Posted by psgels on 25 September 2009 with categories: Phantom

Whoa, wtf…

Throughout this episode, I had no idea what the people in the shoutbox were talking about. I mean, it was an awesome episode that did just about everything it should have done: exciting gunfight, after which Scythe dies and Reiji and Helen live on, trying to search for Helen’s origins. After a bit of searching, they find that she was taken from Mongolia when she was little. It was a very fitting ending for my favourite series for the past half year.

Then the episode actually ended, and I understood. That really was daring from the creators: just when everything seems solved, they pull such a surprise ending that nobody saw coming, and they don’t even dare to explain what happened. Out of nowhere, a gunshot sounds, and both Reiji and Helen die. No extremely long death speeches, no overdramatic buildup. It’s just there, and less than a minute later they’re dead. it’s entirely left up to our imagination what happened.

And yet, somehow it made me like this ending even more. My theory of what happened is that McGuire is behind it. Something like “don’t mess with the mafia”, and he probably ordered assassins to track Ein and Zwei down. He previously left this to Scythe Master and Drei, but since the two of them failed he tried to do this a bit more subtle. Whatever assassins came, they figured that the most likely place that they would be able to find them was Ein’s place of birth. They knew this through Scythe, and they probably picked up a hint somewhere that Reiji and Helen were searching for it. After that, they only had to wait and snipe them when they arrived.

It just shows that there’s nothing like a happy end in the mafia. I really liked this ending because it didn’t try to overglorify the death of the two protagonists. It was a really subtle finale, and that’s something I can really appreciate. I admire Bee-Trains’s guts for trying to pull such an ending.

Overall, this has been such a wonderful series. It’s definitely in my Top 3 of Bee-Train series, along with Popolocrois and .Hack//Sign. It had such an amazing sense of subtlety, and yet at others it packed such a punch. With a fantastic soundtrack and a terrific sense of characterization (well, for me at least), I really consider this series to be the best of the past half year, and I’m looking forward to Bee-Train’s next series in 2010, whatever it may be about.
Rating: ** (Excellent)

EDIT: crap, I misunderstood this ending. Only Reiji died, Helen remained alive. Still, that doesn’t change my opinion, this episode rocked. Unless you want happy endings, of course. ;)

EDOT2: Major SPOILER for El Cazador!
After this, I still want to add a bit to the huge rage of people that seem to be unhappy over this episode. Watch El Cazador. that one has a happy ending in which the two progaonists live together happily ever after. Ironically, I remember how that ending also wasn’t well received. Ironic, isn’t it?

46 Responses

  1. Perrin4869 says:

    The thing is that Ein didn’t seem very dead to me at all. I think just Reiji died. And did you really think the whole fight with SM’s Phantoms was good? They died like stupid flies! They were supposed to be his masterpiece!
    I’m too tired now to write a good troll though. Expect one in the review after I get some rest…

  2. psgels psgels says:

    In my eyes, they weren’t his masterpiece. They were his masterpiece in his eyes, which Helen proved wrong when she kicked their ass easily with their own moves.

    Also, how much did you bet again on Claudia coming back to life? ;)

  3. Tan-Tan says:

    Like I said in random curiosity, there’s a meaning behind Reiji’s sudden death, which makes it tragic.

    Reiji said he doesn’t want to die so he can fulfill that one promised. He finally fulfilled it, and then…

    Technically, that’s a happy ending for Reiji. It’s what he wanted.

  4. windy says:

    I loved this quite mysterious ending that leaves it up to our imagination to decide what will happen next ! This ending reminded me the final episode of Noir, where we hear the sound of two gunshots and it’s up to us to believe the characters dead or alive, a sad ending indeed, now I think they ended up dead, but that one was also a symbolic ending that so amazed me! In this episode of Phantom I also got the impression that Elen wasn’t aware of the fact that Reiji has been shot and thought him justlaying on the grass, but I’m not sure, she smiled though, and at the very end we see another gun near there. Well, even if Elen survived at the end, she may be killed off later on , I think it’s unavoidable, it’s like they can only find peace in death itself, and she said to Scythe master she would soon join him in hell, which may actually mean she wanted to see the place of her birth before going to the world above, the sky is omnipresent in this episode, symbolizing heaven and the everlasting peace.

  5. meow says:

    Ok. I’m shocked. ^^

    Haven’t seen 26 yet but the ending sounds weird. Why kill only Reiji? What about Elen? Did Elen take out the sniper before she could be killed too? Or is the audience fooled by Reiji’s final vision of Elen’s ghost before he dies?

    Well, I suppose Reiji’s karma finally caught up to him. I didn’t mind him dying, but I would have preferred if he died so Elen and Cal might live. If she survived, she winds up alone and she’s already confessed that she can’t live without Reiji so, yea..this is a pretty bad ending. In the end, the bad guys (Inferno) won. Hm…did the game end this way too? I thought Reiji and Elen managed to get away in the game. Sorry to say, this is the kind of story I hate and try to avoid. As expected of the director who created Noir.

  6. Camario says:

    Yes, that’s why I wasn’t really sure about what to think about it at first…but speaking logically it made complete sense and does go along with the tragic nature of most of the story. After a few hours of sleep, I actually like it.

    It’s still not completely clear whether she will even want to live without Reiji though, so it’s not a matter of whether you misunderstood the ending or not, but that’s precisely the point: the whole thing is left up to interpretation.

    Could the story have ended in a different way? Yes, that’s why the game had multiple endings. There were some happy endings, of course, but almost always someone had to die in the process. The anime staff chose to surprise even the visual novel fans by taking an existing ending and adding that last bit of revenge from the mafia underworld, which was appropriate yet also quite bitter. The story is flexible enough to accomodate that outcome as an additional possibility, so in the end I’m very satisfied with the anime despite the fact this isn’t my favorite ending in and of itself.

