumono's second season for same reasons.
AidanAK47
After all there are things which need sequels and things which don't. And Code Geass never needed a sequel after R2's ending. Giving something a sequel can just ruin the conculsion of the orignal series. Case in point. Eureka Seven Ao. Remember that? Cause you shouldn't. Because it was terrible.
AidanAK47
Honestly I would have preferred Spice and Wolf Season 3.
AidanAK47
So...is anyone gonna mention that Code Geass is getting a sequel?
....Because Code Geass is getting a sequel.
AidanAK47
@Anon, I am watching it as well. But I am a bit behind because I am watching the funimation broadcast dub. It's a very good guilty pleasure. I don't find it quite as funny anymore but it's still pure dumb fun.
SuperMario
@Anon487524: I'm still following it and it still remains a fun show to watch. I love the way they do the fan-servicey completely straight.
Topgavin
@anon I'll admit to watching it. While it is very simple and follows the sport anime formula religiously, it's still a blast to watch every week. This is also helped because you have no expectations for it before watching other than "oh god what's gonna happen this week".
Anonymous487524
Granted, nothing special, just one of those anime whose only worth is being fun to watch without being deep, but Keijo really is fun to watch, easily the best guilty pleasure anime in a long while to me.
Anonymous487524
I started watching it expecting an crappy fanservice anime with nothing of worth, but it ended up being actually pretty fun and awesome to watch.
Anonymous487524
Anyone here seeing Keijo?
SuperMario
What's up with 3-gatsu no Lion? Delayed for a week huh?
Kaiser Eoghan
Checked out Hedeki anno's godzilla re-boot earlier out of curiousity, its a bit plodding/dull at times but sometimes its high camp value played straight is kind of funny, having godzilla evolve during the film was a cool touch and I enjoyed every scene with him and making a Godzilla film today is still very relevant. Not a patch on the old ones though.
Anonymous482380
I think that movie was just so terrible that people made it into a meme. Stuff like "The Entire Bee Movie Except Evey Time They Say 'Bee' The Movie Speeds Up"
Kaiser Eoghan
I'm sorry lmao I had to, it seemed so appropriate a moment: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-1GadTfGFvU
AidanAK47
Fun Fact: The whole Bees shouldn't be able to fly thing is a myth.
Badesh
I think that was just a dry realization...
AidanAK47
@Topgavin, It's a meme to post the entire script of the bee movie in random places?
....I don't get the joke.
Topgavin
For anyone wondering, I think anon just copy/pasted the entire script for the Bee movie. Memes are goin strong
Anonymous479946
According to all known laws
of aviation,


there is no way a bee
should be able to fly.


Its wings are too small to get
its fat little body off the ground.


The bee, of course, flies anyway


because bees don't care
what humans think is impossible.


Yellow, black. Yellow, black.
Yellow, black. Yellow, black.


Ooh, black and yellow!
Let's shake it up a little.


