Posted by psgels on 4 November 2011 with categories: Mawaru Penguin Drum

How rare: a Penguin Drum episode devoted to build-up. Or at least, it’s promising a ton of stuff for next episode and its pacing was surprisingly quiet for this show’s standards, aside from one over the top confrontation between Yuri and Natsume. It did not lack in the plot twist department at all.

In fact, in terms of plot twists, thi episode can actually be seen as a turning point, where most of the things that we had to assume in the first half are canceled. The Penguin Drum isn’t the diary at all, and Tabuki has a very clear hidden agenda that he kept very well hidden. And heck, I just realized the parallels between Yuri, Tabuki and Momoka, and the main trio of this show. Add that to the rumors that Shigeyasu Yamauchi (the director of Casshern Sins) will be working on next episode, and yeah: I can’t wait.

I do want to say a bit about the music, though. It is very good, but in the past weeks I have been rediscovering Utena’s soundtrack, and I’m blown away by the utter difference between the two. The biggest thing is that Uterna’s soundtrack spans a whopping 7 disks in total! The creators went and composed a traditional soundtrack, and then they contacted like, three different musical groups to sing in and compose the different themes for all of the duels. This way they had a different song for every single duel in styles that evolved perfectly. Cowboy Bebob had this too.

Modern soundtracks just don’t have this. And yet, with smart production decisions this can still easily be possible. I mean, those different EDs are nice and all, but the creators could have easily used the budget they used for Triple H’s songs to actually compose songs that fit inside the series, instead of stuffing them into EDs. Having a huge soundtrack gives a lot more freedom and expression in terms of storytelling.
Rating: ** (Excellent)

27 Responses

  1. Puran says:

    Mmmm…. You make a good point, but there is also value to music repeating. It binds certain scenes together with the same feel and it can be used to remind you of previous scenes.

    All I’m saying is that it’s probably more of a creative choice than a budget issue.

  2. C160 says:

    I think Tabuki’s punishment won’t be all that bad. Judging from the preview, it’s probably just him telling Himari about the her parents. If he does decide to get physical like Yuri, here’s hoping that the rumor about Casshern Sin director is true. Ringo vs Tabuki,Casshern style anyone? :P

    About the music think, I also thought its kind of a waste.

  3. Perrin4869 says:

    Well, the main gripe I have against the endings are that they are just forgettable pop songs… while the duel themes for Utena are truly memorable and pumping and… It’s by far the best I’ve heard of Japanese music.

  4. Puran says:

    @Perrin: Isn’t that all about taste though?

    I also hate OP and ED songs and find them forgettable (Although I liked the first penguindrum ED, the shoegazing one), but I also found Utena’s duel music to be nothing remarkable. It obviously helps that I dislike with passion most of progressive rock.

  5. Perrin4869 says:

    @Puran: Sure it is about taste, but still, I guess that in a way, Utena’s soundtrack was more original. At least I’ve never heard something like it, and what’s more, I love it. Penguin Drum’s music just sounds like normal pop to me. Of course, I love rock and I usually don’t like pop, so yes, it IS about taste in the end.

  6. Stellvia says:

    @Puran: As someone who writes and listens to a lot of prog rock I would say that the Penguindrum soundtrack only has a few elements from that genre in it. That being said, I do enjoy how the soundtrack makes use of a wide range of texutres, from rock to pop and classical, and in cases like the OP’s manages to blend all the different elements together. That’s one of the big reasons I enjoy soundtracks like this, as well as prog :) As always though, it does come down to personal taste for every indivdiual. I love both OP’s (especially the full versions) but none of the ED’s have really grabbed me at all.

    I agree with Puran in that I believe that the use of the minimal amount of soundtrack material is a creative choice by the directors. I think that having too much in the way of soundtrack material would probably detract from the atmosphere, and since everything else in the series seems to link to everything else having a small amount of repeated musical material reinforces those links.

    Just my opinion, and it’s still a pretty good soundtrack nonetheless :P

  7. kevin says:

    PSGELS are you 12 years old? Why is it that so many of your “reviews” are filled with really obvious spelling mistakes or just plain childish talk? By the way, it’s Cowboy Bebop not “Bebob” and it’s Utena not “Uterna”.

    Also just want to make a point regarding your final statement. Size of soundtrack has nothing to do with story-telling. It can set an atmosphere but it shouldn’t tell the story.

    The problem I see with Penguindrum is that it relies very heavily upon bizarre imagery and music, to give the impression of a story unfolding when as a matter of fact, very little has happened in this series thus far.