  7. hairgreen says:

    they don’t need to kill of Renji..I mean, what’s the point in terms of the story? every conflict is resolved.

  8. ShionBaka says:

    It not really that the bad guys (Inferno) won. Since Its immpossiable for them and the life of the underworld to lose. Though Reiji and Ellen or Cal could go after them.. there would always be people to replace the ones they kill. This anime is not a Shounen title.

    Really Reiji was a dead man.. Even if Inferno wasn’t after him. From all the people he killed its not haard to beleive that at least one person would want revenge.Revenge and more so Betrayal is a key theme in the show.

    Helen remained alive, but who seriously thinks she will live? taking everything into account. Weather it was she kill’s herself or Inferno does.

    Interesing though since it didn’t really end as Reiji Ellen couple ending. No Marr. P No being together foever scene. They just felt close as they did at the end of the first Arc. And Reiji was just trying to do the same thing. I’m sure Bee-train also did that on purpose.

  9. yukifiverings says:

    I don’t think Elen was ever a target. Probably was considered already dead. After all Scythe would not want to advertise her existence, given that it would implicate him in earlier events between the Godoh group and Inferno. It makes sense that only Reiji would be on the chopping block. Boy I did not see that coming. Hardcore ending.

  10. R4diance says:

    why after Reiji dies she turn around and smile? she must see his body, they were near.

  11. panaghoy88 says:

    I’m just pissed that Reiji got shot despite being shown as the best assassin. They could have justified his death with a really impossible to survive situation. It really hurts the fans. And come on, as if we weren’t sick of protagonists dying in such a lame way. I have watched enough animes and movies to not get “surprised” by this.

  12. radical_dan says:

    There wouldn’t be so much raging if Reiji was killed in battle. It just seems a waste to get to the end and have Ein turn around and kill him. Its an obvious plot device to incite discussion. In the end, Reiji and Ein are only throwaway characters for the geniuses at Bee Train.

  13. psgels psgels says:

    dan: wait, did Ein kill Reiji? I didn’t see a gun in her hand though. I thought he was killed by that passing cart.

    Also, why would that make the characters throwaway for Bee-Train, just because they were killed off?

    panaghoy: you can be an excellent assassin, but that doesn’t mean that you can’t be killed when you have your guard down. I mean, to have seen that gunshot coming you need to have the paranoia of a drugs dealer, who are completely different people.

  14. Perrin4869 says:

    In the end no one wanted to take bets, fortunately :)
    Anyways, see the full troll at the review post.

  15. watashi says:

    The ending was interesting, though I am not sure whether I like the fact it wasn’t fully explained. However, I really didn’t see that final scene coming, even though all the time I guessed which route the story would follow. I am glad the creators took liberties. The dialog between Elen and Scythe was surely long. Have to wait for the subs to understand it. I also wanted a little more over-the-top action from the final episode.

    Overall the series was pretty good. It was refreshing to follow a seinen series. Music was great and I have to say some tunes were actually variations from the original themes (at least Cal’s pocket watch theme). Nice that it was considered. There were some flaws with the series. I don’t clearly remember the scene where Ein was shot while rescuing Scythe, but so far I have thought Ein was too far away to be able to stop the bullet. These “off-screen” deaths, which are a clichee, were the biggest flaw of the series, but I knew to expect those after the visual novel.

    If I had to pick up my favorite between summer animes Phantom and Tokyo Magnitude 8.0, my choice would be Tokyo Magnitude. Tokyo Magnitude was more unique and surprising (well, I still knew how the story would go with Phantom). It may be true, I enjoyed Phantom more though. Of course, these two are completely different genre and that’s why not that well comparable.

  16. someguy says:

    That Death (if Reiji was killed by the passing Cart) is the most fitting way for him to get killed. Inferno Do not like to Create a Big scene. And this is the way inferno kills people. With little or No scene. Now Rejij Not trying to explain or work things off with Cal and it the end coming arcoss as an Idiot or an Asshole was the low point in the show.

    The anime did a decent job but it still cant compare to the VN.

  17. Rawr says:

    It’s a bit of a stretch considering Reiji and Elen were supposed to be like godlike assassins. I find it hard to believe they would have let their guard down long enough to let someone have a shot at them, even if it were a sniper.

  18. Observant says:

    That wasnt a gun at the end it was just the bullet shell. A hand gun shell from the person either riding in or driving the wagon that drove behind him. Not to mention there was 1 of the “Masterpiece” girls left alive. The one with the cracked mask.

    I agree that this ending was very good. But at the same time I would have liked at the very least to know for sure who killed Reiji.

  19. someone says:

    What the hell? the ending didn’t make sense at all. Reiji and Elen have like esp like super powers sensing people that are aiming at them, yet Reiji just stands there in the end and doesn’t even realize he’s shot? If he died in another way, it would make a lot more sense, like if he was poisoned or something.

  20. ryvrdrgn14 says:

    I want my happy ending! *sniff* ToT

  21. Skraps says:

    Killing Reji at that point served no real purpose, wish I knew what the authors were going for when they decided to do that.

    With a name like Requiem for the Phantom, their shouldn’t be much of a surprise that either one of them died but thought I was hoping for more of an impact. Can’t wait for the funimation dub for this series.

    (Goddam Lelouch and C.C stay in your own mess of an anime and stop trying to fuck up the ending to perfectly good one).

  22. plotholemuch? says:


    They go threw the entire show being bad asses. At the very end after traveling into some back water part of mongolia Inferno some how magically sets it up for some dude on a horse cart to shoot the greatest assassin on the planet in the back.


