Posted by psgels on 12 May 2012 with categories: Fate/Zero

A message to the commenters who have already read the Fate/Zero light novels: please do care to avoid spoilers here. This is not a blog about the Fate franchise, but rather this a place to discuss the Fate/Zero anime. If you’re going to spoil that Natalia dies it rather diminishes the impact of that twist, especially since that was the entire thing that this episode was leading up to. This is the one thing I dislike about adaptations of very popular works: it’s really hard not to get spoiled about things.

In any case though, the way in which Natalia did die… was pretty creative. It also tied in very much with Kiritsugu killing a few in order to save a lot, and the plane being taken over by an extreme version of killer bees: it showed another layer of what can be done with the magic in this series. It’s also interesting how professional the characters operated. It’s not often that you see professionalism to such a degree in anime. Although I do wonder who Natalia was able to smuggle guns on a plane. Is that something that magic can do as well?

Overall, I’m surprised that we get two whole episodes of Kiritsugu’s background so relatively late in the series. With this though we can understand his actions in trying to eliminate Lancer, and how his views are the total opposite of Saber’s Chivalry. And I guess that some sort of intermission was needed before the showdown between the four remaining pairs.
Rating: *+ (Great)

23 Responses

  1. Gabriel says:

    I found it pretty nice to see those events, like this airplane, and the building that he collapsed. Since in Fate/Stay Night they tell that Kiritsugu did those things, it’s really nice that they actually showed why they happened!

  2. someloser says:

    Well, Happy Mother’s Day, Kiritsugu!!!

  3. Random_Passerby_Number_612 says:

    Any decent magus can do jedi tricks. No, really. Mental interference (suggestion, memory manipulation, etc.) is among the most basic magecraft that any magus must learn. Oh, but of course, mental interference is pretty much useless against people with running magic circuits. But as long as it’s a normal person, no strong will can protect them.

    • Random_Passerby_Number_612 says:

      Oh, and that was a reply to how Natalia manages to smuggle firearms onto a plane.

      • meow says:

        I wonder if the Mage Association could have arranged for Natalia to get on board with weapons. It looks like they have enough influence to cover up events like this.

  4. meow says:

    ……frak. WTH. Ok, this is a bit much. Natalia intended to land the plane but to keep the infected trapped and somehow find a way to wipe them out. She was working for the Mage Association. Couldn’t Kiri have called on them for help? Maybe arrange an isolated landing site surrounded by a small army of mages and spells to deal with the plane? Or how about flying low enough for her to squeeze out the cockpit window and then blow the plane. I mean, she managed to get from the cargo hold through infected territory to the cockpit without getting infected herself. A miracle if you ask me. She probably has some tricks up her sleeve. It looks like this kind of thing happens quite a lot so the Mage Association or even the Church may have thought up some contingencies. Especially since the Dead Apostle himself had been dealt with. Why blow the plane without so much as a discussion of options? I mean, it looks like she accepted Kiri’s decision in the end but….damn. He intended to kill her regardless of what she thought, with or without her permission. Natalia was the more experienced hunter and probably knew a lot more about the potential uses of magecraft than Kiri. She might have had some ideas on how to deal with the outbreak that could have saved her skin too. It wasn’t the same as Shirley. Shirley asked Kiri to kill her. This is messed up.

    Saber may be right. I’ve got a hard time thinking what kind of wish Kiri would make on the Grail, assuming he gets his hands on it.

    If you’re going to spoil that Natalia dies

    It was an avoidable slip but I’m not sure if it would be considered a major spoiler. The when and the how weren’t mentioned or even whether it would be an important plot point or just something mentioned in passing. I don’t think what was posted would have been enough for anyone to predict what would happen this episode, unless it prompted someone to go look for spoilers. If anything, the follow up protest may have been a bigger spoiler, putting a really big highlight that Natalia’s death would be a major event.

    Here’s me asking for a FZ novel spoiler. Did Kiri in the novel blow up the hotel with Team Lancer in it without evacuating the hotel? Was it changed for the anime?