Barry! Breakfast i
Kaiser Eoghan
Actually I think it was up to about episode ten or so I saw.
Kaiser Eoghan
From what I can recall I watched legend of the galactic heroes somewhere past the part with the Caligula guy.
AidanAK47
That is one thing I wonder about the remake. How are they going to make the space battles interesting? Cause for me theres only so many times you can watch tin boxes shoot lasers and explode.
AidanAK47
I didn't like LOGH until the third episode. That's when it started to catch my attention. It also helps that I have a interest in history as the plot of LOGH practically reads like genuine history.
AidanAK47
In my case the overhype didn't kill it for me as I generally try to avoid that. When I walked into LOGH I was under the impression that it would ahve merit but not be for me. After all I heard it was mostly politics and the politics of Gundam bore me to tears. Funny enough the opposite happened. The space battles bored me but the politics got me really interested.
AidanAK47
@Leahcimali, The problem is that the people who say that something is the best thing they ever seen don't actually mean it. Often it's just hyperbole. When talking we other people fans tend to blow certain things out of proportion unintentionally. Overrated is likely the wrong word but you get what I mean.
leahcimali
@AidankAK47 oh and are you going to write a review about it or because psngel already wrote a review of it you are not gonna write it ?
leahcimali
the problem is trying to rank art . Even comparing a comedy show and a story focus show is clearly impossible. @AidanAK47 do you think the overhype of some hardcore logh fan killed you enjoyment of the show ? Because sometimes when you expect nothing of something you can enjoy it more than when waiting for something incredible.
leahcimali
i hear the same thing from fan of lord of the ring, star wars and game of thrones, star trek ... etc. The hardcore fan of those says that they are the greatest things in history ... but saying there are overated is discrediting the quality of those. Nothing is perfect and again maintening equal quality in a longuer running show is impossible. But having a longer story create a more rich background
LookingForKeys
@Mario Kimi no Na ha is pretty damn good. Watched it while in Japan a couple weeks back. The story has well done surprises, and on the graphics side you can *really* see Production IG worked on it.
leahcimali
I don't think saying logh is overated is a good way to say it. All media with great aclaimed critics or even highly popular show suffer from the fan reaction. If fan claim that it is the best things that they have ever saw and you don't agree, it feels overated. But this is only pure subjectivity. Saying he is greastest thing in history is a way for fan to exprim there love
AidanAK47
However it has been placed on a unreasonable pedestal that nothing could live up to. Eva is sort of in the same boat. So yes it is overrated but that does not mean it isn't great.
AidanAK47
@Leahcimali, if anything is claimed to be the greatest thing in the history of mankind it is overrated. The basic idea that there is a single anime out there which is fundamental and universally better than all other anime regardless of genre or intent is inherently a flawed concept. I do certainly see why LOGH is so highly acclaimed and I believe it is well worth watching.
AidanAK47
@Anon, I didn't look into the details of the new LOGH remake. I was planning on doing that when I am doing an anime season preview for it whenever it's going to air next year. For a long anime it does rate highly but even then I am not certain it really needed all 110 of those episodes.
leahcimali
about your comment are you thinking the LOGH anime is overated ? i ask Because you said that there is plenty of anime you consided better .
Anonymous476875
about the remake won't it be a straight adaptation from the manga remake by the artist that made shiki ?
Anonymous476875
AidanAK47 personally i really loved legend of the galactic heroes and it is one of the anime that make one of the biggest impact on me. I found it the best "long" anime that i ever seen (more than 24 ep). But comparing it to anime with shorter format is a bit hard. you can make something that have perfect pacing in 1h30 but it is impossible with a 110 ep anime.
AidanAK47
Either way I am pretty certain that all other isn't crap to me now seeing as I have seen the so called pinnacle. In fact There are plenty of anime I consider better that LOGH.
AidanAK47
There are aspects of its story which wouldn't really work by today's standards.
AidanAK47
And I did it. I watched legend of the galactic heroes. I have slain the white whale of anime. It certainly was interesting to say the least but I think the remake coming is going to have trouble. I am in between giving it a 8 or a 9 but it's clear that LOGH is very much a product of its time.
Kaiser Eoghan
I didn't really care for this weeks flipflappers, the fanservice and also it was even more trigger than I could take.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Gavin@Mario: I'll get round to your name someday but I think this might be my last chance with shinkai.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Aidan: That disgaea review made me nostalgic because I remember my friends and I playing it back when it first came out. We found it difficult but were amused by it/liked the characters.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Aidan: Are the manga posts exclusively for series with only a few chapters translated or series that came out in the past year or so? I've been reading gunka no balthazar and enjoying it enough and think it should get recommendation out there.
Topgavin
Just booked tickets to go see it on Sunday with my little sister. Was surprisingly reluctant but I know she'll like it, I've already seen it but pumped either way.
SuperMario
