Posted by psgels on 27 October 2011 with categories: Guilty Crown



Seriously, what is this show doing in Noitamina? I mean, if this was going to be an experiment for another 2-cour series, there would have been much better series for that: Chihayafuru, Fate/Zero or even Last Exile.

I know that series need time to build up. I’m not expecting series to immediately deliver right from the start. Instead what I’m looking for in the opening episodes of a series is hints that it knows what it’s doing: hints that it knows what good storytelling is, that its characters are well acted. Those kinds of things. I’m not seeing them here.

In fact, this episode showed even more that this show is wasted potential. There are two main reasons for that. First of all, this episode shows the main character running around and drawing weapons out of everyone. In the end, this just turns out to be him random props out of people and moving on to the next. This show doesn’t do anything with them. Or, take the point at which the male lead and his best friend make up and promise each other not to tell about each other’s secrets. The main character conveniently tells him that he did that, instead of the creators showing how he did it. It’s a pretty big point here, as only second later it turns out that the friend did screw him over in the end. That’s just lazy storytelling.

And yeah, then there was the fact that this episode was full of cliches. I mean, even Fractale wasn’t this bad. The fanservice was incredibly pointless, the jokes were the same you see everywhere (and of course the same old boob joke couldn’t be missing). Oh, and why did the female lead move in with the male lead again? I mean, what exactly has she actually done in this series? She’s been completely useless so far!

There really isn’t anything that really stands out in this series. The whole drama around Shu’s friend is very inconsistent: on one hand we have these terrorists who know perfectly well that they will be tortured to death if they get caught, and they act surprisingly calm to one of their comrades (who has vital information and weapons for their plans) gets too naive and gets caught. Shu meanwhile is a wimp in the bad way. To compare him with Mirai Nikki: there the lead is a wimp, but he knows he’s a wimp, and at the same time he has legitimate reasons for trying to survive. Here, I have no idea what it is that the male lead wants. On one hand he wants to be left alone, then he wants to help the terrorists again, but then he’s too scared to look people into the eyes… he doesn’t really seem to understand the situation he’s in.

The thing is also that I praised the first episode for looking gorgeous. The thing is, that even in this area this show can be eclipsed if it isn’t careful. Last Exile is well on its way to show better graphics than this series, Un-Go is well on its way with much better artistic direction, and the same goes for Chihayafuru. This show has the budget. It has the inbetween animation, but it doesn’t seem to want to do anything with it.
Rating: — (Lacking)

54 Responses

  1. Interstella5555 says:

    This show is beyond generic it’s not even funny it offers nothing to me. I want to drop it but I can’t shake the feeling it has potential.

  2. nexus says:

    The episode started out so so but ended up good. This episode is actually getting better reception then the previous one from pretty much every where else but here.

    Can’t wait to see how he gets out of this shit. I still think you need to chill and stop being so hard on the series. I am watching a lot of shows this season but this show,f/z and mirai nikki are the only shows I look forward to on a weekly basis. Un-Go is doing a pretty terrible job trying to tell mystery stories. I can see why it only got 11 episodes while gc is getting 22.

  3. Kivos says:

    The only thing lacking here is this guys taste.
    Un-go= A joke
    Last Exile= Boring
    Chihayafuru= Generic drama.

    Also I guess you must have no friends, reason I say that is because if you have a really close friend that you think you can sit down with and discuss serious stuff with him and laugh about it then you also wouldn’t expect him to betray you in such a way. The backstabbing part was well done in that since.

  4. Flawfinder says:

    @nexus This is getting a better reception? Really? I’ll have to look into that later and see why, as I can’t see it. The only thing that was kind of cool was the cliffhanger, but the events leading up to it were terrible, and the only thing it accomplished was making me want to see the next episode because it can’t be worse than this.

    This episode, in addition to being boring, was ungodly annoying. The entire scene with the boob grab didn’t make any sense, the comedy was predictable, the characters are beyond cut-outs, and the stuff with Yahiro was just lazy. Where’s the story? Where’s the character depth? I mean, did the writers turn their brains off or something? Give us a reason to care about what’s happening you damn anime!

  5. Interstella5555 says:

    @Kivos stop being so childish attack the argument not the person. You can’t make a decent argument so you resort to petty insults. If you don’t like this site so much then leave get over yourself. It’s one thing to criticize which is fine but don’t go on a angry tantrum.

  6. Guest says:

    Shu’s friend calls him a moron, and then Shu is still moping about it when he’s on the train (something like “Doesn’t he think I’m sensitive about what people say too?”). Played straight, not ironically or for lols. What a loser.

    Inori is a comically bad idea for a leading lady: she’s clearly got some kind of “I’m already-dead” complex, and dear old Shu brought her back to life when he pulled out that sword.

    This show is actually well into so-bad-it’s-good range. I hope it goes further that way and doesn’t settle into mediocrity.

  7. Guest says:

    Also it’s pretty obvious how it got onto noitamina: on paper it’s like the best elements of all the popular genres and done by a lead staff with a solid pedigree. Greenlit, end of story.

  8. Silty says:

    What’s the difference between this show and Blood-C? Why was Blood-C given more of a chance?

  9. Firechick says:

    Psgels, I think you should drop Guilty Crown while it’s still generic and dumb. For your own safety.

  10. Puran says:

    Blood c had a pretty cool atmosphere. Guilty Crown has…. Nothing? This episode didn’t even try to have any interesting visuals.

  11. Stark says:

    Why is everyone so tsundere for Guilty Crown?

    On My Anime List it’s the most watched show of the season.

    On the most popular streaming websites it gets the most views each week.

    The opening on youtube got 250k views in 5 days before it got taken down.

    You people need to be honest with yourself and just admit that your enjoying this.

  12. Chris says:

    ^ Just because something is popular does no mean it’s good.