    • Kuroichi says:

      Going into semantics of what constitutes a major spoiler is only asking for trouble – You’ll end up with a whole bunch of clowns posting spoilers, then defending it by saying “well, it wasn’t THAT big of a spoiler”, or “You should have been able to guess that would happen”. Just keep it to the basics: a spoiler is discussing something that has not happened yet.

      Saying people should not protest spoilers because the “protest may have been a bigger spoiler” makes absolutely no sense. So if I tell you how shows you are watching end, its all good because I didn’t tell you HOW they got to that end?

      It shouldn’t be a superhuman feat to restrain yourself from posting things that haven’t happened yet in the medium these posts are about (in this case, the anime).

      • meow says:

        You have a point but I wanted to argue that some spoilers may happen inadvertently when discussing a particularly complex point in a story. I personally would have preferred that Natalia’s death wasn’t mentioned in last episode’s post, especially when it would be reasonable to assume the event would happen in the following episode but avoiding all spoilers would hamper any kind of useful discussion on this topic, which to me would be a shame. I could use some serious clarity trying to figure out what the heck to make of some of these characters and their current actions. Still, you do have a reasonable point. Maybe I need to look for another place to discuss F/Z too.

    • Civlov says:

      He did evacuate the hotel in the novel, too. He was blaming himself for becoming soft. You might also notice that he sees a mother with her crying daughter afterwards. They basically look like Ilya and Iri, cept for a color swap. And this isn’t really a spoiler, you know? :p

      The thing about Kiritsugu is that he is mentally ill. Rationality comes before personal feelings and it hurts him so much afterwards. He basically killed both his parents whom he loved for his ideal and people he doesn’t know.

      He never wants to take any risk of failing, even if the risk is minimal like Kayneth still getting in his way. Blowing the plane up was in his opinion the best option because it’s a guaranteed kill with only one casualty.

      I hope that clears up the rumor that Kiritsugu mercilessly blowed up a plane because his target was inside(though tbh, in general he would really do it). Everyone except for Natalia was already beyond saving.

      • meow says:

        That’s the part that gets to me. His target was already dead. The rest were just drones. They still posed a danger but there should have been options. Usually you want to hope for the best but prepare for the worst but in Kiri’s case, he seems to be always acting on a worst-case-scenario. I would have thought that Natalia would have been like a senior partner to Kiri too, meaning that they would collaborate on what would be the best course of action. If it meant blowing up the plane with Natalia in it, I thought the two of them should come to a consensus on it. If anything, if this were to parallel Shirley’s situation, it would be Natalia ordering Kiri to blow the plane. Didn’t happen. In fact, Kiri actually assured Natalia that he had a backup plan to deal with the infected, as if Natalia was clear to land the plane without having to worry about it. Little did she know that he was planning to take her out along with them. Was there so little trust between them? Were their objectives so out of alignment? Would Natalia have chosen to risk a Ghoul infection in a major city just to save herself?

        I don’t know how Kiri can even tell the difference between friend and enemy at this point. Who does he protect? Who does he save? Who does he sacrifice?

        • Mike says:

          Eh, you realize that both of them knew exactly what was going to happen right? That’s why lil’ Kerry and Natalia had those sentimental conversations, they both knew that he had to bring the plane down and that there’s no way for her to make it out alive.

          • meow says:

            A part of me kept telling myself that in the back of my mind but I just can’t buy it. The sentimental convo felt like a contingency should the worst happen but there’s nothing in Natalia’s behavior that indicates that she was aware of Kiri’s intentions until the very last second. Why have a fake convo with every indication that Natalia is going to walk out alive then? Why does Kiri, after the deed is done, wind up openly declaring that he’d killed his mother just like he killed his father? If anything, I’d like to believe that Natalia, in her last moments, would have wanted to express approval or at least acceptance of Kiri’s choice, if only to soothe his conscience. Instead, the only people who see a hint of her final expression is us, the audience.