    Not only that but this series screams narcissism. It is very obvious that the people working on this want to flaunt their colourful imagery (which really is meaningless), to the point that I personally find it irritating and above all too much of a distraction from what really could be a somewhat decent story.

    If only the people working on this were focused enough on putting out a good product instead of stroking their own ego, this could be a somewhat coherent and interesting series. But unfortunately they all have their heads too far up their own asses to see that.

  8. Snowolf says:






  9. Pink says:


    It’s called typos, genius.

    psgels never said anything about music telling a story, maybe you should quit calling people childish and learn how to comprehend and read English first.

    Do you even know what narcissism is? Narcissism is a self-absorbing interest in one’s self (originating from the Greek myth where the youth Narcissus stares into a pond and falls in love with his own reflection). Is this series about Kunihiko Ikuhara and the show’s creators, producers and developers? What does this show focus on? Fate, different forms of love, parental neglect, sacrifice and death. How are any of those themes narcissistic when they’re universal and humans have attempted to answer questions about them throughout history?

    Just like cubism, fauvism and the more modern movements of art deviated from traditional realistic depictions of subjects, Ikuhara is more of a symbolist, a very post-post-modernist thinking anime director who likes to explore things in his way. If that’s narcissism, then call every musical artist, band, painter and writer narcissistic for having their own style and focusing on the themes they care about.

  10. Snowolf says:

    Oh look Kevin the Troll has strolled in again what a ~surprise~

    For the sake of not having a 100+comment argument let’s not feed him, por favor?

  11. kevin says:

    You don’t have to respond to me. Just thought I’d get my thoughts out there.

  12. kevin says:

    @Pink, I personally believe that they are overly self-indulgent, to the point that it hurts the product. I didn’t ask for a history lesson mate, just wanted to voice my thoughts like the rest of you.

  13. kevin says:

    Also I was talking about the over zealous and ultimately meaningless art and animation style as well as the music, not the themes. Troll better Pink.

  14. kero says:

    I think maybe my enthusiasm for MPD is flagging, today I didn’t really care that much about what was happening, maybe because nothing much happened.

    The duel between Yuri and the other girl was boring for me.

    I guess Tabuki’s promising to reveal something, so that’s something to look forward to in the next episode.

    Overall it didn’t engage me as much as some of the previous episodes.. and I do wonder if I’m tired out by the consistent lack of payoff. Hopefully next episode will blow my mind.

  15. Hogart says:

    I have to say that I preferred this episode’s lower-key symbolism and straightforwardness to some of the more jarring exhibitions the show has had.

    Sometimes it’s nice to not have to constantly study the over-indulgent subtext, and feel instead like the show has actual confidence and isn’t just distracting me away from potential flaws with kanji cards or campy 50’s western parodies.

    I think kero has a point, though. There is a danger that this will give some people enough pause to come to the conclusion that the show’s been genuinely pretentious.. to the point they’re unable to take it seriously anymore.

    I always feel like the weirdo here.. I don’t hate MPD, but I’m not a huge fan either. I like it most when the show isn’t going overboard, but I don’t hate it outright for all it’s excess. The benefit is that I can enjoy it without caring whether it’s pretentious, which is a strange and rare feeling for me.

  16. wendeego says:

    Utena’s music is a lot more distinctive than Penguindrum’s, true. Although that’s only to be expected, since Utena’s was J.A. Seazer choral prog rock, and Penguindrum’s are for the most part remixes of ARB songs from the 80s.

    What makes Penguindrum’s insert songs interesting, though is how they tie into the story. I don’t mean how the lyrics relate to the plot–that’s more Utena’s deal. What I do mean is that the songs exist in Penguindrum’s universe as songs by Double-H. It’s a constant reminder, along with their presence on the subway train, of Himari’s broken dreams and the fact that she will “never amount to anything.” During the ROCK OVER JAPAN sequence, the song is sung by Triple-H: this being Himari joining forces with her two former friends, at least in her own personal world.

    So yeah, as music Penguindrum’s soundtrack isn’t quite as impressive as Utena’s. Realize though, that the soundtrack is an active piece of the show’s massive mystery/tapestry, and your head explodes just a little bit. Makes you wonder exactly how much thought went into planning every little thing so that every element of the story, from the visuals to the soundtrack, was relevant to the central mystery both metaphorically and literally. Mindboggling!

  17. Pink says:

    @ kevin

    Try to limit triple posting, “mate.” I’m not sure that your opinions are related to each other coherently in any way considering you can’t explain why you think the art and music are overzealous and ultimately meaningless.

    I responded because you don’t have to be so condescending and nasty to psgels who just happens to be blogging MPD, a show you hate and feel the need to continually troll.