    This ending is shit. It doesn’t provoke any discussion other then how terrible the writers are. I hope they never do another ending scene, because god they’d screw up another (otherwise good) anime.

  23. PhantomEnding says:

    It was…an interesting ending, to say the very least. If anyone didn’t notice, at the ending, in once sceen, a blossom of nightshade is shown with all of its petals, and after reiji gets killed, they show the same blossom but a petal is missing. Nightshade is pretty damn poisonous, so I’m assuming Elen ate it and killed herself.

    I think Reiji knew he was going to die, and just didn’t do anything about it. I’m pretty sure they are both happy with the way things ended. And the reason Elen smiles at the end is in order for reiji to die happily , because he was finally able to keep his promise and make Elen truly smile.

  24. psgels psgels says:

    To all those wondering why such a great assassin as Reiji would not have seen this coming: how would he have been able to avoid it? I mean, the guy on the cart was also a professional assassin who blended into his environment, and this isn’t the first time in which Inferno out-witted Reiji (like, he also never saw the explosion in his apartment coming).

  25. KamikazeSim says:

    Man, the more I have watched the last 2 minutes, I think Elen was killed with Reiji.

    She smiles and then she fades away symbolically. Then we find her laying STILL on the ground with no movement and the one petal off the flower is gone. Even though they only show one bullet shell at the end, that could be another hint that that bullet was for Elen since we saw Reiji die. Hell the episode was named after her.

    I think they were both killed. If Reiji was that close to her, why would the assassin kill just him but let her live? It was a double whack job I bet.

  26. Runekilla says:

    I knew atleast one of them will die from the start but I didn’t expect on how abrupt it was. It’s kind of cruel of letting Reiji just die like that at the end. He survived countless fights which were way harder but he ends up dieing in the most simplest way. I guess it just shows anything can happen in the world of the mafia.

  27. Eddie says:

    I have to say, this was the ending I feared from the beginning. This kind of ending has been done in all kinds of genres (from hollywood to anime:think ‘the departed’) now so many times that it is a cop-out rather than some brave writing twist. The characters get to die without struggle in their happiest moments, rather than have to live on with the weight of their past, allowing the writers to cut the character development. I feel trying to explain how one could go on after living a life like that would be much more powerful. I think them dying like that is a happier ending than living would be.

  28. DLP says:

    The ending worked for me.

    1) It was set up: we see Inferno ordering the hit.
    2) Reiji seemed to want to die, due to his guilt at what happened to Cal. He was living for Ellen.
    3) Ellen clearly survived. There was only one gunshot and unlike Reiji, she did not fall.
    4) The reason Ellen is lying down afterward is to look at the Sky of Mongolia. Her lying down symbolizes that she has come home, to the land she dreamed of, and Reiji kept her promise.

    Whatever she does now, she has a place to be.

  29. PL says:

    Just after watching the episode, I was a bit puzzled. But after giving a second thought, I quite agree with DLP’s version. Basically my understanding is:
    – In ep 25 Reiji made an agreement with Elen to fight Cal: he would kill Cal and continue to live in order to fulfill the promise he made with Elen;
    – Reiji was a normal person before becoming an assassin, like Cal but unlike Elen who was brainwashed. He may feel guilty, but he continued living to keep his promise.
    – The premise of ep 26 ending can be seen in ep 25 where Cal and Reiji dreamt of an impossible happy ending and also when Cal said that all she was doing is to destroy and kill and that she does want to continue such a life
    – I also agreee with DLP on the statement “Elen clearly survived. There was only one gunshot and unlike Reiji, she did not fall”. My guess is that she killed Reiji, just like he did with Carol
    – Finally I also completely agree with DLP on “The reason Ellen is lying down afterward is to look at the Sky of Mongolia. Her lying down symbolizes that she has come home, to the land she dreamed of, and Reiji kept her promise.
    Whatever she does now, she has a place to be.”

  30. animedyum says:

    It is indeed the perfect, flawless ending for Phantom(s). They have to kill to survive, and when they don’t have to kill… well fill in the blanks. Love this anime!

  31. neolight says:

    Yep, I think DLP is quite right with what he has said.

    Reiji has only though about keeping his Promise. Guilt certainly is heavy on his mind.

    Lots of people seem to Think that Ellen is the one living for Reiji. (Still in the end) But in the end Ellen was finally able to ‘live’ on her ownself!

    In a way it was Reiji the one who wasn’t living for himself as his guilt did overwelm him. All he thought about was keeping the promise and ‘the promise he failed to keep’ It showed quite well as Reiji voice in the 6 months later was a bit lifeless// like he was in the 2 chapter.

    I think that Ellen not only survied for the reasons mentioned above but because.. she was in the end able to live for herself.. and it would be more fitting.. I think for he to live on.

  32. meow says:

    I just managed to watch 26 at last. Been browsing through the new comments. I agree with DLP’s four points but totally disagree with this ending working. Elen didn’t hear the silenced gunshot – she probably has no idea what happened to Reiji. She had a happy, satisfied smile at the end, but I’d like you guys to consider how she will be once she finds out what happened to Reiji and whether all she said will still hold true. Having the most important thing taken away from her in her moment of serenity does not make for a good memory. It also totally doesn’t make sense for the assassin to have not taken out Elen either. I don’t consider this to be proper closure. This story is begging for a sequel, or maybe a movie, where a revenge-driven Elen goes after whoever hurt/killed Reiji this time. It’s not confirmed whether he died or not but I’m betting he did, considering how long he stood up after taking the shot before falling over with just a slight grunt. Elen was finally willing to kill her “father” for all the hurt he had done to Reiji. Imagine what she’ll do to those who killed him.