          • Mike says:

            Natalia being how she is will always try to find a way to survive at all cost, even if it means letting the ghouls and bees escape, both her and Kiritsugu knows that. Kiritsugu being how he is will always try to save the most people possible, and both of them know that as well.

            It’s not like they just met each other yesterday you know.

      • wicked says:

        The author of Fate/Zero(who created works like Phantom of Inferno, Madoka Magica) has a thing for tragic endings and tragic heroes to almost a pathological level, to the point that he almost quit writing because he cannot bring himself to write happy/good endings. Fate/Zero’s saving grace for him is that Fate/Stay night has a happy ending, therefore the tragedies he gets to create will eventually lead to the happy ending of Fate/stay night.

        Kiritsugu is a rather typical archetype in his character designs, capable character with inflexible fixation on their ideal or goal, even if they waver along the way, they return to their original fixation in the end.

        Sacrifice is part of his act of saving. To him, it’s pure naivety hesitate for a high risk plan without sacrifice when there is a foolproof plan with sacrifice. He chose to let that naivety go the moment he found out not killing his first love led to an entire village being burned down. His travels with Natalia only reaffirm his belief that there is no such thing saving everyone without a cause. There is no best case scenario because Kiritsugu has no such faith in the world.

        • meow says:

          I see. Same author as Inferno. That figures. XD

          I generally try to avoid tragic shows, especially if it’s got gut shots like this. I felt a little bit more prepared to handle this one because I had read up a little about the backstory, way back before they decided to animate it. But this nuance wasn’t included. I guess it’s good drama and certainly not run-of-the-mill but I wouldn’t watch it more than once unless it was to research for discussion.

          I never watched Madoka. Yeah, little magical girls getting their heads bitten off. No, thanks.

          I wonder if the upcoming Total Eclipse will get this grim. I know Alternative was.

          • wicked says:

            Madoka actually has an end that you could mostly interpret as happy, though the path to it was convoluted and painful, and the two main characters really arent the happy ones.

            He’s just very good at putting his characters into very very dark situations. He almost uses the inverse of Deus Ex Machina, instead of having a miraculous cure that resolve an impossible problem, he throws an impossible problem to thwart a miraculous cure. I cant think of any of his work where his protagonist did not get force into despair then deeper despair(Madoka the possible exception). It’s also the genius of his work

          • meow says:

            I have to say it is compelling drama. So was Requiem for the Phantom for that matter. It’s just so damn sad. I just wish there was a more positive way to get under one’s skin.

    • Mike says:

      The Association is not a charity organization, they are not going to create a bigger mess harder for them to contain over a merc’s slip ups, and the Church would’ve happily done exactly done what Kiritsugu did.

      Also, there’s no “squeezing out the cockpit window” on a flying jetliner, nevermind the fact that she doesn’t have any parachute.

      • meow says:

        The Association is not a charity organization

        True, but I doubt if they would want to waste useful assets either. Do hunters as effective as Natalia grow on trees? At the very least, I would have liked one of them to have at least brought it up so it could be shot down.

        Also, there’s no “squeezing out the cockpit window” on a flying jetliner, nevermind the fact that she doesn’t have any parachute.

        She’s not an ordinary person. She managed to get through a galley full of infected Ghouls and bees without getting bitten – a rather miraculous feat, if you ask me. It seems really ridiculous to me that she made it that far only to get shot down. I thought she got infected too and that’s why Kiri had to take the shot – to save her before she turned completely in the way Shirley wanted Kiri to for her.

        He’s like a twisted James Bond, who keeps losing the women in his life.

        • Mike says:

          it’s a simple matter of value vs. liability, a merc is ultimately disposable, that’s why they use them.

          the world of nasuverse has magic, but it’s no dragonball z, laws of physics are not ignored in nasuverse. It’s one thing to crawl through a window, it’s another to crawl through a window with winds coming through at speeds of 2~300mph, which is matched only by the most powerful of tornadoes.

          and what exactly can she do even if she somehow got through? other than getting fling off the plane and plummet to her death? (assuming she doesn’t already die from hitting parts of the plane as she goes off flying.