  13. Stark says:

    @Chris Yes I am very well aware that popularity doesn’t = quality but for some reason for all the hate it gets people continue to watch it. If you didn’t like this episode I advice you just drop it.

  14. Stark says:

    advise* >.>

  15. AidanAK47 says:

    I don’t know Stark. I too think this show is wasted potential. But god knows I am probably going to watch it to the end.

  16. Flawfinder says:

    @Chris I’m continuing to watch it because I’m trying to convince myself that it’s suffering the same problems Eureka Seven had. Also, I refuse to believe that something so hyped, along with a great studio and creative writers, can generate a letdown.

  17. Chris says:

    @Stark: I guess we just have another Blood C on our hands! :p

    I think the reason the show gets so much attention is because there really are some anime fans who just prefer the better looking and less experimental shows. Many new and young anime fans need something to ease them into the medium and Guilty Crown is a good way to start. People who hate it may be vocal about it, but I doubt most of them are following it.

  18. ShyBlue says:

    Guilty Crown sticks with the most generic storyline possible along with sorely out-of-place fanservice, flat characters, and every stereotype for a shounen anime that has ever come into existence. It’s so bad, it’s laughable. I enjoy GC greatly by laughing at just how insipid and shallow it is. But I just really don’t understand those who consider it the new masterpiece of the season.

    Honestly, despite all of Un-Go’s detractors, Un-Go is probably my favorite show this season. The direction is a little bit shaky, the mysteries are crammed into single episodes, and the characters are all likeable, but not very interesting. LOADS of flaws. But you know what? It actually tries to do something interesting by re-inventing the detective murder genre. If anything, it doesn’t adhere to the tried and true and does all sorts of new interesting things. This element is completely lacking in Guilty Crown.

    I honestly can’t understand the people who rave about GC and glossing over all of its painfully apparent flaws while taking Un-Go and nitpicking at every little detail that it doesn’t do perfectly. I mean, seriously?

  19. Snowolf says:

    I’m pretty sure that most people around here like me are just watching this show for the pretty, and not the plot, because god, I haven’t seen anything this dull in noitaminA since….I don’t even know.

    @Stark: I think psgels is watching it mainly because he still has some hope (I stress some) for the plot and he also enjoys the animation? But like he said, if it continues down this path not even the animation can be a reason alone and he’ll probably drop it.

    But yeah, I’d say my situation is pretty similar to Interstella’s at the moment.

  20. Souther says:

    Well, I still believe there are way too many complaints and too much exaggerated cynicism here, for something like Guilty Crown that’s nothing more than a generic action show with good production values. You’re expecting too much.

    But at the same time…I also think this series isn’t really convincing me to keep watching, so even if my complaints are far less hyper-critical, I’m not sure I can stand it either.

  21. Puran says:

    @Stark: Well, last week people were saying keep watching it’s too soon to judge it!… So anyway I am dropping it. I might pick it up again if some miracle happens and it suddenly goes towards an interesting direction.

  22. HyperSauce says:

    i think people have varying opinions. some people like it and some people don’t. i, myself, am not hating it, but do think it’s disappointing so far. i do hope it improves and moreso believe that it will. it is clearly trying to diverge (although only slightly) from the norm. shu didn’t join the undertakers and the end of this episode was also unexpected and clearly a catalyst for future events. the universe seems interesting enough so i’m going to keep watching this.

  23. Interstella5555 says:

    @Stark Ok so you know popular doesn’t equal quality why did you bring it. You also talked about it’s numbers that in it’s self make you a hypocrite. Not everybody has the same regards for the anime YOU like. I’m a hater because someone is more critical and looks at the bigger picture. If thats the title someone want to give more or anymore so be it know that you are wrong. Also I watch because I want to truly see where this is going. I want to see if it picks and gets better HERP DERP.

  24. Stark says:

    @ Interstella5555 oh wow bro…talk about kivos acting childish? What are you acting like?
    I was only bringing up it’s popularity because it surprises me more people are watching this then some other things.

  25. Machi says:

    @Chris: I think Flawfinder and you pretty much summed up the reason for its following. It has production behind as well as being ‘easier to access’ however the criticism against it is pretty unanimous, its not just a bunch of random hate of trying to find a flaw for it. Which is that its in the Noitamina.

    Unfortunately, that slot carries with it a certain quality that so far Guilty Crown, after the first episode, has not been able to live up to. In addition the show was pretty well hyped so some are surprised precisely by the lack of risk that the show is taking. Some can see this as a good thing as you do in making a more accessible anime but really with the production crew and cast behind it WHY NOT take a risk? This again goes back in relation to the Noitamina slot which again is precisely a slot for more experimental anime or those that take risk or having quite a mature target audience, all of which Guilty Crown appears rather misplaced as of late.

    So far with whats shown its been pretty ok to mediocre, can’t really say anything too conclusively at this point, but it just looks much poorer than it is because of the coveted slot it took.

  26. Flawfinder says:

    @Stark I guess that’s true. However, if I dropped things early, I would have missed out on a lot of my favorite anime series. If it was long-running, I probably would, but it’s not. And I have time. And as much as these episodes annoy me, I don’t regret watching them.

  27. Guest says:

    People hate wasted potential more than they hate outright suckage.

    Guilty Crown is more of a “grossly wasted potential” show than an outright sucky show.

    A few edits here and there, a few touchups and revisions, and it could be unambiguously solid so far. It’d be familiar but original within that familiarity.

    Instead what we have is is stuff that’s a mix of lots and lots of tropes and cliches and yet none of it quite *works*, at least so far.

    It’s this so-close-yet-so-far feeling that is drawing out the hate, especially since it’s getting that rare, special 2-cour treatment in noitamina.

  28. Hogart says:

    I have to stop reading the comments from GC’s “fans”. They’re doing a much more efficient job of making me NOT want to watch this show than psgels ever could.

