Posted by psgels on 3 June 2011 with categories: Ano Hi Mita Hana no Namae o Boku-Tachi wa Mada Shiranai

Even for Ano Hana standards, this episode was amazing. I mean, how much can you stuff into an episode anyway? This episode went from heart-wrenching scene to heart-wrenching scene, and it just kept going! Each time showing new things about the cast, sharp dialogue and a huge heap of sincerity.

First there was Menma’s mother who actually lashed out at the group as a whole, then Yukiatsu forced Jinta to just go on on his own, Anjou confessed the feelings she had when she was younger, Jinta had a great scene together with his father, then Menma’s brother came along and as a desert Menma finally had the guts to make her presence known to the others. Heck, every single part here would have made for an amazing episode, but this episode found a way to put them all in the same episode. Now THAT’s how you take advantage of Noitamina!

I always found it a bit of a plothole that Menma didn’t just make stuff float in front of the group. Still, this episode showed that she can probably only bump into stuff, and probably thought that that wouldn’t be enough to convince people of her existence (she’s good at running away and all).

In any case though, this episode was also really good for one of the biggest strengths of this series: the way in which it puts so much meaning into its dialogue. The script in this series is masterfully written, in order to get as much out of the characters as possible. The characters here are both big liars, and surprisingly true to their feelings: they’re really able to express what they’re feeling, and this series does that in a way that I haven’t seen in a long, long while.
Rating: **** (Fantastic)

33 Responses

  1. Alec says:

    IMO, it would’ve been better if the creators didn’t do the scene where Menma had to drop her diary in order to prove that she is here.

    still… I won’t deny it’s the most epic episode yet

  2. meow says:

    IMO, it would’ve been better if the creators didn’t do the scene where Menma had to drop her diary in order to prove that she is here.

    I’m just surprised she never did it sooner. Forget a diary. Just eat a bowl of ramen in front of the others. Or present them a bowl of her buns. I was half wondering if maybe Jinta was partially hallucinating – he certainly seemed to think so. And I was a little bit surprised that she was strong enough to turn one of those search lights and turn it on for Jinta during the roadworks scene. IMHO not an easy feat if she was a living girl.

  3. Troyen says:

    I’ve been waiting for her to make her presence known since about episode two. Every time she hangs on someone’s neck, that person complains they feel a weight, so she has some ability to interact with the world. She can move objects, cook food, and eat food, why not write stuff on paper, float things around, arrange stuff in a message, or simplest enough would be to have Jintan stand in a corner under watch while everyone else picks a number between one and a billion and have her tell Jintan what it is several times in a row.

    That point aside, I’ve really been enjoying the show, and I’m especially looking forward to how the rest of the cast will act post-dropped diary. Are all of them really going to accept that as proof (looking at you, Yukiatsu)?

  4. EMChamp says:

    I keep waiting on this series to disappoint and fail to deliver on such an emotional level. Instead what I’ve gotten is 8 episodes of superbly delivered plot and rich characterization.

    As the viewer I felt so relieved for Jintan when Menma finally revealed herself. It was painful the way the others would believe in Jintan’s Menma one moment then claim Jintan was insane the next. There was a great quote in the middle of the episode where Jintan says something like since Menma wasn’t there, they weren’t all together anyway, so he might as well try to go at it alone (something like that). I guess that’s why Menma’s revelation is so powerful, because she is the one link holding this fractured group of friends together.

    As a side note, I hope they properly explain why she hadn’t simply tried to contact people before.

  5. ahelo says:

    Lol 4 stars. How long has it been since we got 4 stars in this blog?

  6. Jo says:

    @ahelo : Prolly since FMA : Brotherhood. Can’t blame that. FMA BRotherhood’s my favorite anime of all time C:

    That aside..

    I felt so bad for Jinta when he started to cry.
    Looks like this anime is going to end sadly…

  7. krystal says:

    As for the concern of why Menma didn’t reveal herself sooner, I found this really good piece of speculation on a Japanese blog.

    From the point when Menma first appears, she had the feeling that if she had her wish fulfilled, she would probably disappear. She also was sure that her wish was something that could be fulfilled only with everyone in the Super Peace Busters involved. However, as she continued to live together with Jintan, she started to think that maybe it would be good if she could just always stay this way so she never thought of making the effort to prove her existence to the others. If she proves her existence, then things would progress to the point where her wish would be fulfilled and she would disappear. But then, she realized that by not revealing her existence, Jintan who she likes so much would be hurt instead (by others around him) so she made the decision to reveal herself, have her wish fulfilled, and finally rest in peace.

    I claim no ownership of these ideas and merely wanted to post this because I found this very convincing when I first read this.