  18. Puran says:

    @Perrin: Ok, I’ll agree on that. Utena’s soundtrack was definitely more original. I didn’t really love it, but I can appreciate its originality and the mood it was trying to create.

  19. zesty says:

    As much as I enjoy the way Penguindrum’s current cycle of music is used, I do agree that it could use a bit more expansion. I hope they’ll add at least one or two more songs in the coming eps., but I’m skeptical. Still, I get the artistic choice – it’s all about repetition in this show – and I’m definitely getting the OST even if nothing’s added.

    Also, a minor detail, but it looks like the subway track diagram at the half-way point in the episode is – and has been for at least a few episodes now – showing where the story is and is headed, structurally-speaking anyway. Just after Sanetoshi’s monologue about the “war” beginning, we saw the position marker/the show’s name move fully from the diagonal to the straight part of the track. If that doesn’t scream “plot shift,” I don’t know what does. Obviously, this doesn’t help predict the specific content of the story, but I do find it interesting. Just another neat little thing I love about this show.

  20. psgels psgels says:

    People, you’re not really helping by trolling back….

    In any case, Kevin: I’m not young? (I’m actually double that age), I’m just a bit chaotic. I do check for the most obvious typos I make for each entry, but there are always a few that slip by.

    Also, I can sortof see where you’re coming from. The thing you mention about how this show distracts with bizarre imagery, I have that with Shaft series, which way for me just way too often try to insert all sorts of flashy colours to hide the fact that they really don’t have much substance. I disagree that Penguin-Drum doesn’t have much substance, though. Sure, it’s not as fast-paced and huge as the likes as the Armed Librarians or something, but on a smaller scale I do find that it created a bunch of interesting characters, with well developed places in the story.

    Also I really disagree with you about the music. For me, music has always been a core part of storytelling, and creating an atmosphere. To each his own, I guess.

  21. commenter says:

    This show has gradually been going down the hill for the last couple of months. I don’t feel the thrill and the enjoyment of earlier episodes. It seems like nothing is going on since episode 9. Perhaps the tell-tale sign that this show should have been shorter. They’re killing time with dull uninteresting characters like Natsume and yuri. A pity. Especially the episode on Yuri’s background felt forced and ridiculous at the same time. There’s only so much before the show changes from interesting and devious to just plain random events.

    By the way, the length of a soundtrack has little to do with how good it is. Kaiba had perhaps sixteen songs in total with just a couple of variations on them. It was amazing for the show. Casshern had mainly one song that was used as a leitmotif and it worked wonders. Escaflowne had a bigger soundtrack, but repeated a handful of songs all the time(shadow of doubt and a far cry, both songs not written&performed by kanno yoko by the way) and it really, really worked. Its crowning song is probably the one you hear when volken and van revisited fanelia. The quality of a soundtrack is not measured in size, and most of the time you’ll be comparing oranges to apples anyways, so don’t compare them. It doesn’t work out.

  22. hikaru says:

    No comments about Himari/Penguin girl losing all her clothes in the dream sequence? XD I was always wondering why she had to lose bits and pieces of her outfit as she walked down that weird bridge but I guess that was all just a set up for this episode lol.

  23. Raggers says:

    Psgels, i’m assuming you didn’t have much time on your hands when you wrote this.

    this episode can actually be seen as a turning point

    I’m surprised you didn’t mention the sequence after the ads, where we see the circle move to the next point. This ep it moved past a turn. I saw that coming last week.

  24. marktheknife says:

    Alternate POV here: I strongly disliked Utena’s admittedly unique soundtrack. Though it had lots of tracks, in my head they’ve all meshed into “The absolute destiny: apocalypse” and a less-bombastic remix of it (excepting the few classical/jazz/ballad numbers). And did anyone really like the overly-relevant lyrics sung during the battles?

    MPD’s soundtrack on the other hand is much more varied and energetic. It sets a mood, and ties in thematically, and in Himari’s story as wendeego pointed out. Also, it just sounds cooler and hits emotional notes better – Utena’s soundtrack in comparison dips into a goofy sort of romanticism that combines the cheesiest aspects of prog and ballads.

    Actually, in general, having started on MPD, and then going back and watching Utena, Utena is a vastly inferior product. I’m honestly kind of shocked to see that people compare it favorably to MPD. It makes me feel like I’m taking crazy pills.

    Its storytelling is meandering, with the middle 2/3 of each season just beating on the same few themes and ideas with little variation. Its descent into more symbolic, non-literal storytelling is somewhat abrupt, too broad in its focus to give much clarity to the viewer, and honestly not very engaging. Its world is not fleshed out (perhaps intentionally, but it’s still unsatisfying). Its character development takes way too long, and many characters are absurdly two-faced, often to the point they seem to be two separate characters. Its aesthetics are interesting at moments (particularly its more surreal ones), but overall it’s a very dull-looking show.