    I sincerely hope some of you guys (and not just on psgels’ blog) are reverse trolling, because otherwise it’s just sad. Kudos to those supporters who are keeping it civil.

  29. VyseLegend says:

    This show might get interesting. But right now it just feels like a practical joke.

  30. mindkilla says:

    While I agree that it is just a regular commerical anime, I’m still surprised at the harsh reviews here. Someone mentioned Blood C, which got good ratings here and was kinda boring and conventional as well. Well maybe psgels had bigger expectations so now he’s disappointed.

    I still think it will get better.

  31. cyshtoph says:

    Where the hell is Kyuubey when you need him? /人◕ ‿‿ ◕人\

  32. Tiresias says:

    I must say I’m very grateful that you (and several other sites) blog this episode – saves me the pain of actually watching it.

    And now, I can drop it without regret. God knows how many animes with mixed initial quality I had ended up following since I thought “be patient man, sure there’s lots of bad vibes but it’ll be decent in the end. Probably”. As you can guess, they ended up poorly. That’s a lesson learned there; if your instincts tells you to drop it, you listen.

    And while it is ultimately you choice, psgels, I think it might be better if you stop to, while you can.

  33. Houlgrave says:

    I’m going to disagree with the majority of you about Guilty Crown, but not on the point of its generic plot elements: rather, I think the present tropes are arranged in such a way that I’m actually interested in seeing what happens next.

    But again, I think you lot are overstating the blandness factor in the first place. As far as yawnfest mecha series go, this is certainly no Fafner or Gundam Seed.

    Secondly, the ending to this episode is actually well done. Shu is now going to be placed in a rather nasty situation that’s going to require him to grow a set in order to have any chance of returning to the life he wants.

    Thirdly, give the kid a break as far as personality goes. Like many kids his age, he’s insecure, socially awkward, insecure, immature and also ignorant of how the real world works. But again, everyone has to start somewhere, so give the series some time to develop him into someone worth rooting for.

    Of course, GC could bomb and I could end up eating my words, but this is one of those series that my intuition is telling me to be optimistic about. Until it proves otherwise, I recommend you all to do the same.

  34. Mormegil says:

    WTF is this doing on Noitamina.

  35. mulligan says:

    a hugely forgettable episode, and so early on in the series too! I was so ready to give GC a second chance if it manages to redeem itself from the rather mundane, formulaic story premise (afterall the production values is nothing short of spectacular for a 1/2 hr weekly tv production). such a shame :(

  36. Flawfinder says:

    @Houlgrave It’s not the fact that the kid is insecure and all that that bothers me. I like Yukiteru from Mirai Nikki after all. The problem is that in addition to being insecure and immature, he is boring. And to me, that’s the worst thing you can make a character.

    Also, I don’t really give a crap about Noitamina and all that. I can even take genericness if the characters are likable. I can safely say that at this point, I hate them.

  37. Kuro says:

    Guilty Crown is babby’s first anime. It’s an inoffensive mainstream show that takes absolutely zero risks. It’s great for people getting into anime expecting something action packed, loud and simple. It’s effectively the anime equivalent of a hollywood blockbuster.

    Which doesn’t make it “bad” as far as dumb fun is concerned. However it also won’t be memorable if it keeps up being so generic in every single aspect. What pisses me off is the people bashing good shows just because they aren’t generic action anime.

    I’m tired of people bashing anything that isn’t a straight up action series.

  38. CKSqua says:

    noitaminA has we knew it is finished. While I wouldn’t discount the possibility of another “traditional” show (a la Usagi Drop) for variation, the mandate is to make commercial hits. Guilty Crown is an early example of a major effort, and the hope is to do really well in Blu-Ray sales.

    The gist of it is that noitaminA shows aren’t getting the ratings they used, and even if they did, they’d still be unprofitable. Apparently, the advertising business has changed in such a way that high ratings don’t net money (I’d guess that external sponsors have shied away from any late night slot and/or the revenue system has changed).

  39. Kamito says:

    @Houlgrave Glad to see someone agree with me amidst all this hate. I have a feeling that this anime is good, and will get good soon for those who are bashing it. I’m betting we will get a glimpse of that in the next episode in how they deal with Shu’s situation.

  40. Alec says:

    I don’t find this anime bad, nor do I find it particularly good. But with such hype, this anime is a letdown.

    Guilty Crown pretty much screams the word “generic”

  41. Alec says:

    I don’t find this anime bad, nor do I find it particularly good. But with such hype, this anime is a letdown.

    Guilty Crown pretty much screams the word “generic”

  42. Cletos says:

    Guilty Crown is like a beauty woman who lacks any substance.

  43. Tan-Tan says:

    Lazy storytelling sums this up.

  44. Diasen says:

    Psgels, I think you are looking at the show as how you want it to be instead of what it is. I think you should stop blogging this one. It’s doing no good to either the fans of the show or the people who have hope in the show or you yourself. The only people benefiting from you blogging it are the haters of the show.

    Anyhow, are you sure there is no other show you want to blog this season over this one?

  45. Puran says:

    @Diasen: What is Guilty Crown then? (I’m not ironic or something, I really want to know).

    For example, comparing it to Ghost in the Shell SAC, is obviously wrong, because it’s not that kind of anime.

    What should I compare it to? Or more precisely, what do I have to compare it to, so that Guilty Crown fares well in comparison?

  46. KaZuHiRo says:

    @Puran

    Guilty Crown is Code Geass waiting to happen.

    Seriously, this show just screams mediocrity all throughout its three episode. I kind of understand the bashing for this show because this is airing in noitaminA. Come on guys, this is noitaminA!! Had this show aired in a different time slot then I would have questioned all the “bashing” this show is receiving.

    I’ll echo Guest’s comments: Guilty Crown is more of a “grossly wasted potential” show than “an outright sucky show”.