  8. ojisan says:

    Krystal’s findings from that blog sound very likely to me – everyone in the series (except maybe Poppo & Jintan’s dad) is hiding their feelings, vacilatting between addressing the situation and flinching away from it. Menma’s doing the same – she wants her wish, but not the consequences of her wish.

    Great, great episode. I like how Menma’s brother pops out of the woodwork top have his say, and how Jintan’s dad finally gets some credit for being the really great guy he is (one ojisan to another) –

  9. meow says:

    I found this very convincing when I first read this.

    Yeah. This makes alot of sense. I suspect some of the characters, especially Yukiatsu, may come to this conclusion too and may even try to argue against fulfilling Menma’s wish later on.

    Looks like this anime is going to end sadly…

    I would say bittersweet. Something like the final arc of Magnitude 8.0. I suppose it’s appropriate given the tragedy that hit Japan recently. Maybe to help some of the viewers come to terms with their own losses. I’ll be really surprised if they can get Menma to come back permanently, although a part of me wishes it was possible.

  10. m says:

    I don’t know if it was during the scriptwriting or the storyboarding, but obviously there was considerable effort put forth that has really paid off by keeping the dramatic scenes, giant crying scenes and all, from ever feeling cheap and forced. It’s not hard for this kind of material to degenerate into the author just telling you how to feel, instead of really placing you into the scene. The non-verbal cues that provide insight into the characters are also excellent.

    I also like that by comparison to many other shows that mix humor and sadness, this series never seems to strive to bounce from the extremes of either, which prevents any significant mood whiplash.

    Every time I hear that ED it’s like a bittersweet screw being turned. So whatever the mechanism, this show has certainly managed to wrap me around its finger.

  11. tomphile says:

    Though it’s a great episode, it would have been better if this series was set to go for a full 13 episodes, but I’ve heard that it’s only going for 11, which is a shame. Anyways, it’s sad that Anjou and the other childhood friends will never win in a love battle.

  12. sadakups says:

    Thanks for the info krystal. That pretty much answered my question on why Menma did not make her presence known earlier.

    And OH SH- four stars. You know psgels is liking it when he gives something so rare like that.

  13. Kei says:

    this is indeed a heart-wrenching episode. it presents the perspective of how each feels about Menma’s death, from her mom to her friends, even her little brother. with so many crying scenes in a single episode, it does not come across as overly emotional. instead every scene counts. even in the last few minutes when her friends realise Menma is with them, it is full of sincerity.

  14. Hogart says:

    Yeah, what krystal presented here is what I’ve been assuming for a number of episodes now.. the OP and ED practically scream it as well. It’s heavy-handed to drag things out this way, but as long as they adequately end it, it will still work.

    If anything, I had forgotten what a good drama was like – I’m so used to wham moments and shocking reveals in anime that I think that’s why I’m enjoying AnoHana so much.. they’re actually letting the story tell itself without forcing it down our throats as much as usual.

    It’s nice to see anime characters again that act more like exaggerated human beings than exaggerated anime characters.

  15. Jérémy says:

    This episode was soooo good :D With all those dramatic scenes I was expecting to find them cheap but the thing with Ano Hana is that they use some cliches but put so much though and feeling in the dialogues that it’s completely original and heartfelt. And I cry again and again and again xD

  16. Ryouichi says:

    As much as I’d wished for Menma to reveal herself earlier, I got shivers when they started reading the latest entry.

  17. Perm says:

    oAo All the small details with Jintan and his mom so far…I wonder if the reason he can see Menma is because he himself is close to dying?

  18. Scruffy says:

    @M I know exactly what you mean about the ED. The way they mesh the ED into the show as quiet background music initially and then when that chorus kicks in, I just get that choked feeling. This has so far been one amazing show in every single way.

  19. Joojoobees says:

    This show is so solid. It really puts most other shows to shame. Most other shows are between 50 and 95% fluff per episode, while this show keeps it down to 10 – 20% per episode, then pulls this one out, where every moment seemed to count.

  20. Sev says:

    This episode kinda failed when it came down to plot developments. Having Memna do something she could do from the very beginning to prove her existence is pretty cheap and a good example of bad writing. She could have done this in the very first episode. Even if she didn’t figure this out back then, she would have realized this as soon as everyone thought Jinta was 1. insane and 2. wrong.
    This development happened because the writer wrote him/herself into a corner. This is pretty much a deus ex machina.

    Also no, Memna can do much more than “bump” into stuff. She can cook, write, etc.

    That said, everything leading up to that mistake was pretty good.

  21. sadakups says:

    There was no deus ex machina. What are you talking about?

  22. meow says:

    So I finally got to watch this and I noticed something weird. Jin-tan’s dad woke Jin-tan up while Menma was asleep on his bed, covered by a blanket. Wouldn’t Jin-tan’s dad have noticed that a blanket is floating on Jin-tan’s bed?