Your name movie has been showed theatrically here in Aus, I'm planning to rewatch it soon in theatre and then do a review on it. Is that alright with other admins?
SuperMario
so I guess the top 6 will advance to the final are: Otabek Altin (Kazakhstan), Giacometti (Switzerland), Yuri, Yurio, JJ and Phichit? Will be very cool final event haha
SuperMario
At the very least Yuri on Ice shows me how entertaining ice skating can be
SuperMario
@K-Off: have a good trip ahead K-Off. Well, it's still better than Japan (earthquake) I guess
K-Off
Well, heading to Korea tomorrow. What a time to go. In the middle of Korea's biggest financial scandal since the 80s.
Lenlo
Is it just me, or does the Yuri on Ice opening get more colorful and detailed every week?
SuperMario
Badesh, if you like to check out their other songs, give "Tunnels of Love" and "Romeo & Juliet" a listen. Though I just discovered Telegraph Road quite recently, those 2 songs are qmong my all time favorite
SuperMario
I prefer their ealier version when the band was still together (aLCHEMY 1983), but that Rome 2005 was magnificent too. Seriously with this band diifferent live versions feel like another experience... And that song is criminally under-heard in radio too, because of its running time. A crying shame
Badesh
uhh, found it in better quality. now, THAT is a fitting present for my dad :)
Badesh
well that commentator, that sounds like he's in a soccer match, will get on my nerves though...
Badesh
if you're talking about the rome 2005 version... hell, that's some sweet music. i'll inhale that for the rest of the evening, thanks for that
SuperMario
Anyone here listen to Dire Straits? I just in the mood for their music lately. Checked out the band playing Telegraph Road live the other day on youtube and I was completely stunned.
SuperMario
@Lenlo: I considered Flip Flappers 3,5,6 to be its best so far so continue on to see if Flip Flappers is your cup of tea or not
SuperMario
For me I have a lot of stuffs to catch up on this time a year, both in terms of anime and in my RL. Time goes fast as hell
Lenlo
Started watching Flip Flappers. Thought I had it figured out, then we got Mad Max going on. I may start liking it more, cause the first 2 eps didnt do much
Lenlo
Its also nearing Thanksgiving in the states and end of semester for University, so those sorts will be busier than usual.
AidanAK47
You are far too young to be reminiscing. You can build a place for a community but you can't force one to come. I for one would think it would be easier to form one if people stopped using the Anon tag. You can change your name with the customize button you know.
Anonymous469664
I remember a time when people other than site admins were regular posters. Those were the days...
AidanAK47
But I suppose watching Westworld isn't exactly a waste of time.
AidanAK47
Downside is that I really don't have a lot of time these days. It's rather annoying. The day goes by and it doesn't really feel like you did anything.
AidanAK47
On the upside, I am nearly finished Legend of the galactic heroes. So when the Remake airs next year I will have a lot to say about it.
AidanAK47
Personally I have been rather busy lately and wanted to finish off a few things. Hence why my posts have been getting later.
AidanAK47
Anyway when there's nothing on the chat box to talk about then of course it dries up.
AidanAK47
You have unfortunate timing.
Anonymous469664
All the chat regulars have left house as well.
Anonymous469664
Four days since a single post.
K-Off
Damn, I don't know if it's the layout/algorithm/mods, but so many subreddits that I used to frequent have gotten watered down as hell. Between the influx of shills and changes to the upvote/downvote system (which doesn't properly convey controversial comments anymore, like 45 upvotes to 47 downvotes. Now it shows only a -2) it's hard to find reasonable debates or find important info
SuperMario
@K-off: and for that book the last time I checked it was $110 for you guys who live US plus free shipping. For us it's $150 not incluing the postage and few weeks delivery.
K-Off
Damn, I didn't realize that it could be that bad elsewhere. The worst experience I had was when I ordered a laser pointer from Switzerland over a forum, and the cunt didn't respond for nearly 4 weeks until I threatened to refund my $250 on PayPal.
AidanAK47
@Mario, Europe. That's the difference.
SuperMario
@Aidan: yeah I got a dispatch notice saying it's shipping now. I ordered it back in September as well so I don't know why the difference between us.
Kaiser Eoghan
I remember the days where I used to be relying on waiting for anime dvds to come out locally , looking back they were really overpriced, 35 euro for 4 or 5 episodes.
Kaiser Eoghan
My opinion on FMA alchemist ended up being all over the place because I must have watched 3 episodes every few months of it, then I stopped watching it for a year, got back into it for a few months, abandoned it for months then marathoned 20 episodes in one night to get it finished.
Kaiser Eoghan
See I've been thinking over FMA lately, if you join up the best episodes of brotherhood and the first adaptation you get the perfect show.
Kaiser Eoghan
And yet it would make sense to rewatch it. 2005/2006 were the days where I'd never marathon anything. I've seen the whole show obviously but with massive gaps in between.
AidanAK47
@Kaiser, HEATHEN. Though I haven't seen the original fullmetal Alchemist in years. Watched it way back when I started anime. Would be good to pay it a revisit with this.
AidanAK47
@Mario, you actually got a dispatch notice? Cause mine is still waiting and I ordered back in September. Says it's going to dispatch next week but I have heard horror stories about peoples orders getting canceled due to lack of stock.
Kaiser Eoghan
And there I am, reminded that I haven't seen the first full metal alchemist since back in 2006.
SuperMario
Mine is shipping already, take about 2 weeks to get here. Can't wait haha
Total users: 35

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