    Well I’m still gonna watch and wait for that “glorious moment” that it will redeeem itself but I’m not keeping my hopes up. It pummeled down all my hopes underground. For me watching this is like I skydived and my parachute failed to open.

  47. Killer says:

    For your information… Shows like this are aired AFTER midnight in Japan and only Otaku or hardcore fans watch them. Why? Because Night slot is cheap and otaku are suckers who would spend their money for fanservice shows and merchandises. But they ain’t buying sh*t so of course the creators have to make them flashy.

    Which means this anime is just another Otaku fanservice show with fancy animation and so called plot. All otaku dream of meeting a beauty, stay near her and surrounded by typical harem blah blah.

    This is also the reason why there are so many crappy anime of whimpy guys + harem girls with th same cliche all over again in them. They are all drugs for the Otaku.

  48. Snowolf says:

    I’m not quite sure why people are so desperate to compare Guilty Crown to Code Geass- I’ve watched CG and while I’ve noticed some similarities I defnitely would say that CG made use of its plot while GC is in no way taking advantage of that.

    The problem of Guilty Crown is inherently laid in its execution, not its plot. I have no problem with a generic plot- every show a year has one-but with three episodes and not a single reflection on any of the characters, or the storyline, Guilty Crown is wasting its time. Valuable, valuable time- time that UN GO on the other hand, is using well enough considering it has only 11 episodes. It’s like they’re trying to plug a high school drama, with slice of life, into a dystopian show. That just doesn’t work. Not only that, but lazy storytelling has refused to predominantly back up any sort of claims laid in the story- how on earth is a bunch of ‘shears’ related to the sort of person the classmate was? Why couldn’t it be, oh I don’t know- a knife, or a sword too? How on earth is Inori’s Void a sword when she is reduced to the most passive character in this show?

    That doesn’t make Guilty Crown BAD, but it certainly makes it terribly disappointing, especially when they hyped it up so much. I can’t say I was expecting much, from the guy who directed HOTD, which was the most primitive of fanservice with a very basic plot, but nevertheless, GC has great animation, which makes it even a bigger shame, because it really is a sign of wasted potential.

  49. psgels psgels says:

    Snowolf: the reason why it’s easy to compare this to Code Geass is because some of the main writers of Code Geass are on board for this series.

    Also, don’t look at Tetsurou Araki’s work with just High School of the Dead. That was indeed just Zombie Bashing and fanservice. He however also directed Death Note, Kurozuka and one of the parts of Aoi Bungaku, and that’s where he showed that he create an incredible horror atmosphere. That makes it all the more weird that Guilty crown has no atmosphere built up whatsoever.

  50. Snowolf says:

    Ah, yes, I understand- but I mean, in terms of plot, I don’t really feel a ‘Code Geass’ atmosphere here, at all. I mean, I do see similarities such as a government controlled Japan, and a boy wielding a mysterious power, with some mecha factors put in, but so far, GC and CG seem worlds apart in terms of execution, that’s all.

    I didn’t know he directed Death Note/ a part of Aoi Bungaku! Wow, that’s even….more disappointing. I just don’t understand- why would you compromise such a wonderful budget of animation for lacking storytelling? :(

  51. J says:

    Wow, kivos is one nasty piece of work…

  52. imredjimmy says:

    Yay, Guilty Crown’s main problem isn’t that it’s bad, it’s that it’s very generic :S And for an anime with such a budget, I keep hoping that I’ll enjoy it in the long run. That’s why I’m watching it. I thought the episode was ok. Not good, not awful. It was obvious that the friend was the witness, I would have liked for him to not be a traitor and actually become part of the main cast. That could have been interesting….oh well.

  53. Suzushina Yuriko says:

    It’s a shame you dropped this, since I think Guilty Crown actually became a little better after episode 3.

  54. Peep says:

    Kind of late on this, but I just finished watching it and I have to say I’m very surprised at these negative comments about it. I’ve found the series to be pretty good, starting with episode one. To me, it’s sort of like a crossover between NGE and Mawaru Penguin. And it’s not quite about mecha, it’s about Shou with plenty symbolism in it (a bit more clumsy done than in Mawaru, but that’s expected), so I can see why it’s on noitaminA. And as someone else mentioned above, it plays with the tropes and that’s quite fun to watch.

    All in all the show did had some rough edges, but in no way it’s bad

    I liked Shou as a character, he has trouble to accepting himself, because he doesn’t “know” himself. He wants to change, but doesn’t know how and that’s pretty much realistic, imo, there are plenty people like that.

    “Here, I have no idea what it is that the male lead wants.” <— because Shou himself does not know.

    "he doesn’t really seem to understand the situation he’s in." <– bingo!

    I do see a pattern of psgels not liking "wimpy" characters (see Accel World which has a similar character, ie someone who is also insecure), but oh well, each to his own.

Leave a Reply

CHANGE USERNAME
AidanAK47
So we got to rely on fansubs for it when it's airing.
AidanAK47
@Mario, Nope. I think because netflix only puts up full seasons they are only planning to put it up when it's finished airing. Or when it's dubbed.
SuperMario
But how does the Netflix thing work? So of I have a Netflix account I can watch the show weekly?
SuperMario
@Aidan: that's a dumb way to do things really because unless you watch the show weekly, everyone gonna forget that it even exist. Just look at Re-Life last year
Lenlo
thought*. Words are hard.