  23. meow says:

    Having Memna do something she could do from the very beginning to prove her existence is pretty cheap and a good example of bad writing.

    No…I have to very strongly disagree. Making Jinta the only one who could see Menma was important plot device. It gives time for all the characters and the whole setting to be introduced and fleshed out, including Menma’s family. It kept me guessing at least as to how “real” Menma was. (See my previous post about the blanket and Jinta’s Dad apparently not noticing it.) You did notice how hard Jinta tried to avoid addressing Menma’s presence in his house, as if he himself only half-believed it himself, and how he refers to Menma as his hallucination? And we wouldn’t have seen Yukiatsu demonstrate so vividly his own feelings for Menma if not for him not being convinced of Menma’s presence.

    Writing themselves into a corner? Hardly.

  24. Sev says:

    I agree that it was important for only Jinta to be able to see Memna. It worked well to establish all the characters and the dynamic between them. Additionally, it created some tension between Jinta and the rest and whether they trusted him implicitly on the existence of Memna.
    This trust issue(and the question whether Jinta was sane) is now thrown away for sake of furthering the plot. And they did this by her using that same ability she’s shown earlier. It’s obvious that they couldn’t do this earlier for sake of drama, but I’d say that they should never have done this. My reasoning behind this is that if she could have done this earlier(and she could), she would have done this earlier. It’s fridge logic.

    Oh, and yes, this is a case of deus ex machina. Instead of having the character work out their trust issues through character development, they anticlimactically ended this plotthread in the cheapest possible way. I guess the writer couldn’t write himself out of this situation.
    To give you another example of this, take the eagles from Lord of the rings. They only appear when Tolkien placed the good guys in such a spot that he couldn’t figure out how they could get back to safety without some sort of divine intervention. By writing eagles into the story, one has to wonder why you can’t simply use them to fly to mount doom and resolve the plot at the very first book. Similarly, if Memna could do this from the get-go, why didn’t she do it back when these trust issues first appeared?

    Now don’t get me wrong. I like this series. But this is just bad writing, especially since it obsoleted one of the better parts of this story.

  25. ojisan says:

    I’d draw attention to Krystal’s input earlier on, that Menma is conflicted about having her wish granted, and thus about making her presence clear to everyone. I can’t remember her being frantic or frustrated that people other than Jintan can’t see her – it’s not like she’s been making every effort. Like Jintan, she’s chugging on day to day, toying with and also avoiding the issues most important to her. Perhaps this attitude is changing a bit, now that she’s making herself known –

  26. meow says:

    My reasoning behind this is that if she could have done this earlier(and she could), she would have done this earlier.

    Well, for one thing, Menma being the airhead that she is, probably couldn’t figure out how to communicate with others when she can’t be seen. Look at how she tried to talk to Poppo in this episode, even though she should have known he couldn’t see her. Two, she was satisfied with just being with Jinta. As the japanese blogger that krystal mentioned in No.7 pointed out, she didn’t want to disappear and was, perhaps subconsciously afraid of having her wish actually granted. This changes when she sees how hard Jinta and everyone else are working for her sake. Finally, the trigger here is her overhearing Poppo’s phone convo and later at the hideout where Jinta was about to get socked. Suddenly she has the need to prove her existence to her friends to stop their fight. Spur of the moment and pretty natural thing for her to do and it works with the story. A deus ex machina might be Menma having never shown the ability to manipulate the enviroment yet suddenly being able to write in her diary to stop the fight. And this is just a plot turn in the story. It’s not the end. It seems to resolve one conflict but opens the door to alot more possible development.

    I for one am pretty anxious to know how the other four deal with Menma. Seriously, Jinta has a much easier time because he can see and hear her. How do you deal with a ghost you can’t see or hear? You can’t read their body language or hear their tone of voice. Would they be happy or terrified? A mix of both? What happens if/when Menma’s mother gets into the mix? Remember the first Highlander movie and how MacLeod’s lover reacted when he came back from the dead?

    By writing eagles into the story, one has to wonder why you can’t simply use them to fly to mount doom and resolve the plot at the very first book.

    So um…*LOTR spoilers*?

    The eagles weren’t a deus ex machina. They were evened out by Sauron’s own flying servants. Even in the final battle, they only evened out the ringwraiths overwhelming air superiority. The ring had to be destroyed first, destroying the wraiths and freeing the eagles for the rescue. If the eagles had tried flying Frodo to Mt Doom from the start, would they have been able to get through?

    One does not simply eagle their way into Mordor. XD

  27. Sev says:

    If I recall correctly, Tolkien himself pretty much stated that the eagles were problematic in his stories. He knew they were a deus ex machina plot device. I’ll leave LOTR for what it is since this is getting derailed enough as it is.