        • Leica says:

          Note that Kiri wanted to incinerate the bees, the ghouls were not his main concern.

        • wicked says:

          It would probably give most people a peace of mind if Natalia was bitten, but that would lessen the power of his choice

          Natalia will self-preserve above all else, it’s the among the first things she taught Kiritsugu and probably hammer into his head. He had no doubt she was going to land the plane, if there was a way to leave the plane safely while in the air she would have done so already. If he had not assure her that he had way to eliminate the ghouls and get her out, she would’ve found a way to get out whether it meant releasing the ghouls or not. The fact that she didnt bring up the option to him herself meant that she probably had no way to do so(As you say, she was more senior, so if the mage association was an option, she would have told him long ago), and if Kiritsugu had asked her, she’d have lied.

          In the novel, he considered that Natalia safely comes back without releasing the ghouls or the demon bees a miracle, and the fact he cannot put faith into such miracle shows that he is as Natalia says, more of a a machine than a man. It’s also why when true miracle was an option as the Grail, he pursuits it mercilessly.

  5. Terry says:

    Reminds me of the flight TWA 800 that was shot down just outside of Long Island (New York City) in the mid 90s.

    Interesting times: you had hundreds of people who witnessed the shoot-down from all over the area…they didn’t know each other, came from disparate backgrounds but they all came away with the same story at he same time about a white light ascending into the air and hitting something, a fireball, and a “boom”. Meanwhile the Clinton Administration (in an election year no less) keeps squwaking “Move along, nothing to see here, just an accident”.

    If 9/11 happened under Clinton, he probably would have claimed it was an “accident”too. Maybe the NY Air Traffic controllers directed into the WTC, Pentagon and into the ground in Pennsylvania all at the same time.

    “Move along, nothing to see here, just an accident”.