Eventually found the actual first ep though and enjoyed it.
Lenlo
Was funny. I tried to find the first Ep for Little Witch, found original short made afew years ago, watched it and though "This is very similar to the original... Whats new".
AidanAK47
Little witch is one of the best shows this season and yet I can't get subtitles because Netflix doesn't release shows weekly. Motherf*cker.
Lenlo
Ore Monogatari I enjoyed. It was a nice romance that actually explored what happens after the confession. Also the 2 leads are just precious.
Lenlo
Alright but unmemorable seems like a good summation.
SuperMario
@Lenlo: one good thing about Seiren is if you don't like this romance, the whole thing gonna reset after episode 4 so there's a chance that you might end up like it. Agreed that the comedy wasn't very good. Alright but unmemorable
SuperMario
@Topgavin: I watched like first 3 episodes and stopped because I didn't have much time there, but I enjoyed what I saw. A well-written and endearing show in my book
Topgavin
Has anyone here watched Ore Monogatari before? Because in the 4 years I've watched anime, I've never heard of it (I guess it did come out 2 years ago) and yet it's turning out to be one of my favorite shows. Always great going into a show expecting nothing and getting pleasantly surprised.
AidanAK47
Only one more impression to go. Should have it up tomorrow.
Lenlo
Im really not feeling Seiren. Its "comedy" isnt for me and I just dont find it very enjoyable to watch so far. Im curious if it gets any better but 2 episodes in it just isnt that good.
HelghastKillzone
That ending scene is an entire side-story compressed into that. Don't expect anymore of it from here on out as the it sticks to ruthless military/fantasy pretty well.
LookingForKeys
@Topgavin I think it was good, making it the second episode. That way the first set up the world the story will be in, and showed how much of a monster the "little girl" really is right at the end, and then made ep.2 the explanation. Nothing against Tanya trying to rip "God" a new one.
That after-credits scene, though...
SuperMario
Hmm, as much as I like Seiren's omnibus format, it doesn't turn out really hot this second episode. Demi-chan, on the other hand, still maintains its endearing tone. Might blogging Demi-chan instead
Topgavin
Yeah, that second episode was much better than the first. Dunno why they didn't start with that to be honest, waste of an opportunity for a good hook episode. The voice for the main girl still sounds weird to me though; I get it's supposed to sound weird because it symbolizes 'her' being out of place and her personality and body being a mismatch, but it'll certainly take some getting used to.
AidanAK47
Youjo Senki, now we are talking. Like Helghast said, Did the god scene way better than the LN and manga. Made it less comedic and more intimidating.
Lenlo
Oh man that Rakugo intro. Not sure what to think, but first time seeing it I liked it
Kaiser Eoghan
I sort of like good will hunting because I kind of saw a bit of myself in Damon's character when I watched it ages ago.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Mario: Remaking psycho and ruining the shower scene, for shame van sant, for shame.
Kaiser Eoghan
Its easy to ripoff some obscure thing though and get away with it. The dogtooth director essentially stole an old Mexican film to make that.
SuperMario
@Kaiser: yeah, that following some guys from behind like they were on a RPG games, which I think actually fit with the tones of Elephant. I have such mixed feeling with Gus van Sant too. Don't really think he's a great director.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Mario: Although Istvan Szabo is probably a little more well known for that Mephisto film that updates the Faust story. Zoltan Fabri's the fifth seal is a very thought provoking war movie.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Mario: I remember seeing a film documentary that featured Gus van sant in one section, they showed clips of tarrs films, Sant ripped of the cinematography and stole the style from some British short film to make Elephant.
SuperMario
@Kaiser: agree on the other Hungarian filmmakers, I don't know much about them either.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Mario: Scorsese's Silence was a big comeback. I really really emotionally connect with spiritual crisis stories.
SuperMario
@kaiser: yep, definitely check wreckmeister down. Althought I admit that watching his 2-hour plus films will feel like 5-hour anyways
Kaiser Eoghan
@Mario: I'm more tolerant of darker teenage/coming of age films/stories. Les Demons was a big surprise.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Mario: Though its kind of frustrating, I do think Tarr probably takes attention away from other hungarian filmakers because no-body knows who the hell the others are.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Mario: Man, wreckmeister was so visually arresting I started getting dreams from it.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Mario: I would consider Tarr to be kind of a poor mans Janco, Angelopolus and Tarkvosky rolled into one. I don't entirely "get" wreckmeister and man from London but they are great atmospheric mood piece experiences.
SuperMario
@Kaiser: I had been wanting to watch Belar Tarr's Turin Horse and Werckmeister Harmonies for so long now. Well, Fat Girl is shocking haha, but I'm normally drawn into those kind of films anyway.
SuperMario
@Kaiser: Margaret took like 5,6 years to release because he couldn't cut it down in the way he wanted. The final cut if I remembered correctly was edited by Martin Scorsese
Kaiser Eoghan
@Mario: Only a HDcam for moonlight now.
Kaiser Eoghan
I looks like my lineup is witch academia, rakugo and youjo senki, well the most latter one until I get bored.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Mario: I sense a directors cut for manchester, it feels like it need another 30 minutes.
SuperMario
@Kaiser: right up my valley. Watch Kenneth Lonergan's previous works Magaret and You Can Count on Me. Magaret is very messy but have a raw dialogue and interactions as well
SuperMario
Now the first episodes are over, I will keep on covering 3-gatsu, as for the other twos atm I have 3 options: 1) full romance/anti-romance high school Seiren/Scum's Wish. 2) slice-of-life moe monster girls Demi-chan/Maid Dragon and 3) Mature,dark Onihen/Acca (which although I like them I don't have much to talk about).If you guys have any preference on which shows you like covered then let me know
Kaiser Eoghan
@Helghast: At this point I'm watching youjo senki as an entertaining guilty pleasure.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Mario: Too many reboots upcoming, will wait for the dvds instead. I want to explore more of manchester by the sea's director's work. I also want to finally get more into Bela Tarr's stuff.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Mario: I was rather shocked by A Ma souer/fat girls final act. Scenes with the Italian in the bedroom were initially creepy.