    Even if Memna is truly too dumb to realize what she did this episode earlier, Yadomi himself could have brought it up. It would have proven his sanity and resolved all those issues.
    Subconscious denial from the very start sounds suspect. If it was like that, she wouldn’t have brought up the wish at all and instead just pestered him to get the gang back together.

    Even with your reasoning, it is still a pretty big leap not to call this a gaping plothole, or extremely contrived.

    A deus ex machina is not just limited to the archetypical god descending from the heaven to solve all problems. It applies when the solution is contrived like this one.

    Anyway, I think we’re done here. You’re clearly not going to see it any other way and neither will I. Let’s move on.

  28. meow says:

    No hard feelings I hope, Sev. I respect your opinion but was hoping to at least close the gap between yours and mine a little. I’m a bit disappointed that I failed. XD I guess we’ll chalk this one up to a story that just rubs us in different ways.

    And about LOTR, yea I just watched the movies. I never studied the novels. The opinion above is just from me watching the movies. Kudos to you for having a more informed opinion. :)

  29. Ryouichi says:

    Prevailing argument that I’ve seen about this is that: Before, they got back together and seemed to be getting along, therefore Menma was happy and didn’t see a need to reveal herself. When they start fighting and falling apart, she does this…

    Or so the theory goes.

  30. Hunter-Wolf says:


    I’ll be taking everyone’s side here .. you said this Sev:-

    “”Subconscious denial from the very start sounds suspect. If it was like that, she wouldn’t have brought up the wish at all and instead just pestered him to get the gang back together””

    Point is .. it isn’t Subconscious denial .. she has the mind of a kid and is an air-head to start with .. so having a conflicted opinion is what was happening … yeah .. she does mention her wish … but maybe she did so she finds an excuse to bring everyone together (they would need an excuse) … then she realizes that maybe if her wish is made true .. she might leave this world … but then again if the group doesn’t have a strong motive to band together they will disperse (like what happened this ep) … then finally seeing the suffering she caused (Yadomi crying, the whole group fighting, her mother .. etc etc) she made up her mind and decided to push things towards the final conclusion of having her wish granted even if it will means she will only stay with everyone for a short period then disappear.

    That explains the “time out” phrase Menma said –>i.e she made up her mind/decided to take action .. finally .. she said it when she came into the hideout .. so it isn’t really a deus-ex machina at all IMO (i used to think it is until recently) … it might not have been communicated too well .. but some people did figure it out .. it is there.

  31. Hogart says:

    I honestly can’t understand all this talk of plotholes from the POV of the live characters. It should be obvious that the characters are of questionable sanity and have chosen to struggle with a painfully traumatic incident on their own for many years.

    If they simply confronted their problems that easily it would be even more conveniently forced writing than all of this forced drama. How many broken and traumatized people do you know who have shut themselves away, who can simply say “look, here’s a ghost-girl”? Jintan has many reasons to not exposing Menma, and none of them have to be rational.. he’s a traumatized kid with self-image issues, not Sherlock Holmes.

    Possible plotholes form from why Menma herself hasn’t revealed herself, but if you’ve accepted the fact that she’s a ghost/poltergeist then you’ve also accepted the fact that the writers can contrive any rationale for her they want to avoid plotholes. She is a ten-year-old’s ghost, who apparently still loves Jintan, and would probably not want to leave his side even if she had to be a ghost. That is a pretty common theme in romantic ghost stories, after all.

  32. PL says:

    For once, I agree with this review.

  33. Taara535 says:

    Regardless of plotholes or no plotholes, it is rare that I can rewatach an episode 3 days after I originally watched it and still thoroughly enjoy it. What the writers have done with the dialog here, what the voice actors and sound coordinators have done with the tone of the show, and what the animators have done to bring the two together into a coherent and poignant whole is nothing more than amazing.

    I doubt there will be a better anime show released this entire year.