    Another thing. On the rooftop, Elen took down one of the Number sisters with hand-to-hand combat, incapacitating her and cracking her mask – but did she die? I got the impression she survived.

    Anyway, there’s no happy ending to be found here. I’m truly disappointed at this outcome. Cal’s death was bad enough but now this. This story was so brilliantly executed, right down to the final few seconds, but for it to end just like that, I honestly would like to forget I ever watched it.

  33. Tan-Tan says:

    You guys are overestimating Reiji. There’s one strong evidence that makes the murder very reasonable.

    Remember the time Cal shot a warning at Reiji when he was in his ‘normal’ life? That scene actually caught me off-guard, because Reiji could’ve sensed that, but he didn’t – at all. Not a single hint he noticed someone eying him nor the Godoh Princess.

    The more then at this quiet scene, especially after 6 months (assuming that Inferno hadn’t tracked them during that time), that he is not at all an assasin, but as a normal human being. Reiji has memories that are that of an assasin, and a normal person. We can all agree he can’t be both a normal Japanese and an assasin on the run.

  34. LLP says:

    Uh, no. Everyone else seemed to have missed the missing nightshade petal. Ellen died. She suicided.

  35. RL says:

    The only thing I really don’t get is the benefit of killing Reiji. Considering this in a Mafia perspective, it’s a waste of money, time, and resources just to kill someone who’s basically non-existent. That was really the only reason that I was slightly taken aback by the ending. If there was a more sensible reason for going that far just to kill a ghost from the past then I wouldn’t have minded it…except, there really wasn’t one except “it must be done” which just tells me the writers just wanted to make the story sadder than appropriate (and I am the type who likes sad endings…but this one was just unreasonable.)

    Anywho, just my two cent about the ending. Otherwise, besides the crappy reason why Reiji HAD to died in McGuire’s eye, it was good. :D

  36. Chosenone says:

    @ LLP It wasn’t a Nightshade. Plus even if it was its only the roots that are poison. Its impossiable! for ellen to die from injesting one flower petal.

    @ RL Well Reiji Could! come for payback at Inferno, plus I thinks its also that fact in McGuire’s eyes that Reiji if he was ever agaisn’t Inferno in a gang war, would be really Bad for Inferno. Reiji was the best! Phantom! for them.. Ellen all she did was follow orders.. and Drei did the job but made a mess and was out of control. So Reiji is the most dangerous in their eyes.

    Plus one of the key things for Inferno is “Saving Face” (see this in the second arc) IF there enemys found out abour reiji ‘about the ‘phantom’ Its not going to look good. They aren’t even able to control people in there Organazation which would not look good for them. Plus there a chance that another organization could hire Rejij (though reiji most likey wouldn’t.. but Inferno doesn’t know what he is thinking) and it could come back to bite Inferno.

    Even if this doesn’t convice you there are quite a few reason that Inferno would want to get Rid of this ‘loose cannon’

  37. RL says:

    The fact is that it’s been literally over a year (and a half? ) since Reiji worked under them, and Reiji has done nothing to them and even showed no interest in doing so. I’m sure they’ve investigated this which was why McGuire was asked if he wanted to go through with killing Reiji considering he’s pretty much a beat-up veteran dog who no longer cares about the underworld. The only reason he was targeted was because he worked under Claudia (following her orders) in which she was framed as a traitor and killed by Lizzie.

    Otherwise, in the end, he was helping Lizzie fight off the Japanese Yakuza in which he had to run away because Claudia was framed as a traitor. Therefore, since he worked and followed only Claudia’s orders, he was targeted in the same way Claudia was.

    Also, I highly doubt he was “the best” considering the final showdown. Eren’s skills are still top-notch (and, apparently, superior of those who were designed after her.) Because Reiji is a very sympathetic guy, he falters and hesitates more. Even though he still has his reflexes, it seems his “happy time” has led him to lose some of his superior skills as a “Phantom.” (And the only reason why Ein lost the title of Phantom was because Sythe Master fled from the scene and she was presumed dead.)

  38. Smudgeous says:

    @Chosenone: Assuming the plant were indeed Atropa belladonna (deadly nightshade), the comment about the root being the only poisonous part of the plant is completely untrue. There are enough tropane alkaloid toxins in a single leaf or 10-20 berries to kill an adult.

    Speaking specifically of the plant in the anime, I believe it to not be modeled after any specific plant. Mongolia does have several poisonous plants, a few of which are purple. However, the flowers and leaves of the plant in this episode are not rhododendrums, delphiniums, or nightshade. I don’t believe it really makes much difference either way, though. The plant at the end is clearly missing a petal, and Elen is not moving at all while looking up at the sky. The possibility of purposefully consuming a toxic plant is very much still alive.

  39. Chosenone says:

    Reiji might not be “the best” Well even I cant say who is the best’ But to Inferno He was the best. Since he didn’t need to be mind-controled aka Ellen.. and didn’t cause trouble like Drei. McGuire had said also.. that Zwei is a better phantom than Ein was. (Though you are right he only got the title because Ein left) But that Doesn’t mean he isn’t the best Phantom For Inferno.

    Reiji might of not shown any interest in taking down Inferno.. But Inferno doesn’t know what Reiji is thinking! and its better to be safe than sorry. Though what could of pushed McGuire into taking action was the result of SM and all his ‘puppets’ were wipped out along with a heap of other enemys. So clearly Zwei can still pose a threat he was to got agaisn’t Inferno. Mabye McGuire just wanted to clean up loose ends. I couldn’t say for sure. But it doesn’t Strike me was strange/make no sense that Inferno would of killed of Reiji.