SuperMario
@Kaiser: it's a nice review Kaiser, a bit jealous with you that you've seen those 3 films which are touted as the best films of 2016. Also Fat Girl, haha, I love that movie.
Kaiser Eoghan
Poor yotaro =< you have so much stuff going down on you =<
HelghastKillzone
Youjo Senki episode was so good today. That revamped scene with God just fitted so right.
AidanAK47
A official release of that game in the west is apparently coming but it's been a few years and not much news about it.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Aidan: Ah yes that was the one.
AidanAK47
@Kaiser, Had to think for a moment on that one but I think I was talking about this. https://vndb.org/v3144
Kaiser Eoghan
Now I'd hardly consider myself a studio trigger fan, but I watched the first witch academia episode there, it was actually kind of fun, got the same reaction from me as flipflappers did, that magical, special feeling.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Mario: I also, of interest reviewed Kenneth Lonegrans new film: http://letterboxd.com/shao_liu_ringon/film/manchester-by-the-sea/
Kaiser Eoghan
@Mario: Moonlight got some feels out of me though it could of been more, it ends abruptly and with 20 extra minutes they could have spent a bit more time on each section of his life.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Mario: I checked out lala land, ending was very well executed, one of three scenes in the film that were impressive visually. The whole thing looked pretty and Gosling and Stone had some decent chemistry. Although it didn't resonate emotionally as strongly as the musicals of Jacques Demi did.
Kaiser Eoghan
MOM I want aiyoku no eustia and I want it now.
Kaiser Eoghan
I've never heard of himawari or tokyo babel. The hellsing comparison at least interests me in dies irae. What was the name of that visual novel again that was coming out soon, Aidan you described it as "And Kaiser would love it because its supposed to be really fucked up".
Kaiser Eoghan
I vaguely remember the anime for 11 eyes, it was very forgettable, even the voice acting was poor, hated the childhood friends and the pacing was poor, those black knight things were kind of interesting though.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Aidan: You'll have to add me onto the list of those unsatisfied with the ever 17 writer, I read one of those games and felt it was a bunch of interesting bait that never paid off.
AidanAK47
Anyway I plan on doing a review of 11eyes here when I finish it.
AidanAK47
Can't say I was a fan of Ever17. That was a really good twist but when it came to explaining it their was a lot of contrived development. Generally not a fan of the writer. Looseboy, Ryukishi, Gen and Nasu are more my kinda thing
AidanAK47
@Anon, it is nice that so many VNs are on steam but I wish they wouldn't be stupid with the whole no adult content thing. Not so much for myself but to prevent idiots from writing negitives reviews because the game doesn't have sex. VNs can grip you in a way anime simply can't and while they require pathence and time those can be some pretty powerful stories.
Anonymous678956
@Aidan, I am so happy steam's so VN-friendly now. I think it's a very good type of media. Like anime, it has nice visuals, music and some movement but also the inner monologue and text amount of books. It's the perfect combination. Plus, the routes, which are often puzzle pieces and PoVs you have to go through to understand the whole story. True routes like the one of Ever17 blew my mind.
AidanAK47
Hopefully the two VNs I bought of steam turn out better. Tokyo Babel is supposed to be alright and I heard really good things about Himawari.
AidanAK47
I am about a third of the way through the game and really not much of worth has happened. The concept is interesting but the execution is sorely lacking.
AidanAK47
I went in expecting it to be a mixed bag and it's pretty below my expectations. It's just not really well written and the protagonist is a moron. THere isn't really routes and instead you are pretty much stuck with his childhood friend as the main love interest. Problem with that is her character begins and ends with loving the main.
Anonymous675376
@Aidan, damn. 11Eyes is on my reading list as well. Although I almost expected it to not be as good as I thought it'd be (back then). Guess I would have enjoyed it if I was able to read it while the (shitty) adaption aired, maybe I have seen/read too many series by now. Guess I'll still give it a try some day though.
AidanAK47
@Anon, I haven't heard the OST or watched the intro video. I only know it be reputation and have decided to walk into it as blind as I can. Still slightly worried as I was somewhat looking forward to reading 11Eyes for a couple of years and now that I am reading it it's well...not good.
Anonymous675376
@Aidan, same here. I was waiting years for this, since I saw the intro video for the first time. Also, that OST!
HelghastKillzone
Youjo Senki is already leagues better than Izetta. It's going to be top anime of forever and ever. (maybe not)
AidanAK47
And finally Dies Irae is funded. May actually be able to play and finish the game before the anime airs. If the hype is real behind this baby it could be a new personal favorite Visual Novel of mine. Already looking promising with it being like a cross between Hellsing and Fate/Stay Night. Two things I most certainly like.
Lenlo
@Masky, in regards to style over substance thats where im at with Gurrne Lagann.
Topgavin
Yeah, I'll probably watch the next episode to see whether it can redeem itself. Hopefully it can but considering 1st episodes usually get a lot of budget, there's some severe doubt in there.
AidanAK47
I actually argee with character designs and voices are bad in regards to female characters. Still the next episode might change your mind if we get more into the main characters head.
Anonymous671470
It's boring
Topgavin
Also, it seems I disagree with a lot of people in thinking Youjo Senki will be a massive trainwreck. The character designs are awful, the voice acting is mismatched but most of all the premise just seems so very dumb. If I wanted to watch a badass kill people I'd go watch Hellsing or Drifters, because at least those don't have some op, disproportionate loli as the mc.
AidanAK47
Gets even more complicated when you account for Satire and Parody. You could equally argue all examples listed as being as such.
AidanAK47
Little Witch Academia is a decontruction of Harry Potter....I don't believe that but honestly if I tried I could put some reasoning behind that statement.
Topgavin