Leave a Reply

Kaiser Eoghan
Kaiser Eoghan
Going back to the fanservice topic, its very easy to complain about it in anything but then something actually comes along that actually does it for you. I mean I always say that I don't watch a show/movie for its fanservice elements and stick with pictures on image boards, but then I ended up seeing a film where I actually got something out of the fanservice while watching the film its.
Kaiser Eoghan
The oujia prequel was competent genre fare, the director cared about the characters and every now and the built up a decent mood. Although jump Scares are there . And I always appreciate a horror film having a mean spirited ending. One of the rare cases where the young actors do well in a horror film. The pace is a bit uneven, rushed and a bit laggy .
Kaiser Eoghan
In the sense of how messed up/especially bleak those two episodes were.
Kaiser Eoghan
There was the sense too with both those episodes of "Jesus...I wasn't ready for that...."
Kaiser Eoghan
Though the first episode of the first season and the third episode of season 3 are very hard to beat. Adding to what I thought of s3 ep3 I felt that one hit me on the same level as s1 ep1 did so.
Though in previous seasons I generally only really liked 2 out of the 3.
@Kaiser, though the previous seasons where only 3 episodes long and you enjoyed 3 out of 6 in this season. So yo essentially get the same amount of enjoyment as previous seasons.
Kaiser Eoghan
Based on my comments, it looks like I had a mixed reaction to the third season. Three out of six, but the great was was great and forgives it but I still feel that there was more of a consistentancy in quality in the other seasons. I enjoyed every story in seasons 1 and 2.
Kaiser Eoghan
The final episode felt like a movie all on its own, I'd have gladly watched another thirty minutes of it, ending was a nice punch in the gut.
Just finished black mirror season 3. I hear people basically complaining that it's not as strong as the previous two season but I disagree. I really enjoyed this and this is a show that deserves much more episodes. Personal favorite is between shut up and dance and hated in the nation. Worst I thought was San Junipero. Overall thought each episode was interesting.
Kaiser Eoghan
On the upside I loved black mirrors fifth episode, I'm a sucker for war/action-dramas and I particularly liked the tech in this one.
Kaiser Eoghan
Yeah this is impossible for me to sit through, the romance part is also rather dull.
Kaiser Eoghan
Eh, this fourth episode is plodding and trite, feels like a bad, poorly dated 90s film.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Aidan: Third episode also instilled a great sense of paranoia.
@Kaiser: thanks for that mate. I have too much to say for Flipflappers but to put them all in coherent flow is goddamn hard. And like I said I still fell I left many details out: that gung-ho potato or Yayaka and the twins
@Friend: jugding from the last convention I went to, people loved Re:Zero customs (Emilia and Rem, Ram were highlights. Or you could try RWBY characters (I for once love to see someone cosplay Pirrha Nikos or Velvet Scarlatina)
Kaiser Eoghan
@Aidan: Didn't care much for new black mirrors second episode, then again I'm not really the target for that story. The third episode while a bit heavyhanded and predictable was suspenseful, nasty/mean and I liked that about it, did in 50 minutes what some thrillers fail to achieve in two hours.
Holo is a good one :0
Materials aren't a problem at all for the most part, except for anything too crazy like working in brass. I'd prefer it to be characters I'm familiar with.
Does it matter to you that they're from shows that you like, or are you just in it for the challenge?
@Friend Aidan has some good ones there. I'd also give the cast of Akame ga Kiru a shot, I don't like the series but it has a lot of neat character designs.
I was thinking simple as I didn't know what kind of materials you got on hand. I was also thinking of Holo from spice and wolf or Kino from Kinos journey either.
Mm, Tatsumaki might be not challenging enough to design for. Doesn't Shiki simply wear either a coat or Japanese kimono? I do work in set design and not in character prop design, but I'd love to try something that would let me reasonably challenge myself.
@Friend, Spit balling here but Tatsumaki from One Punch Man? I know the costume for that one would be simple enough. Or maybe Shiki from Kara No Kyoukai?
*I don't want to do anything too complex for my first try, but I also don't want to do anything boring. Boring would be a character like Rukia or Celty. Any ideas?
I remember talking about this with Emma/Kaiser before, but has anyone here gone cosplaying at an expo before? I thought it would be neat to try designing my own costume and try something else beside drawing on a computer.
@Kaiser, I am up to episode 4. 3 has been the best one so far.Though in all these episodes I pretty much figured out the twist from the get go. Still this shows always tends to get you thinking.
Kaiser Eoghan
I think the roles/identity thing with flipflappers, at least with the protaganist does fit in well with adolescence.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Aidan: I've only seen the first episode so far. I felt the acting was intentional and reflected the satire Brooker was going for on the shallow nature of society. Bleak as ever but gloriously grotesque.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Mario:Good in depth reviewing there Mario of flipflappers episode three.
Good god this first episode of black mirror is hard to watch. I know exactly how it's going to turn out but it's just so damn painful to watch.
Well, tbh up to where I've seen there's not much explicit yaoi in yuri on ice, only a lot of fujoshi fuel.