    @ Smudgeous Well you might be right about the plant though I havn’t looked up too much informtion and am going on what alot of people have been saying. Though say it might of been deadly enough to kill you, I also very much doubt that Elen would of killed herself after. Finding a reason to live for herself. But i’m sure on that point alot of people will think mabye simliar or Different about it.

  40. Logar says:

    I might have a solution. If we look carefully, what can we say ?

    1 From the beginning of the animation, producers didn’t stop to use symbols to express things
    2 When Eren remembers her sky at the end, she says : “I think we don’t need to go on anymore”, Reiji asks if she’s sure of that, she says yes.
    3 Reiji remembers that the only one thing he wanted to do was to fulfill his promise to make Eren smile truly.
    4 Reiji is shot, we can’t know by who, and he keeps smiling.
    5 Eren says to herself that she can now truly live, her past doesn’t matter anymore. The only thing that’s important is her memories of being with Reiji.
    6 Eren is laying down, we can’t know if she’s still alive
    7 A petal is missing on one of the flowers next to Eren. Theses flowers are probably Safran, which is the symbol of life and reincarnation.

    To me, this end could make sense :

    Reiji and Eren planned way before to kill themselves once Eren would have found her past, and Reiji would have seen her smiling, because they want to start over in a new life (3,5).
    That would explain why Reiji keeps smiling after the shot (4). Of course to me Eren is dead too, maybe by another bullet, or by poisoning herself, actually the way she dies doesn’t really matters.
    When Eren says “I don’t think we need to go on anymore”(2), she means go on with these lives.

    It may sounds weird, but what really made me think that is that fucking missing petal (7). Why would the producers put that petal on middle of the last screen ? Just because this is not the symbol of death or of any ending, but this is the symbol of life and reincarnation (1,7).(actually the very last screen shows a bullet, probably the one which killed Reiji, but it can still symbolize the Ein’s and Zwei’s assassins lives.)

  41. someguy says:

    Why would the producers put that petal on middle of the last screen? It could symbolize alot of different things. But you know what makes it even harder to make sense of the scenes is that all the episodes before it aren’t clear cut in the way of explaining things as well.

    I Don’t belive that Reiji would of planned with Ellen to end their life. Reiji might not of cared (though he would want to fullfil the promise first)if he did die. But I doubt Ellen would be looking for death. She was looking forward to going to her home and in the end Ellen found these memories that she could now live with. Ellen’s voice is that of Ellen in the end. She sounds happy not like she feels trapped. Unlike Reiji who has the zwei like voice in the end and sounds like he still feels and carrys alot of guilt.

  42. SkyeDrift says:

    I just saw this on wiki!
    Elen is then shown unmoving while looking up at the sky; however a petal of a poisonous flower beside her, Oxytropis, is shown missing. The fate of Elen and Reiji is left unknown, leaving the ending ambiguous.

  43. lubu says:

    I don’t assume anyone is dead ever since the episode where they track Scythe to the docks and have their shoot out. I enjoyed the series, but I feel like the ending was edgy for the sake of having an edgy ending.

    It strained credulity to think that there was an assassin in the middle of mongolia who comes out of nowhere.

  44. Antalk says:

    What a mind f@%k for an ending! Took a while to unwind from it.

  45. Jesse says:

    Yeah im pretty sure someone was in the back of the cart and shot him,Thats my theory anyway. But Why didnt this ”assassin” kill helen too? confuses the hell out of me. But all all around great series im inpressed in the depth of the story line.

  46. Energizer says:

    A bit late but I just finished watching this. Elen died because it is hinted that she ate the poisonous flower.