In the end, it always comes down to opinion (as with every discussion about anime, for some reason). You could spin any and every series as a "deconstruction", which is why people shy away from using the word. You could argue NGE, Madoka and Re:Zero are all deconstructions yet also argue Gundam, Precure and SAO are depending on what points you weigh more importantly.
Masky
Like, if deconstruction is supposed to be just "break the elements and then play story how it would realistically go down" well I haven't watched NGE, but as far as I know it does have stuff that isn't typical to mecha genre besides the "It would fuck up kids" thing plus "realistically how it would play out" is pretty subjective thing. I mean, its mainly about how cynical bastard the writer is :P
Masky
Like I said, I don't fully agree with it because I find video's speaker's attitude annoying, but I found it semi convincing. Main thing I don't find convincing about it is that I don't think its hard to turn video's own arguments agaisnt it and say that by its own logic NGE isn't deconstruction either, like Aidan just said earlier
Masky
And I don't really have energy for checking out the "correct" one. If there even is one. Anyway, the hipster video I was talking about was titled "What Actually Is A Deconstruction?" if you want to check it out.
Masky
Hmm, well, it does depend on definition you use. Like if you use "realistic" thing, well, Magical Girl shows don't usually have "You turn into monsters" thing going on and reason why NGE's pilots go crazy is from dangerous situations rather than evas making them do so. But honestly, I don't really have strong opinion on matter since word seems to be one of those with several different meaning
SuperMario
for me Madoka IS a deconstruction of Magical girl, and yeah like what Aidan said
SuperMario
I think part of Utena is a deconstruction of "prince riding horse and save the girl" because that notion is just a foundation for Utena to become a prince herself and save other girl. That's breaking it apart and resemble it again in its own way. Don't have to be dark/ don't have to be real either
AidanAK47
@Masky, That's just debating semantics. Besides that difinition would pretty much mean that Neon Genesis Evangelion isn't a decontruction either. Madoka isn't a decontruction because it's dark. It's more in its aspects of criticising why a girl should throw her ordinary life away for something as dangerous as being a magical girl. It does take plenty of the typical tropes and turn them on its head
SuperMario
@Masky: Genre deconstruction is such a tricky word that I normally try to avoid using because there's really no set characteristic about the term and different people have different opinions about what constitute "deconstruction". For me, I disagree that deconstruction have to be dark and real, hmm can't say it well but I will give you an example:
Masky
But yeah, I guess I could try to find the video if you guys are interested, though like I said, I got hipsterish feel from the video and felt rather annoyed through it even though I did get what the point was and found it sort of convincing besides my annoyance
Masky
(not that liking NGE is hipsterish, its just that I find NGE to be more style than substance sort of series <_< Anyway, guy didn't dislike madoka or anything, he just seemed to dislike people using word deconstruction wrong in his opinion)
Masky
(especially with how much they seemed to praise Neon Genesis Evangelion)
Masky
I mean, I think the guy was being somewhat hipsterish, but its true the being darker take on genre isn't same as deconstructing the genre
Masky
@AidanAK47: Some other guy on youtube did video that had actually pretty good point about how Madoka isn't really deconstruction, if you go by definition of "Break it down to parts and then play them straight to show how horrifying it would be in real life"
Anonymous670441
Gente - Ristorante no Hitobito
Kaiser Eoghan
If anything its the hate I have for certain characters that makes it more effective.
Kaiser Eoghan
The obsessional level of attachment is just uncomfortable to me, I don't want to get THAT attached to a non-real character.
Kaiser Eoghan
Its literally just a case of "Okay lets look at this picture of this character, she looks interesting, no feelings or expression from me, apply this fetish, fap, get release, go home. "
Kaiser Eoghan
Or drooling/dribbling/heavy breathing/grinning over the characters. I abhor alot of the anime girls I find attractive or am indifferent, even when looking at ecchi/hentai drawings I'm straight and clinical with it.
Kaiser Eoghan
I mean to each their own. But I really hate the level of emotion/devotion to moe/finding the characters attractive. Such as celebrating their birthdays, going on about how cute/hot they are, how important it is that they're virgins. Or not being being self-aware of how irritating the characters are.
Lenlo
Anime hipster is pretty accurate. His general treatment of the current state of anime is annoying, as is his obsession with moe. Maybe its cause I cant stand moe most of the time, but it bugs me.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Lenlo: Essentially my brothers view on digibro.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Aidan: I don't usually feel the need to correct errors in your reviews as the errors are generally un-important, but I think you meant to say apprentices rather than appearences in the Rakugo review, just bringing that up as it felt like kind of a throw off.
AidanAK47
Which is kinda like saying Madoka wasn't a magical girl deconstruction because Sailor Moon and Nanoha had dark elements too.
AidanAK47
Went and read the reddit comments on it and seems I was right on the money.
AidanAK47
@Lenlo, He's basically a anime hipster. For example, I saw a thumbnail of his which had Saitama on it and below it "Is There Meaning In "Subverting" Shounen Tropes?" and I thought "Okay, he's going to go on about how OPM isn't subversive and then list a bunch of arbitrary examples in an attempt to redefine what is actually subversive"
Lenlo
I have lots of issues with Digibro. Dude has some good points, but other very horrible ones. Some issues he feels strongly about and gets kinda biased on imo.
Anonymous669202
acca looks visually interesting, and I personally really dig this kind of show, but it seems that it's definitely not for everyone
AidanAK47
Time to live up to my word. Four posts incoming.
AidanAK47
Man, Little witch Academia was so good. I disagree with the whole Digibro thing about being able to recognise a great show in it's first episode but watching this makes me think that this really is going to be something special.
AidanAK47
Alright, gonna put in effort today and have 3 or 4 first impressions posts done. That should knock out near half the season.
Kaiser Eoghan
Had a flip through handshakers. Garish is the word I'd use to describe it visually, it takes you out of the show.
Topgavin