@Kaiser. thanks for the torrent. Gonna blaze through this today.
@Topgavin, as someone who watches a metric ton of anime I am rather surprised at that estimate that 90% of it contains Yuri.
My god those gay scenes in Yuri on Ice are hard to watch for me. Wonder if this is how it feels to be a girl watching 90% of normal anime nowadays.
okay, Flip Flappers episodic review was up. This is my lengthiest weekly review so far and I still feel I missed a lot of points. Damn you Flip Flappers
Kaiser Eoghan
You have seen the light, not needing to know everything thats happening to enjoy something ^_^
Kaiser Eoghan
I've given some consideration to reviewing that oujia film followup.
Whether you see one or the other is entirely up to your preferences, so it makes no difference to me which is worse. I have gotten very tired of generic character types, but again that's just because of the things I decide to regularly follow.
I will say if it must come down to either unnatural dialogue or unnatural character types, at leas the character type is speaking their own words and not the words of the script writer.
Or was that a black and white fallacy? Maybe it was a little of both.
@Realjustified, K-Off wasn't agreeing with me. That's a Moving the Goal Posts logical Fallacy but well I will answer regardless. Honestly it's preferable to have neither. The big mistake you are making here is that you are putting down a condiction that a show must have one or the other. But both cartoons and anime can have both. I just think it's a lot more prominent in cartoons than anime.
Like, having read hundreds of harem manga over the years, a majority of the ultimate love interest always happens to be the first girl the protagonist meets.
Wait wait wait wait. Aidan and K-Off. I get that dialogue in cartoon can seem like it was written by a script writer, but at the same time, lots of anime have characters whose sole purpose is entirely scripted. The whole spectrum of "deres" and everything. What do you think is worse? Unnatural dialogue, or unnatural character types?
You guys should really go fuck yourself, it's a solution and it's nothing short of great!
You guys should really watch the first 4 episodes of Bungo, it's a prequel and it was nothing short of great!
omg!! I just realized To be Hero was one of the show that I reviewed its 1st episode back in Chinese Animation post. I watched raw then though
forgive me if I'm a bit too overwhelmed by Flip Flappers... For this episode alone I took like 25 screenshots...trying to write a review now...
I have absolutely no idea what is going on in Flip Flappers plot. And yet for some reason I am OK with that.
Anyone out there that's a fan of crude humor should go watch ep.3 of To Be Hero. Certinately stepped it up a notch from the last two humor-wise.
One downside I can think of already is that I'm bound to lose or break one of the detachable controllers. The cost for those pieces is what I'm most interested in.
Nintendo Switch hmm? Honestly it looks too good to be true. I expect some major downsides to this thing.
I like cartoons, don't get me wrong. Certainly good for a change of pace. But there is something about the way they are written that I find rather distracting.
I don't know, maybe if I said it's like the difference from how characters talk in movie vs how characters talk in a sitcom?
@K-Off, I said one liner's or jokes. Not one liner jokes. It's hard to explain. Basically when I hear a conversation in anime even if it is based in stereotypes, it at least feels like a conversation that's being had in the moment. In cartoons however there is a layer of artificiality and it feels like characters know what a person is going to say and has a response prepared.
That's probably why some of my favorite anime in recent years haven't been very heavy on character archetypes, or were either parodies of it.
Comedic dialogue with anime in recent years have leaned too much on the idea of playing off character archetypes. The collected character vs the energetic character, for one. I'd like to see more variety. Some more word play, hyperbolic humor, body humor, etc etc.
@Aidan Not quite sure what you mean by that, because it's certainly not even a majority of cartoons that rely on cheap one liner jokes. I suppose it's entirely up to taste, but I can appreciate the energy in cartoons like Steven Universe or Regular Show when compared to the increasingly repetitive dialogue found in some recent anime.
@Topgavin: I just read that review and his main reason being Shelter is pretentious. oh well! Can't never please anyone.
Thought I'd check out the reviews for Shelter on MAl and the top review is a 1/10. Apparently because it's a cute girl we sympathise with her more, which is bad because reasons. I mean.. what? MAL never ceases to amaze me
@Mario, no. It's more that the dialogue keeps trying to push out one liners or jokes regardless of whose talking.
@Aidan: maybe because they spoke in your native language do you can feel that it's artificial, ya know? I know I have the same problem with Vietnamese drama/ cartoon and maybe Japanese people have that same issues with anime?
By which I mean, the way characters talk in cartoons is very...artificial. Like you can tell that the dialgoue was clearly written beforehand and it never really sounds natural. At least to me.
@Anon, I wouldn't. The writing and structure are too cartoon. What with the episodic nature and dialogue that generally pushes for a comedic tone.
Kaiser Eoghan
Flanagan also directed absentia which I haven't seen yet but I think someone I came across of 4chan linked it to being lovecraftian?
Kaiser Eoghan
Oculus was a film of two halves for me. Hush was a pretty standard home invasion thriller, making the victim deaf was an interesting twist but not as unique as you might think, still suspenseful though.