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So RWBY's back. I actually miss the whole RWBY team. Still prefer Ruby's old custom more. Nora looks cool.
With the fourth episode, Vivid Strike seems to have crossed an invisible line that makes it more like the original Nanoha shows rather than Vivid. The kind of brutal beatdown delivered by the co-protagonist and the build up to it is something quite alien to a normal SoL/Sports anime show.
Ep. 4 of Tiger Mask was a lot better than the last 3, quite a hyped fight that was a full 6mins long. Will continue watching in hope of an awesomely long final fight.
Kaiser Eoghan
Kaiser Eoghan
Going back to the fanservice topic, its very easy to complain about it in anything but then something actually comes along that actually does it for you. I mean I always say that I don't watch a show/movie for its fanservice elements and stick with pictures on image boards, but then I ended up seeing a film where I actually got something out of the fanservice while watching the film its.
Kaiser Eoghan
The oujia prequel was competent genre fare, the director cared about the characters and every now and the built up a decent mood. Although jump Scares are there . And I always appreciate a horror film having a mean spirited ending. One of the rare cases where the young actors do well in a horror film. The pace is a bit uneven, rushed and a bit laggy .
Kaiser Eoghan
In the sense of how messed up/especially bleak those two episodes were.
Kaiser Eoghan
There was the sense too with both those episodes of "Jesus...I wasn't ready for that...."
Kaiser Eoghan
Though the first episode of the first season and the third episode of season 3 are very hard to beat. Adding to what I thought of s3 ep3 I felt that one hit me on the same level as s1 ep1 did so.
Though in previous seasons I generally only really liked 2 out of the 3.
@Kaiser, though the previous seasons where only 3 episodes long and you enjoyed 3 out of 6 in this season. So yo essentially get the same amount of enjoyment as previous seasons.
Kaiser Eoghan
Based on my comments, it looks like I had a mixed reaction to the third season. Three out of six, but the great was was great and forgives it but I still feel that there was more of a consistentancy in quality in the other seasons. I enjoyed every story in seasons 1 and 2.
Kaiser Eoghan
The final episode felt like a movie all on its own, I'd have gladly watched another thirty minutes of it, ending was a nice punch in the gut.
Just finished black mirror season 3. I hear people basically complaining that it's not as strong as the previous two season but I disagree. I really enjoyed this and this is a show that deserves much more episodes. Personal favorite is between shut up and dance and hated in the nation. Worst I thought was San Junipero. Overall thought each episode was interesting.
Kaiser Eoghan
On the upside I loved black mirrors fifth episode, I'm a sucker for war/action-dramas and I particularly liked the tech in this one.
Kaiser Eoghan
Yeah this is impossible for me to sit through, the romance part is also rather dull.
Kaiser Eoghan
Eh, this fourth episode is plodding and trite, feels like a bad, poorly dated 90s film.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Aidan: Third episode also instilled a great sense of paranoia.
@Kaiser: thanks for that mate. I have too much to say for Flipflappers but to put them all in coherent flow is goddamn hard. And like I said I still fell I left many details out: that gung-ho potato or Yayaka and the twins
@Friend: jugding from the last convention I went to, people loved Re:Zero customs (Emilia and Rem, Ram were highlights. Or you could try RWBY characters (I for once love to see someone cosplay Pirrha Nikos or Velvet Scarlatina)
Kaiser Eoghan
@Aidan: Didn't care much for new black mirrors second episode, then again I'm not really the target for that story. The third episode while a bit heavyhanded and predictable was suspenseful, nasty/mean and I liked that about it, did in 50 minutes what some thrillers fail to achieve in two hours.
Holo is a good one :0
Materials aren't a problem at all for the most part, except for anything too crazy like working in brass. I'd prefer it to be characters I'm familiar with.
Does it matter to you that they're from shows that you like, or are you just in it for the challenge?
@Friend Aidan has some good ones there. I'd also give the cast of Akame ga Kiru a shot, I don't like the series but it has a lot of neat character designs.
I was thinking simple as I didn't know what kind of materials you got on hand. I was also thinking of Holo from spice and wolf or Kino from Kinos journey either.
Mm, Tatsumaki might be not challenging enough to design for. Doesn't Shiki simply wear either a coat or Japanese kimono? I do work in set design and not in character prop design, but I'd love to try something that would let me reasonably challenge myself.
@Friend, Spit balling here but Tatsumaki from One Punch Man? I know the costume for that one would be simple enough. Or maybe Shiki from Kara No Kyoukai?
*I don't want to do anything too complex for my first try, but I also don't want to do anything boring. Boring would be a character like Rukia or Celty. Any ideas?
I remember talking about this with Emma/Kaiser before, but has anyone here gone cosplaying at an expo before? I thought it would be neat to try designing my own costume and try something else beside drawing on a computer.
@Kaiser, I am up to episode 4. 3 has been the best one so far.Though in all these episodes I pretty much figured out the twist from the get go. Still this shows always tends to get you thinking.
Kaiser Eoghan
I think the roles/identity thing with flipflappers, at least with the protaganist does fit in well with adolescence.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Aidan: I've only seen the first episode so far. I felt the acting was intentional and reflected the satire Brooker was going for on the shallow nature of society. Bleak as ever but gloriously grotesque.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Mario:Good in depth reviewing there Mario of flipflappers episode three.
Good god this first episode of black mirror is hard to watch. I know exactly how it's going to turn out but it's just so damn painful to watch.
Well, tbh up to where I've seen there's not much explicit yaoi in yuri on ice, only a lot of fujoshi fuel.
@Kaiser. thanks for the torrent. Gonna blaze through this today.
@Topgavin, as someone who watches a metric ton of anime I am rather surprised at that estimate that 90% of it contains Yuri.
My god those gay scenes in Yuri on Ice are hard to watch for me. Wonder if this is how it feels to be a girl watching 90% of normal anime nowadays.
okay, Flip Flappers episodic review was up. This is my lengthiest weekly review so far and I still feel I missed a lot of points. Damn you Flip Flappers
Kaiser Eoghan
You have seen the light, not needing to know everything thats happening to enjoy something ^_^
Kaiser Eoghan
I've given some consideration to reviewing that oujia film followup.
Whether you see one or the other is entirely up to your preferences, so it makes no difference to me which is worse. I have gotten very tired of generic character types, but again that's just because of the things I decide to regularly follow.
I will say if it must come down to either unnatural dialogue or unnatural character types, at leas the character type is speaking their own words and not the words of the script writer.