ASuperMario From the first minute I can already tell it's by the same people that made K. Those colour filters and the extremely jarring/obvious city CGI is unmistakable.
SuperMario
Hand Shakers, literally makes my hands shaking. It's an abosolute mess. Highly recommended to check it out because it's so terrible it's great to watch
Vonter212
Yeah, and it's also a literal woman in refrigerator plot device, since that the thing that pushes the story forward.
Masky
I'd say that having to hide your sister's body in fridge would count as daaaaaaark and edgy, but when the body is wearing only underwear, and for some reason main character put metal things in fridge to keep body standing(I guess to not knock fridge open from inside?) I think it goes to "exploitation" you are talking about
Vonter212
@Masky - Did someone said doing dark things for drama? That's the bread and butter to get despair. Unless it's for the sake of perversion. Then it's just exploitation.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Masky: His other works dead tube and scumbag go further in the unhinged regard.
Masky
*relies on easy "let's do [x dark thing] for drama!" thing
Masky
Geez, Mayonaka no X Giten is fricking disturbing/disgusting ._. I'm pretty sure that writing relies on e, but I can't help but think mangaka is trying to make corpses sexy.
SuperMario
I found Onihei to be quite good, actually one of the most solid new episode I watched this new season. Guys, check them out
Vonter
I just hope it doesn't fall into the same misstep Kabaneri or Inuyasha or Bleach fall by making a villain so over the top that it crossed the line of not having a satisfying downfall.
Anonymous657941
@Vonter I think they just moved on. I lost interest rather quickly and I guess even the fans did that at some point, like with some other long-running series. There is much more new and more direct "fujo" stuff out there, many of them probably switched. Don't know what happens in the manga but maybe the story got worse or contained things some people didn't like.
Vonter
January will be loli dictator month (for me) :p. World Conquest Zvezda Plot, Youjo Senki: Saga of Tanya the Evil (new), Seraph of the End. For some reason I stumble into three curious series with little power hungry girls. If I can ask, why did Owari Seraph's hype died, I remember back it was mentioned more often. It still has the fujoshi fanart but still, I don't see people bringing it up.
SuperMario
@CATski: well, if you didn't like its first 3 episodes I dont think the rest gonna change your mind. Have you finished Erased then? How did you like it?
SuperMario
But I understand it's difficult to speak in front of camera, get some time to get used to it
SuperMario
@kaiser: I won't commend on poem as I'm terrible at it myself but younneed to work more on presentation Kaiser. Small little things like looking directly at the camera or say "thanks for listening" in the end can connect you to the audience better
Anonymous657071
Ok. I'll give the thing another chance. *clicks torrent* XD. CATski.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Topgavin: You might like centaur no nanami if you like demi-chan.
Kaiser Eoghan
Damn...repeated myself =<
Kaiser Eoghan
There are these things called slam sessions done in bars where people get up and read out stuff in front of a crowd and read stuff out. Actually watching rakugo made me think about practicing for that kind of thing.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Mario: the video I did was of me reading out a short piece of writing I did, a poem. lol I uploaded it to the wrong youtube account too I just realized =P
[link src="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ypBZ2hBDBYs&t=11s
I"] was recording this from my mothers laptops inbuilt cam while reading off my desktop.
SuperMario
@Kaiser: I think it's a good idea for you to try out reviewing movies/stuffs in youtube channel. I'll be very interesting to listen to them
SuperMario
@Topgavin: Agree. Demi-chan was so charming. Definately one of my favorite so far this new season
Topgavin
Demi-chan's first episode was good. Like, really really good. That blonde-haired girl was hilarious, the teacher-student relationship between the MC and the girls is really interesting and the social/practical problems the demi's face make it look like my favorite show so far.
CATski
Ah... ok. Is it really that good or it's just one of those "artsy" animes that tend to get overrated by their ardent fans? I didnt find the rakugo bit interesting.... probably the weakest aspect of the show for me.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Aidan: Why did I read that chapter. Why did I do that to myself.
Kaiser Eoghan
Admittedly yes the premise is not for everyone, but if you stick with it, the flashback arc had some good character work in there.
CATski
Rakugo has a season 2? I watched ep 1 - 3 of season 1 then promptly deleted it. The loud "yankee" dude was annoying. And the anime was boring.
Kaiser Eoghan
Oh man, I've been thinking lately of trying to start some kind of youtube channel. I did a few trial run videos. Its much much harder than it looks, didn't realize how nervy being in front of a video camera was.
Kaiser Eoghan
*a declining art and rakygo halls are closing down
Kaiser Eoghan
As the show continues to mention how "its declining art", that got me thinking of the modern day, how while things like tv and cinemas probably hurt attendances for rakugo performances, the internet has replaced theaters .
Kaiser Eoghan
Ah, now I've watched it. It'll be interesting to see Yotaro's relation to sukeroku's daughter develop. By all intents he should be an irritating character and not as interesting a yakumo based on his personality, but I can't help but like him, example of a goofball character done right.
Anonymous654016
ElDlive is looking good
Kaiser Eoghan
I haven't gotten around to rakugo's second seasons first episode yet =<
Kaiser Eoghan
Just looking at masamunes female protaganist I want to punch her.
Kaiser Eoghan
Vapid would be how I'd describe it, I didn't care about Masamune no revenge but at least there was some life to it.
Kaiser Eoghan
Ah, suzuka I remember a friend telling me when I got halfway through the anime to literally run from it and not continue. I flicked through fuukas first two episodes and played count the cliches.
Kaiser Eoghan
While I definitely got something out of Yojo senki's manga, I found the first episode easier to get through than the manga, in terms of pace and exposition.
AidanAK47
@Masky, Fuuka chapter 135. Read and be amazed.
Masky
Ah sorry ._.; And wait, there is another twist later on? What
AidanAK47
@Masky, Even if it's a crap show don't go posting spoilers on the chatbox.
Oh and that's just the begining, a really dumbass twist happened recently in the manga.
SuperMario
@Aidan: I'm away a whole day again so I'll be a bit late on my impressions.
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