Kaiser Eoghan
I never saw the first oujia film. Though Mike Flanagan who did the sequel, he's never made a bad movie but he's never really made a great one either.
Kaiser Eoghan
I stick to the firm belief that cartoons and anime, visually should do and be their own thing. I'll prefer a western artstyle for cartoons rather than one pretending to look like anime style.
But this is a good topic and I'm sure everyone has their own opinions so I'm looking to hear some more arguments
@anon352392: no they aren't. For me not because of where their production based, nor their intended audience, but rather their styles, both visually and storytelling-ly, are different
Anime,” they assert, is not a “style” of illustration or animation.
That's where I differ to those guys. For me, anime is a style. In that sense, I consider RWBY, and Canadian-produced short Flutter as an anime. Thunderbolt Fantasy is not and anime-influence shows/movies that are intented for Western audience like AniMatrix or Afro Samurai are anime
@Anon nah they wouldn't be because they aren't made by a japanese producer for the japanese market. Quality isn't the question, production is
NX and Red Dead Redemption 2 trailers tomorrow.
They are good series and i honestly like them alot more than most anime series, would their quality make them anime?
What about cartoons like Steven Universe, Gravity Falls, Wander Over Yonder, Star Vs The Forces Of Evil?
In other news a sequel to an absolutely terrible horror movie called Ouija is out and it's...actually pretty good? Wondering if critics were paid off or it is legit good. Well it did have the guy who was behind Oculus and that was a pretty good movie.
Simplify the term down enough and anime is literally anything animated but the whole point of the term is to distinguish it. For to call Spongebob an anime makes me want to projectile vomit. Point is this, you say you watched a cartoon, people think Tom and jerry, Scooby doo etc. You say you watched an anime, people think Cowboy bebop, Attack on titan, etc. Whole point of the term.
For example, I don't consider Avatar or RWBY to be anime for while they use anime style, the writing is fundamentally structured like an American cartoon. Through I would consider Bloodivores an anime even though it was made by a Chinese animation company, making it technically a Chinese cartoon.
As far as what is and isn't anime I honestly think of the term as a means of distinguishing it from cartoon which gives the impression of being for children. It's like Graphic novel is to comic book. Though techically graphic novels are issues of comics bound in book form, the term Graphic novel is often used to distinguish works that go above superhero comics and whatnot.
Basically I think it was due to Porter Robinsons involvement that they didn't consider it anime.
@Aidan: Did the mods give any concrete reasons why they didn't consider it an anime?
@Mario, It wasn't the community that had the problem. It was the mods. The community made it pretty clear that they considered it anime.
So despite the art style is obviously anime, the character speaks in Japanese, and the production was animated by A1 Studios, it's not an anime? Sometimes I feel sad that the anime community keeps limiting themselves with such fixed minds.
I saw it yesterday and yes it was good. For a 5-minute story, they don't make it too overwhelme with details, and still pack an emotional punch. Moreover it elevates the song. Good stuffs.
Shelter was quite good though. It works well and the animation was beautiful. Song is not bad either. It's got a nice emotional punch to it though it's a bit simple a story.
Well anyway I only saw all this because I checked out the video for the first time and wanted to see how others thought of it with a quick scan through reddit. And I get this shitshow instead.
Playing the victim is the one really pisses off the internet. For refusing to admit you f*cked up only encourages people to shove how you f*cked up into your face. That's what really grinds peoples gears.
Yep, seen that too. The mods even put up another tread about the video and tried to guilt trip people by saying they got death threats. Look, internet rules 101. If you said or did something stupid admit to it and just walk away. Do not try to deflect blame or play the victim, that only adds fuel to the fire.
@Aidan oh yeah saw that live lol. Porter himself even commented on twitter about it, gotta love internet drama
So did anyone happen to catch the big old shitstorm of that Shelter music music when a mod of the Anime subreddit decided it wasn't "Anime" enough and removed the discussion post about it? Oh internet drama...what silly nonsense.
Finally caught up with JoJo. Diamond is Unbreakable has turned out to be much better than Stardust Crusaders. Should have waited for the season to finish through as I really loved marathoning it.
I had a feeling that might be the case considering the source materail for luger.
@Mario Oh I watched that, certinately worth it. Packed more story that some 12-episode shows do nowadays and gorgeous animation.
and I will check out "Shelter" music video to see what all the fuss is about
*this weekend to be exact.
Sounds like Luger Code 1951 is an OVA that will air next week, the same air date with "my" Zaregoto OVA.
@Mario: doesn't sound real at all to me lol
@Mario, I might be able to manage. If all else fails I can talk about the past of these historical figures.
While I don't mind watchinng Drifters, I swaer if I had to cover that show, I couldn't come up with anything to say.
Do you guys know what language the fairies speak in Drifters? It does sound like a genuine language