Or was that a black and white fallacy? Maybe it was a little of both.
@Realjustified, K-Off wasn't agreeing with me. That's a Moving the Goal Posts logical Fallacy but well I will answer regardless. Honestly it's preferable to have neither. The big mistake you are making here is that you are putting down a condiction that a show must have one or the other. But both cartoons and anime can have both. I just think it's a lot more prominent in cartoons than anime.
Like, having read hundreds of harem manga over the years, a majority of the ultimate love interest always happens to be the first girl the protagonist meets.
Wait wait wait wait. Aidan and K-Off. I get that dialogue in cartoon can seem like it was written by a script writer, but at the same time, lots of anime have characters whose sole purpose is entirely scripted. The whole spectrum of "deres" and everything. What do you think is worse? Unnatural dialogue, or unnatural character types?
You guys should really go fuck yourself, it's a solution and it's nothing short of great!
You guys should really watch the first 4 episodes of Bungo, it's a prequel and it was nothing short of great!
omg!! I just realized To be Hero was one of the show that I reviewed its 1st episode back in Chinese Animation post. I watched raw then though
forgive me if I'm a bit too overwhelmed by Flip Flappers... For this episode alone I took like 25 screenshots...trying to write a review now...
I have absolutely no idea what is going on in Flip Flappers plot. And yet for some reason I am OK with that.
Anyone out there that's a fan of crude humor should go watch ep.3 of To Be Hero. Certinately stepped it up a notch from the last two humor-wise.
One downside I can think of already is that I'm bound to lose or break one of the detachable controllers. The cost for those pieces is what I'm most interested in.
Nintendo Switch hmm? Honestly it looks too good to be true. I expect some major downsides to this thing.
I like cartoons, don't get me wrong. Certainly good for a change of pace. But there is something about the way they are written that I find rather distracting.
I don't know, maybe if I said it's like the difference from how characters talk in movie vs how characters talk in a sitcom?
@K-Off, I said one liner's or jokes. Not one liner jokes. It's hard to explain. Basically when I hear a conversation in anime even if it is based in stereotypes, it at least feels like a conversation that's being had in the moment. In cartoons however there is a layer of artificiality and it feels like characters know what a person is going to say and has a response prepared.
That's probably why some of my favorite anime in recent years haven't been very heavy on character archetypes, or were either parodies of it.
Comedic dialogue with anime in recent years have leaned too much on the idea of playing off character archetypes. The collected character vs the energetic character, for one. I'd like to see more variety. Some more word play, hyperbolic humor, body humor, etc etc.
@Aidan Not quite sure what you mean by that, because it's certainly not even a majority of cartoons that rely on cheap one liner jokes. I suppose it's entirely up to taste, but I can appreciate the energy in cartoons like Steven Universe or Regular Show when compared to the increasingly repetitive dialogue found in some recent anime.
@Topgavin: I just read that review and his main reason being Shelter is pretentious. oh well! Can't never please anyone.
Thought I'd check out the reviews for Shelter on MAl and the top review is a 1/10. Apparently because it's a cute girl we sympathise with her more, which is bad because reasons. I mean.. what? MAL never ceases to amaze me
@Mario, no. It's more that the dialogue keeps trying to push out one liners or jokes regardless of whose talking.
@Aidan: maybe because they spoke in your native language do you can feel that it's artificial, ya know? I know I have the same problem with Vietnamese drama/ cartoon and maybe Japanese people have that same issues with anime?
By which I mean, the way characters talk in cartoons is very...artificial. Like you can tell that the dialgoue was clearly written beforehand and it never really sounds natural. At least to me.
@Anon, I wouldn't. The writing and structure are too cartoon. What with the episodic nature and dialogue that generally pushes for a comedic tone.
Kaiser Eoghan
Flanagan also directed absentia which I haven't seen yet but I think someone I came across of 4chan linked it to being lovecraftian?
Kaiser Eoghan
Oculus was a film of two halves for me. Hush was a pretty standard home invasion thriller, making the victim deaf was an interesting twist but not as unique as you might think, still suspenseful though.
Kaiser Eoghan
I never saw the first oujia film. Though Mike Flanagan who did the sequel, he's never made a bad movie but he's never really made a great one either.
Kaiser Eoghan
I stick to the firm belief that cartoons and anime, visually should do and be their own thing. I'll prefer a western artstyle for cartoons rather than one pretending to look like anime style.
But this is a good topic and I'm sure everyone has their own opinions so I'm looking to hear some more arguments
@anon352392: no they aren't. For me not because of where their production based, nor their intended audience, but rather their styles, both visually and storytelling-ly, are different
Anime,” they assert, is not a “style” of illustration or animation.
That's where I differ to those guys. For me, anime is a style. In that sense, I consider RWBY, and Canadian-produced short Flutter as an anime. Thunderbolt Fantasy is not and anime-influence shows/movies that are intented for Western audience like AniMatrix or Afro Samurai are anime
@Anon nah they wouldn't be because they aren't made by a japanese producer for the japanese market. Quality isn't the question, production is
NX and Red Dead Redemption 2 trailers tomorrow.
They are good series and i honestly like them alot more than most anime series, would their quality make them anime?
What about cartoons like Steven Universe, Gravity Falls, Wander Over Yonder, Star Vs The Forces Of Evil?
In other news a sequel to an absolutely terrible horror movie called Ouija is out and it's...actually pretty good? Wondering if critics were paid off or it is legit good. Well it did have the guy who was behind Oculus and that was a pretty good movie.
Simplify the term down enough and anime is literally anything animated but the whole point of the term is to distinguish it. For to call Spongebob an anime makes me want to projectile vomit. Point is this, you say you watched a cartoon, people think Tom and jerry, Scooby doo etc. You say you watched an anime, people think Cowboy bebop, Attack on titan, etc. Whole point of the term.
For example, I don't consider Avatar or RWBY to be anime for while they use anime style, the writing is fundamentally structured like an American cartoon. Through I would consider Bloodivores an anime even though it was made by a Chinese animation company, making it technically a Chinese cartoon.
As far as what is and isn't anime I honestly think of the term as a means of distinguishing it from cartoon which gives the impression of being for children. It's like Graphic novel is to comic book. Though techically graphic novels are issues of comics bound in book form, the term Graphic novel is often used to distinguish works that go above superhero comics and whatnot.
Basically I think it was due to Porter Robinsons involvement that they didn't consider it anime.