    Not to completely hate on Utena. I found it to be a fascinating flop, one that kept me watching for its moments of brilliance even as it kept me disappointed. I could see it being noteworthy for what it did with anime storytelling back in 1997 (with subversions galore). I’ll also give that its theme of true love vs. all the broken forms of love (transference, the pain of losing/not having it, sexual/seduction-based) is pretty interesting. And I’m open to the possibility I just didn’t “get it.” Maybe I’ll give the movie a try!

  25. iwasherexD says:

    “Anyways, Nadine then begins to walk down the staircase (vagina), stripping all of her clothes off. I’m going to say that this is her path down “rebirth”, and the taking off of clothes symbolizes being “born as a baby” with Himari’s new life.”

  26. wendeego says:

    @marktheknife: I see where you’re coming from. Not that I agree, mind! Pretty convinced that Utena’s the second best anime ever made, right after FLCL, so different strokes for different folks, I guess.

    I think that an important part of appreciating Utena is comparing it to its shoujo roots. Ikuhara came right off of Sailor Moon before doing Utena, and so like the latter, Utena has a ton of stock footage, an incredibly flowery aesthetic and a whole lot of alternative-sex relationships. The difference is that the stock footage is both lampooned and used to make a thematic point, the aesthetic is absolutely brilliant and the alternative-sex relationships go into even stranger territory, from Utena’s bond with Anthy for Akio’s connection to…yeah, won’t spoil it for anybody reading the comments.

    Watching Utena requires a certain tolerance for melodrama, and about as much patience as it takes to watch Penguindrum. I do think that Utena’s a lot more comprehensible, though, since it’s pretty firmly grounded in the shoujo genre in comparison to Penguindrum which isn’t really based in any genre at all.

    So yeah–in my opinion, Utena uses repetition better than just about any anime ever made; its soundtrack is both iconic and massively influential (count me in as someone who liked how the dueling song’s lyrics relate to the plot); the symbolism is perfectly comprehensible so long as you were willing to think; and the cast of characters are almost uniformly not who they seem. Also, the school was basically an illusory construction, so I didn’t have much trouble with the lack of worldbuilding since the school was pretty distinctive otherwise?

    ‘s okay to not like Utena, though. It’s a very strange anime and probably not for everybody (although you could probably say the same for Penguindrum as well.) Word of warning, though, not sure if you’ll like the movie any more than you’ll like the show, since it relies a lot on what you already know about the characters to make coherent sense (and isn’t quite as deep and a whole lot more obtuse besides.) It is one of the most visually stunning films I’ve seen, though, so there is that!

  27. jreding says:

    psgels, I completely agree re Utena’s soundtrack! It has been a favourite on my ipod for about a year now. The songs during the duels are just – for lack of better words – “epic”.

    Btw, I recently discovered the soundtrack of “Galaxy Express 999”. Of course is a completely different musical style but it also fills several volumes and enhances the mood of the show a lot.