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SuperMario
@anon877854: just finished ACCA episode and I agree that everything getting really interesting now. Review will come up soon.
Anonymous877854
Well I thought ACCA would dance around the truth for a few more eps but they had a bunch of big reveals this ep. Will be interesting to see where it goes from here.
AidanAK47
@Kaiser, Not too fond of really old vn games like those. They put up a presence of being point and click adventures. I have a hard time enjoying the stories when the "Gameplay" keeps killing the pacing. Big offender was Eve Burst error. Really couldn't enjoy that one at all.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Aidan: And policenauts, how about that one?
Kaiser Eoghan
Honestly I really don't mind all the side drama/romance in rakugo...in the longest time its been an anime that gave me feelings worth feeling.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Aidan: Would you in any way recommend snatcher (I think that counts as a visual novel) or is it a dated product of its time. On a side note I love the soundtrack.
Kaiser Eoghan
Case in this point I was blown away by utawerumono and chaos head when I was a less experienced viewer, nostalgia keeps poking at me to watch the sequels, but I just know chaos;child will be awful as will utawerumono 2.
Kaiser Eoghan
Hate when this happens, keep getting this itch to watch the followup to something I liked in the past but no full well I'd hate if I went back to it.
Kaiser Eoghan
Hopefully I'll make time for Irae and subahibi, don't know anything about clockwork. Ended up getting involved in what will likely turn into a business course soon.
AidanAK47
Some really great Visual Novels localised this year. Muv Luv Alternative, Sharin no Kuni, Dies Irae, SubaHibi and clockwork key line. It's good year to be a VN fan. Now I just need an update about Baldr Sky.
AidanAK47
Subarashiki Hibi is getting published by Front Wing. Hell goddamn yes. Finally I can read it and be traumatised for life.
Anonymous870083
mm okay thanks!
AidanAK47
@Anon1, Think you might just have to go with a torrent. It's pretty hard to find direct download anime these days.
Anonymous870541
the latest episode of rakugo just made my heart sank. i didn't think it would get better than it already is. i thank god that i didn't read ahead
Anonymous870083
does anyone know where I can download the remastered version of the Utena series? without torrent?
SuperMario
the same very thought here Lenlo. What I considered the weakest part turned out to be so layered. Sorry for ever doubting you, Rakugo.
Lenlo
And that smirk at the end, beautiful
Lenlo
The weakest plot point of S1 has just become the best part ever.
Lenlo
OOH MAN. I was not ready. The entire first season was all a setup. I cant. What. HOW DOES IT GET BETTER
Lenlo
Cant wait to watch Rakugo tonight, just got home and im lookin forward to it,.
AidanAK47
I think before grabbing the protest signs it might be worth considering if the thing you are demanding be uncensored is even worth it. Oh yeah, now you can see genitalia in crap sex scenes that were crow bared into the plot. No more need to use your imagination.
AidanAK47
Some protest because they want there porn. That I suppose I can understand even if I think they would be better off buying some nukige. But then there are those who demand it just for the sake of standing against censorship. They don't give a crap about the game or the fact we are getting the exact same thing the japanese got. What? Censorship of sexual organs? DOWN WITH CENSORSHIP!
AidanAK47
There are people actively proclaiming they won't buy the game, because they can't see dicks. That is not hyperbole. This is literally exactly whats happening here. And they just act so goddamn self righteous about it. Porn is not the goddamn point of these games. Shouldn't even be in them in the first place.
AidanAK47
So another Sekai Kickstarter is up for a trilogy of Visual novels called A Clockwork Ley-Line. Chipped in my bit as I am going to be buying this regardless but like goddamn clockwork you get the idiots yelling for Mosaic removal. No matter how I try to rationalize it, this just sounds stupid.
Kaiser Eoghan
Just whenever I think Rakugo may be dragging its feet it comes out a gives me three big strong moments in this weeks episode, you will know them when you come to them.
K-Off
Dubbing in more subdued performances work fine. It just becomes unbearable when it involves shouty dialogue, which idescribes most of the Japanese games I play.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Aidan: I think at the time it allowed Bagel (where did he go?) to find some exploit/gap in the sites security too.
SuperMario
I mean the spoiler code in the comment section. ^^. Like I don't mind if readers give (potential) spoilers but I don't want to ruin the fun of other readers as well
AidanAK47
After all it wasn't a intended feature of the old shoutbox. We were pretty much hacking the thing.
Kaiser Eoghan
I seem to remember all those old html codes stopped working on the old shoutbox too at one point.
Kaiser Eoghan
There was also originally an ability to animate text too of the shoutbox and have gifs appear in the message box but not as links.
AidanAK47
I remember some HTML code worked with the old shoutbox but nope. But I suppose you could change the colour of text to white...though that would effect everything you write.
SuperMario
Btw, do we have spoiler tag here Aidan?
SuperMario