@topgavin: humanity has declined is a great show. It has good writing and dark, witty sense of humor. I could talk about it in length but psgels pretty much covered it all. He was really impressed by that show however.
That should be me covered till the weekend. Why do all my shows air on the weekend...
@Mario nah I've watched the whole thing but I'd heard about it at the start of this year and put it off. The dialogue between her and the fairies was great stuff, probably gonna rewatch it this weekend now that you mention it
Alright, I got three posts written up and will be throwing them out in about two hours or do.
I thought you've finished it. Yeah I love her character a lot, so cynical but witty. My favorite moment was when she read about fairy's plan to invent religions. She was like "so religions are invented?" (beat) "I've learn something new today". Priceless
@Mario Oh nice, it was one that I had heard about but never got round to. To put it in simple anime terms, Watashi is best girl
@topgavin: I just finished the series yo mentioned the other day: humanity is declined. Man, I love it. I know now I have a thing for dark twisted absurdist anime
@Ano340004: the name is Watashi ga Motete Dousunda, or to put it short Motete. I have fun with it but i'm not that enthuastic
@anon the english name is Kiss him, not me. Search through the first impressions if you need the jap name.
then that girl really loves BL (boy love)
what is the name of the anime that the girl is fat and then she got depressed because her favorite boy anime died then she got thin?
Season 7 is awesome so far too. It feels like the tone of the show is finally back to normal and it feels like Adventure Time again.
Whew, I binged all seasons of Adventure Time this weekend. The show hit a low spot in Season 6 but I think it needed to happen...Poor Finn needed the serious character development after what he did to FP.
You guys are too hard on it
Motete is very funny
Kaiser Eoghan
When it comes to gag manga and four-koma, I just eventually reach a stopping point with a comedy series in that format. Even with hidamari sketch.
I think it was typical light novel trash based on what was in the PV. I laughed that despite it being horrible that the crowd still cheered anyway, likely because it had a bath clip in it.
The PV was hilarious. I had no idea what the anime was about.
@Aidan I'm good, I'll stick with Working.
@K-Off, you could switch to something like Gi(a)rlish Number if you like. I for one am really digging the satire of the show. Plus I like that it's basically showing how an utter train-wreck of an anime can be made. That PV in the last episode was truly painful.
Feeling pretty disappointed with Working. I haven't gotten any more cynical with comedies, at least I don't think, and its flaws are so irritating.
@Adam Le, I find that with Comic book dialogue. Which is one of the reasons I have gone off marvel movies. Cartoons have it to a degree as well.
I love the instagram shots in Yuri
Maybe I can have a watch through those live action films and do a compare/contrast to see which version works better. After all movie and tv series are 2 different medium, and live-action vs animation is the topic that we never get tired of
speaking of which, the overlap between anime and live-action adaptation from manga is overwhelming. For this year alone, there were Erased, 3-gatsu no Lion, Fune o Amu, orange, and Chihayafuru (part 1&2). Those were just the ones I know.
@Adam: Don't know which genre you're into but you can try Fune o Amu (The Great Passage)
Adam Le
I can't seem to get into any of these new shows. I don't know, the dialogue always seems off to me and the forced comedy is a big turn off.
Reminds me of a thought I had when I was last at the Getty art museum. People walking past works of art hundreds of years old, but only taking a second-long glance before moving on to the next one. Not their fault really, it's only the professional critics who can understand what they see with depth.
I'm the opposite really, they're getting paid for what they said so they better know their shits
Kaiser Eoghan
I suppose I'm slightly envious of professional critics somewhat.
Sometimes you're just meant to experience the ride you know. I don't watch those explained video anymore because after all it's just one guy's opinions.
Kaiser Eoghan
Kaiser Eoghan
And I mean people who art professionals or students.
Kaiser Eoghan
I guess I'm just unsure of something, how many people watching "arty" stuff are able to pick it up on their own. By looking up an "explained video" or "explained essay" to get it, am I copping out?
Kaiser Eoghan
I feel like I've begun getting on board with the european art stuff but am really only scratching the surface with the Chinese and that stuff.
Kaiser Eoghan
And find myself missing whats going on sometimes.
Kaiser Eoghan
I'll admit I do find it frustrating, that even though I can like art films, emotionally connect at times, appreciate the visual techniques and admire them for being so different without looking up analysis by people far smarter than myself I honestly feel lost sometimes as to the meaning.
@Kaiser: Apichatphong Weerseethakul's films are so otherworldly and spiritual that I wouldn't dare to call them "dreams" anymore. Check out his "Uncle Boonmie", "Syndromes and a Century", "Cemetery of Splendors". he has such singular vision that just watch and experience his films are rewarding enough
@afgm: well, if we really go over-analyze it, bunnies can represent desire for example ^^
like eating sweet snow is so randomness for me
@Badesh: the things you said might be something I might do in the future. After all I love dissecting symbolism. But for Flip Flappers I need to know more what are intentional and what are randomness first
So Papika is corrupting Cocona? That would make some sense I guess
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