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Ep. 4 of Tiger Mask was a lot better than the last 3, quite a hyped fight that was a full 6mins long. Will continue watching in hope of an awesomely long final fight.
Kaiser Eoghan
Kaiser Eoghan
Going back to the fanservice topic, its very easy to complain about it in anything but then something actually comes along that actually does it for you. I mean I always say that I don't watch a show/movie for its fanservice elements and stick with pictures on image boards, but then I ended up seeing a film where I actually got something out of the fanservice while watching the film its.
Kaiser Eoghan
The oujia prequel was competent genre fare, the director cared about the characters and every now and the built up a decent mood. Although jump Scares are there . And I always appreciate a horror film having a mean spirited ending. One of the rare cases where the young actors do well in a horror film. The pace is a bit uneven, rushed and a bit laggy .
Kaiser Eoghan
In the sense of how messed up/especially bleak those two episodes were.
Kaiser Eoghan
There was the sense too with both those episodes of "Jesus...I wasn't ready for that...."
Kaiser Eoghan
Though the first episode of the first season and the third episode of season 3 are very hard to beat. Adding to what I thought of s3 ep3 I felt that one hit me on the same level as s1 ep1 did so.
Though in previous seasons I generally only really liked 2 out of the 3.
@Kaiser, though the previous seasons where only 3 episodes long and you enjoyed 3 out of 6 in this season. So yo essentially get the same amount of enjoyment as previous seasons.
Kaiser Eoghan
Based on my comments, it looks like I had a mixed reaction to the third season. Three out of six, but the great was was great and forgives it but I still feel that there was more of a consistentancy in quality in the other seasons. I enjoyed every story in seasons 1 and 2.
Kaiser Eoghan
The final episode felt like a movie all on its own, I'd have gladly watched another thirty minutes of it, ending was a nice punch in the gut.
Just finished black mirror season 3. I hear people basically complaining that it's not as strong as the previous two season but I disagree. I really enjoyed this and this is a show that deserves much more episodes. Personal favorite is between shut up and dance and hated in the nation. Worst I thought was San Junipero. Overall thought each episode was interesting.
Kaiser Eoghan
On the upside I loved black mirrors fifth episode, I'm a sucker for war/action-dramas and I particularly liked the tech in this one.
Kaiser Eoghan
Yeah this is impossible for me to sit through, the romance part is also rather dull.
Kaiser Eoghan
Eh, this fourth episode is plodding and trite, feels like a bad, poorly dated 90s film.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Aidan: Third episode also instilled a great sense of paranoia.
@Kaiser: thanks for that mate. I have too much to say for Flipflappers but to put them all in coherent flow is goddamn hard. And like I said I still fell I left many details out: that gung-ho potato or Yayaka and the twins
@Friend: jugding from the last convention I went to, people loved Re:Zero customs (Emilia and Rem, Ram were highlights. Or you could try RWBY characters (I for once love to see someone cosplay Pirrha Nikos or Velvet Scarlatina)
Kaiser Eoghan
@Aidan: Didn't care much for new black mirrors second episode, then again I'm not really the target for that story. The third episode while a bit heavyhanded and predictable was suspenseful, nasty/mean and I liked that about it, did in 50 minutes what some thrillers fail to achieve in two hours.
Holo is a good one :0
Materials aren't a problem at all for the most part, except for anything too crazy like working in brass. I'd prefer it to be characters I'm familiar with.
Does it matter to you that they're from shows that you like, or are you just in it for the challenge?
@Friend Aidan has some good ones there. I'd also give the cast of Akame ga Kiru a shot, I don't like the series but it has a lot of neat character designs.
I was thinking simple as I didn't know what kind of materials you got on hand. I was also thinking of Holo from spice and wolf or Kino from Kinos journey either.
Mm, Tatsumaki might be not challenging enough to design for. Doesn't Shiki simply wear either a coat or Japanese kimono? I do work in set design and not in character prop design, but I'd love to try something that would let me reasonably challenge myself.
@Friend, Spit balling here but Tatsumaki from One Punch Man? I know the costume for that one would be simple enough. Or maybe Shiki from Kara No Kyoukai?
*I don't want to do anything too complex for my first try, but I also don't want to do anything boring. Boring would be a character like Rukia or Celty. Any ideas?
I remember talking about this with Emma/Kaiser before, but has anyone here gone cosplaying at an expo before? I thought it would be neat to try designing my own costume and try something else beside drawing on a computer.
@Kaiser, I am up to episode 4. 3 has been the best one so far.Though in all these episodes I pretty much figured out the twist from the get go. Still this shows always tends to get you thinking.
Kaiser Eoghan
I think the roles/identity thing with flipflappers, at least with the protaganist does fit in well with adolescence.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Aidan: I've only seen the first episode so far. I felt the acting was intentional and reflected the satire Brooker was going for on the shallow nature of society. Bleak as ever but gloriously grotesque.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Mario:Good in depth reviewing there Mario of flipflappers episode three.
Good god this first episode of black mirror is hard to watch. I know exactly how it's going to turn out but it's just so damn painful to watch.