@Aidan: Did the mods give any concrete reasons why they didn't consider it an anime?
@Mario, It wasn't the community that had the problem. It was the mods. The community made it pretty clear that they considered it anime.
So despite the art style is obviously anime, the character speaks in Japanese, and the production was animated by A1 Studios, it's not an anime? Sometimes I feel sad that the anime community keeps limiting themselves with such fixed minds.
I saw it yesterday and yes it was good. For a 5-minute story, they don't make it too overwhelme with details, and still pack an emotional punch. Moreover it elevates the song. Good stuffs.
Shelter was quite good though. It works well and the animation was beautiful. Song is not bad either. It's got a nice emotional punch to it though it's a bit simple a story.
Well anyway I only saw all this because I checked out the video for the first time and wanted to see how others thought of it with a quick scan through reddit. And I get this shitshow instead.
Playing the victim is the one really pisses off the internet. For refusing to admit you f*cked up only encourages people to shove how you f*cked up into your face. That's what really grinds peoples gears.
Yep, seen that too. The mods even put up another tread about the video and tried to guilt trip people by saying they got death threats. Look, internet rules 101. If you said or did something stupid admit to it and just walk away. Do not try to deflect blame or play the victim, that only adds fuel to the fire.
@Aidan oh yeah saw that live lol. Porter himself even commented on twitter about it, gotta love internet drama
So did anyone happen to catch the big old shitstorm of that Shelter music music when a mod of the Anime subreddit decided it wasn't "Anime" enough and removed the discussion post about it? Oh internet drama...what silly nonsense.
Finally caught up with JoJo. Diamond is Unbreakable has turned out to be much better than Stardust Crusaders. Should have waited for the season to finish through as I really loved marathoning it.
I had a feeling that might be the case considering the source materail for luger.
@Mario Oh I watched that, certinately worth it. Packed more story that some 12-episode shows do nowadays and gorgeous animation.
and I will check out "Shelter" music video to see what all the fuss is about
*this weekend to be exact.
Sounds like Luger Code 1951 is an OVA that will air next week, the same air date with "my" Zaregoto OVA.
@Mario: doesn't sound real at all to me lol
@Mario, I might be able to manage. If all else fails I can talk about the past of these historical figures.
While I don't mind watchinng Drifters, I swaer if I had to cover that show, I couldn't come up with anything to say.
Do you guys know what language the fairies speak in Drifters? It does sound like a genuine language
@topgavin: humanity has declined is a great show. It has good writing and dark, witty sense of humor. I could talk about it in length but psgels pretty much covered it all. He was really impressed by that show however.
That should be me covered till the weekend. Why do all my shows air on the weekend...
@Mario nah I've watched the whole thing but I'd heard about it at the start of this year and put it off. The dialogue between her and the fairies was great stuff, probably gonna rewatch it this weekend now that you mention it
Alright, I got three posts written up and will be throwing them out in about two hours or do.
I thought you've finished it. Yeah I love her character a lot, so cynical but witty. My favorite moment was when she read about fairy's plan to invent religions. She was like "so religions are invented?" (beat) "I've learn something new today". Priceless
@Mario Oh nice, it was one that I had heard about but never got round to. To put it in simple anime terms, Watashi is best girl
@topgavin: I just finished the series yo mentioned the other day: humanity is declined. Man, I love it. I know now I have a thing for dark twisted absurdist anime
@Ano340004: the name is Watashi ga Motete Dousunda, or to put it short Motete. I have fun with it but i'm not that enthuastic
@anon the english name is Kiss him, not me. Search through the first impressions if you need the jap name.
then that girl really loves BL (boy love)
what is the name of the anime that the girl is fat and then she got depressed because her favorite boy anime died then she got thin?
Season 7 is awesome so far too. It feels like the tone of the show is finally back to normal and it feels like Adventure Time again.
Whew, I binged all seasons of Adventure Time this weekend. The show hit a low spot in Season 6 but I think it needed to happen...Poor Finn needed the serious character development after what he did to FP.
You guys are too hard on it
Motete is very funny
Kaiser Eoghan
When it comes to gag manga and four-koma, I just eventually reach a stopping point with a comedy series in that format. Even with hidamari sketch.
I think it was typical light novel trash based on what was in the PV. I laughed that despite it being horrible that the crowd still cheered anyway, likely because it had a bath clip in it.
The PV was hilarious. I had no idea what the anime was about.
@Aidan I'm good, I'll stick with Working.
@K-Off, you could switch to something like Gi(a)rlish Number if you like. I for one am really digging the satire of the show. Plus I like that it's basically showing how an utter train-wreck of an anime can be made. That PV in the last episode was truly painful.
Feeling pretty disappointed with Working. I haven't gotten any more cynical with comedies, at least I don't think, and its flaws are so irritating.
@Adam Le, I find that with Comic book dialogue. Which is one of the reasons I have gone off marvel movies. Cartoons have it to a degree as well.
I love the instagram shots in Yuri
Maybe I can have a watch through those live action films and do a compare/contrast to see which version works better. After all movie and tv series are 2 different medium, and live-action vs animation is the topic that we never get tired of
speaking of which, the overlap between anime and live-action adaptation from manga is overwhelming. For this year alone, there were Erased, 3-gatsu no Lion, Fune o Amu, orange, and Chihayafuru (part 1&2). Those were just the ones I know.
@Adam: Don't know which genre you're into but you can try Fune o Amu (The Great Passage)
Adam Le
I can't seem to get into any of these new shows. I don't know, the dialogue always seems off to me and the forced comedy is a big turn off.
Reminds me of a thought I had when I was last at the Getty art museum. People walking past works of art hundreds of years old, but only taking a second-long glance before moving on to the next one. Not their fault really, it's only the professional critics who can understand what they see with depth.
I'm the opposite really, they're getting paid for what they said so they better know their shits
Kaiser Eoghan
I suppose I'm slightly envious of professional critics somewhat.
Sometimes you're just meant to experience the ride you know. I don't watch those explained video anymore because after all it's just one guy's opinions.
Kaiser Eoghan
Kaiser Eoghan
And I mean people who art professionals or students.
Kaiser Eoghan
I guess I'm just unsure of something, how many people watching "arty" stuff are able to pick it up on their own. By looking up an "explained video" or "explained essay" to get it, am I copping out?
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