Well, tbh up to where I've seen there's not much explicit yaoi in yuri on ice, only a lot of fujoshi fuel.
@Kaiser. thanks for the torrent. Gonna blaze through this today.
@Topgavin, as someone who watches a metric ton of anime I am rather surprised at that estimate that 90% of it contains Yuri.
My god those gay scenes in Yuri on Ice are hard to watch for me. Wonder if this is how it feels to be a girl watching 90% of normal anime nowadays.
okay, Flip Flappers episodic review was up. This is my lengthiest weekly review so far and I still feel I missed a lot of points. Damn you Flip Flappers
Kaiser Eoghan
You have seen the light, not needing to know everything thats happening to enjoy something ^_^
Kaiser Eoghan
I've given some consideration to reviewing that oujia film followup.
Whether you see one or the other is entirely up to your preferences, so it makes no difference to me which is worse. I have gotten very tired of generic character types, but again that's just because of the things I decide to regularly follow.
I will say if it must come down to either unnatural dialogue or unnatural character types, at leas the character type is speaking their own words and not the words of the script writer.
Or was that a black and white fallacy? Maybe it was a little of both.
@Realjustified, K-Off wasn't agreeing with me. That's a Moving the Goal Posts logical Fallacy but well I will answer regardless. Honestly it's preferable to have neither. The big mistake you are making here is that you are putting down a condiction that a show must have one or the other. But both cartoons and anime can have both. I just think it's a lot more prominent in cartoons than anime.
Like, having read hundreds of harem manga over the years, a majority of the ultimate love interest always happens to be the first girl the protagonist meets.
Wait wait wait wait. Aidan and K-Off. I get that dialogue in cartoon can seem like it was written by a script writer, but at the same time, lots of anime have characters whose sole purpose is entirely scripted. The whole spectrum of "deres" and everything. What do you think is worse? Unnatural dialogue, or unnatural character types?
You guys should really go fuck yourself, it's a solution and it's nothing short of great!
You guys should really watch the first 4 episodes of Bungo, it's a prequel and it was nothing short of great!
omg!! I just realized To be Hero was one of the show that I reviewed its 1st episode back in Chinese Animation post. I watched raw then though
forgive me if I'm a bit too overwhelmed by Flip Flappers... For this episode alone I took like 25 screenshots...trying to write a review now...
I have absolutely no idea what is going on in Flip Flappers plot. And yet for some reason I am OK with that.
Anyone out there that's a fan of crude humor should go watch ep.3 of To Be Hero. Certinately stepped it up a notch from the last two humor-wise.
One downside I can think of already is that I'm bound to lose or break one of the detachable controllers. The cost for those pieces is what I'm most interested in.
Nintendo Switch hmm? Honestly it looks too good to be true. I expect some major downsides to this thing.
I like cartoons, don't get me wrong. Certainly good for a change of pace. But there is something about the way they are written that I find rather distracting.
I don't know, maybe if I said it's like the difference from how characters talk in movie vs how characters talk in a sitcom?
@K-Off, I said one liner's or jokes. Not one liner jokes. It's hard to explain. Basically when I hear a conversation in anime even if it is based in stereotypes, it at least feels like a conversation that's being had in the moment. In cartoons however there is a layer of artificiality and it feels like characters know what a person is going to say and has a response prepared.
That's probably why some of my favorite anime in recent years haven't been very heavy on character archetypes, or were either parodies of it.
Comedic dialogue with anime in recent years have leaned too much on the idea of playing off character archetypes. The collected character vs the energetic character, for one. I'd like to see more variety. Some more word play, hyperbolic humor, body humor, etc etc.
@Aidan Not quite sure what you mean by that, because it's certainly not even a majority of cartoons that rely on cheap one liner jokes. I suppose it's entirely up to taste, but I can appreciate the energy in cartoons like Steven Universe or Regular Show when compared to the increasingly repetitive dialogue found in some recent anime.
@Topgavin: I just read that review and his main reason being Shelter is pretentious. oh well! Can't never please anyone.
Thought I'd check out the reviews for Shelter on MAl and the top review is a 1/10. Apparently because it's a cute girl we sympathise with her more, which is bad because reasons. I mean.. what? MAL never ceases to amaze me
@Mario, no. It's more that the dialogue keeps trying to push out one liners or jokes regardless of whose talking.
@Aidan: maybe because they spoke in your native language do you can feel that it's artificial, ya know? I know I have the same problem with Vietnamese drama/ cartoon and maybe Japanese people have that same issues with anime?
By which I mean, the way characters talk in cartoons is very...artificial. Like you can tell that the dialgoue was clearly written beforehand and it never really sounds natural. At least to me.
@Anon, I wouldn't. The writing and structure are too cartoon. What with the episodic nature and dialogue that generally pushes for a comedic tone.
Kaiser Eoghan
Flanagan also directed absentia which I haven't seen yet but I think someone I came across of 4chan linked it to being lovecraftian?
Kaiser Eoghan
Oculus was a film of two halves for me. Hush was a pretty standard home invasion thriller, making the victim deaf was an interesting twist but not as unique as you might think, still suspenseful though.
Kaiser Eoghan
I never saw the first oujia film. Though Mike Flanagan who did the sequel, he's never made a bad movie but he's never really made a great one either.
Kaiser Eoghan
I stick to the firm belief that cartoons and anime, visually should do and be their own thing. I'll prefer a western artstyle for cartoons rather than one pretending to look like anime style.
But this is a good topic and I'm sure everyone has their own opinions so I'm looking to hear some more arguments
@anon352392: no they aren't. For me not because of where their production based, nor their intended audience, but rather their styles, both visually and storytelling-ly, are different
Anime,” they assert, is not a “style” of illustration or animation.
That's where I differ to those guys. For me, anime is a style. In that sense, I consider RWBY, and Canadian-produced short Flutter as an anime. Thunderbolt Fantasy is not and anime-influence shows/movies that are intented for Western audience like AniMatrix or Afro Samurai are anime
@Anon nah they wouldn't be because they aren't made by a japanese producer for the japanese market. Quality isn't the question, production is
NX and Red Dead Redemption 2 trailers tomorrow.
They are good series and i honestly like them alot more than most anime series, would their quality make them anime?
What about cartoons like Steven Universe, Gravity Falls, Wander Over Yonder, Star Vs The Forces Of Evil?
In other news a sequel to an absolutely terrible horror movie called Ouija is out and it's...actually pretty good? Wondering if critics were paid off or it is legit good. Well it did have the guy who was behind Oculus and that was a pretty good movie.
Simplify the term down enough and anime is literally anything animated but the whole point of the term is to distinguish it. For to call Spongebob an anime makes me want to projectile vomit. Point is this, you say you watched a cartoon, people think Tom and jerry, Scooby doo etc. You say you watched an anime, people think Cowboy bebop, Attack on titan, etc. Whole point of the term.
For example, I don't consider Avatar or RWBY to be anime for while they use anime style, the writing is fundamentally structured like an American cartoon. Through I would consider Bloodivores an anime even though it was made by a Chinese animation company, making it technically a Chinese cartoon.
As far as what is and isn't anime I honestly think of the term as a means of distinguishing it from cartoon which gives the impression of being for children. It's like Graphic novel is to comic book. Though techically graphic novels are issues of comics bound in book form, the term Graphic novel is often used to distinguish works that go above superhero comics and whatnot.
Basically I think it was due to Porter Robinsons involvement that they didn't consider it anime.
@Aidan: Did the mods give any concrete reasons why they didn't consider it an anime?
@Mario, It wasn't the community that had the problem. It was the mods. The community made it pretty clear that they considered it anime.
So despite the art style is obviously anime, the character speaks in Japanese, and the production was animated by A1 Studios, it's not an anime? Sometimes I feel sad that the anime community keeps limiting themselves with such fixed minds.
I saw it yesterday and yes it was good. For a 5-minute story, they don't make it too overwhelme with details, and still pack an emotional punch. Moreover it elevates the song. Good stuffs.
Shelter was quite good though. It works well and the animation was beautiful. Song is not bad either. It's got a nice emotional punch to it though it's a bit simple a story.
Well anyway I only saw all this because I checked out the video for the first time and wanted to see how others thought of it with a quick scan through reddit. And I get this shitshow instead.
Playing the victim is the one really pisses off the internet. For refusing to admit you f*cked up only encourages people to shove how you f*cked up into your face. That's what really grinds peoples gears.
Yep, seen that too. The mods even put up another tread about the video and tried to guilt trip people by saying they got death threats. Look, internet rules 101. If you said or did something stupid admit to it and just walk away. Do not try to deflect blame or play the victim, that only adds fuel to the fire.
@Aidan oh yeah saw that live lol. Porter himself even commented on twitter about it, gotta love internet drama
So did anyone happen to catch the big old shitstorm of that Shelter music music when a mod of the Anime subreddit decided it wasn't "Anime" enough and removed the discussion post about it? Oh internet drama...what silly nonsense.
Finally caught up with JoJo. Diamond is Unbreakable has turned out to be much better than Stardust Crusaders. Should have waited for the season to finish through as I really loved marathoning it.
I had a feeling that might be the case considering the source materail for luger.
@Mario Oh I watched that, certinately worth it. Packed more story that some 12-episode shows do nowadays and gorgeous animation.
and I will check out "Shelter" music video to see what all the fuss is about
*this weekend to be exact.
Sounds like Luger Code 1951 is an OVA that will air next week, the same air date with "my" Zaregoto OVA.
@Mario: doesn't sound real at all to me lol
@Mario, I might be able to manage. If all else fails I can talk about the past of these historical figures.
While I don't mind watchinng Drifters, I swaer if I had to cover that show, I couldn't come up with anything to say.
Do you guys know what language the fairies speak in Drifters? It does sound like a genuine language
@topgavin: humanity has declined is a great show. It has good writing and dark, witty sense of humor. I could talk about it in length but psgels pretty much covered it all. He was really impressed by that show however.
That should be me covered till the weekend. Why do all my shows air on the weekend...
@Mario nah I've watched the whole thing but I'd heard about it at the start of this year and put it off. The dialogue between her and the fairies was great stuff, probably gonna rewatch it this weekend now that you mention it
Alright, I got three posts written up and will be throwing them out in about two hours or do.
I thought you've finished it. Yeah I love her character a lot, so cynical but witty. My favorite moment was when she read about fairy's plan to invent religions. She was like "so religions are invented?" (beat) "I've learn something new today". Priceless
@Mario Oh nice, it was one that I had heard about but never got round to. To put it in simple anime terms, Watashi is best girl
@topgavin: I just finished the series yo mentioned the other day: humanity is declined. Man, I love it. I know now I have a thing for dark twisted absurdist anime
@Ano340004: the name is Watashi ga Motete Dousunda, or to put it short Motete. I have fun with it but i'm not that enthuastic
@anon the english name is Kiss him, not me. Search through the first impressions if you need the jap name.
then that girl really loves BL (boy love)
what is the name of the anime that the girl is fat and then she got depressed because her favorite boy anime died then she got thin?
Season 7 is awesome so far too. It feels like the tone of the show is finally back to normal and it feels like Adventure Time again.
Whew, I binged all seasons of Adventure Time this weekend. The show hit a low spot in Season 6 but I think it needed to happen...Poor Finn needed the serious character development after what he did to FP.
You guys are too hard on it
Motete is very funny
Kaiser Eoghan
When it comes to gag manga and four-koma, I just eventually reach a stopping point with a comedy series in that format. Even with hidamari sketch.
I think it was typical light novel trash based on what was in the PV. I laughed that despite it being horrible that the crowd still cheered anyway, likely because it had a bath clip in it.
The PV was hilarious. I had no idea what the anime was about.
@Aidan I'm good, I'll stick with Working.
@K-Off, you could switch to something like Gi(a)rlish Number if you like. I for one am really digging the satire of the show. Plus I like that it's basically showing how an utter train-wreck of an anime can be made. That PV in the last episode was truly painful.
Feeling pretty disappointed with Working. I haven't gotten any more cynical with comedies, at least I don't think, and its flaws are so irritating.
@Adam Le, I find that with Comic book dialogue. Which is one of the reasons I have gone off marvel movies. Cartoons have it to a degree as well.
I love the instagram shots in Yuri
Maybe I can have a watch through those live action films and do a compare/contrast to see which version works better. After all movie and tv series are 2 different medium, and live-action vs animation is the topic that we never get tired of
speaking of which, the overlap between anime and live-action adaptation from manga is overwhelming. For this year alone, there were Erased, 3-gatsu no Lion, Fune o Amu, orange, and Chihayafuru (part 1&2). Those were just the ones I know.
@Adam: Don't know which genre you're into but you can try Fune o Amu (The Great Passage)
Adam Le
I can't seem to get into any of these new shows. I don't know, the dialogue always seems off to me and the forced comedy is a big turn off.
Reminds me of a thought I had when I was last at the Getty art museum. People walking past works of art hundreds of years old, but only taking a second-long glance before moving on to the next one. Not their fault really, it's only the professional critics who can understand what they see with depth.
I'm the opposite really, they're getting paid for what they said so they better know their shits
Kaiser Eoghan
I suppose I'm slightly envious of professional critics somewhat.
Sometimes you're just meant to experience the ride you know. I don't watch those explained video anymore because after all it's just one guy's opinions.
Kaiser Eoghan
Kaiser Eoghan
And I mean people who art professionals or students.
Kaiser Eoghan
I guess I'm just unsure of something, how many people watching "arty" stuff are able to pick it up on their own. By looking up an "explained video" or "explained essay" to get it, am I copping out?
Kaiser Eoghan
I feel like I've begun getting on board with the european art stuff but am really only scratching the surface with the Chinese and that stuff.
Kaiser Eoghan
And find myself missing whats going on sometimes.
Kaiser Eoghan
I'll admit I do find it frustrating, that even though I can like art films, emotionally connect at times, appreciate the visual techniques and admire them for being so different without looking up analysis by people far smarter than myself I honestly feel lost sometimes as to the meaning.
@Kaiser: Apichatphong Weerseethakul's films are so otherworldly and spiritual that I wouldn't dare to call them "dreams" anymore. Check out his "Uncle Boonmie", "Syndromes and a Century", "Cemetery of Splendors". he has such singular vision that just watch and experience his films are rewarding enough
@afgm: well, if we really go over-analyze it, bunnies can represent desire for example ^^
like eating sweet snow is so randomness for me
@Badesh: the things you said might be something I might do in the future. After all I love dissecting symbolism. But for Flip Flappers I need to know more what are intentional and what are randomness first
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