@anon861679: Agreed. They have big ambitions, but they seems unsure on what to do next. I mean engaging your readers to give their thoughts is good, but if it is a mean for you to get inspiration to write essay about isn't that great. Well, give them say 6 months until they can settle down (they just launched this site for 3,4 months only)
Kaiser Eoghan
Despite being fine with anime in English, I've almost always felt that voice acting in videogames isn't as good.
Anonymous861679
Hey mario, that anime feminist blog was well, kind of awful. While they're well intentioned, it felt like they were pushing tumblr stuff onto chan stuff and that always ends up in a smoking mess.
SuperMario
Okay I'm going to erase my memories right now
SuperMario
I swear I'll stay off reddit for good. Have been spoiled by the development of ACCA by one of their "theory". As soon as I realized it's freaking spoiler I stopped but what done is done. Ahhhhhhhhhh
K-Off
Christ Fire Emblem Heroes is pretty addicting, micro transactions are not necessary at all. Though it irks me that I can't get Japanese voices. Dubs just make me cringe every time.
SuperMario
@ckspike: Hand Shakers, the very quality that makes you brain cells die while watching it. Well, I actually think the music is one of the best part of the show, now that you mention it like that...well...*slap my forehead*
ckspike
... my roommate just told me the background music when I'm watching Hand Shakers sounds like a bad porno... Now I can't unhear it. Fuck!
Lenlo
I havnt kept up with Academia, for some reason it just didnt catch me as well as the movie first did.
AidanAK47
You know what's funny? I thought little Witch Academia would be the hardest one to blog. Yet halfway into the current season and it's the one I write the most about.
Lenlo
I actually dont read many blogs. Mostly just this place and the occasional pop on reddit
Anonymous859067
I'd like to present to one of my favorite blogs, A work I just created: Greed Island! https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.tc2r.greedisland
AidanAK47
I go to Reddit anime myself but I don't really like the upvote system. Basically the majority rule opinions get put to the top which more often than not are jokes.
HelghastKillzone
I listen to podcasts on youtube and others places as well as going on Reddit Anime to hear a thousand people yammering away.
Kaiser Eoghan
I irregularly follow the episode reviews on ANN and sometimes read standing on my neck. I fell out of the habit of following random curiousity.
SuperMario
Anime Feminist (animefeminist.com), while sounds ambitious on paper, hasn't been too hot unfortunately. I know they aim to be "big" so they're still figuring out how to do it best. Well, good luck for them!
SuperMario
Oh, I know I've mentioned this site before but you guys should read it (blog.sakugabooru.com), this site is one of the only few blogs that I actively subscribed to read their post. They have some insights to the anime industry that is very informative and inspiring
SuperMario
I also think that this chatbox here plays a great role to keep a fair amount of readers for the site, as many sometimes just come here to give their two cents on certain anime.
SuperMario
I just checked out rabujoi blof for the first time, (https://rabujoi.wordpress.com) and I think they're in pretty good shape. Content-wise are solid (as far as I read), and they update their post pretty regularly (comparing their amount of posts last month (80) to ours (28), ouch)
SuperMario
Just really wonder, what are other anime sites that you guys follow beside this? Well, ANN and RandomC are a given, but I found myself haven't bothered to read ANN's episodic reviews lately (mostly due to time constraint)
AidanAK47
Don't tell me this is gonna be a regular thing.
Lenlo
There we go
Lenlo
Oh god JSON objects. I thought that nightmare was over
SuperMario
Mine is working probably as well. Thanks a bunch K-Off and glad to hear back from you.
K-Off
No problem.
K-Off
I really need to figure out how to get those damn tooltips working again on the sidebar thumbnails. It'd be useful to have the descriptions popup.
AidanAK47
Cleared my cache and it looks to be fixed. Thanks as always K-Off. I would be completely screwed without you around.
K-Off
Alright I think that did it. Let me know if it pops up again. If you still see it, clear your browser cache and let me know if its still there.
AidanAK47
Messages still get sent. You just might have to reload the page. We are working on getting it fixed.
Vonter
AidanAK47 I can't get into Fate since like with Nanoha there's a lot of stuff with those names in it. Zero was the most straightforward, yet the buildup was very dragout but the payoffs where very worthy.
HelghastKillzone
testing message.
AidanAK47
This is what I get for updating the bloody plugin.....
AidanAK47
He finished it and was telling me what he thought of Saber defeating Gilgamesh. Minute he said that I was like "OH GOD..." He watched the Deen 2006 adaption. Sadly it loos like he's not going to bother watching UBW TV despite me showing him part of the berserker fight. With Fate/Extra, Fate/Grand Order, Fate/Apocrypha, Fate/Oath under the snow and all the rest this problem will happen again.
AidanAK47
You know I wish the Fate series did a better job naming it's series. I was introducing a newbie so I gave him Fate/Zero first. He loved it so I specifically told him to watch the UBW TV Series and don't mistake it for the movie. He then went and watched the movie. I told him to watch the TV series regardless and brought up the MAL page to show him which one.
Kaiser Eoghan
Ah, there's definately no harm in doing further reading on more arthouse stuff before reviewing it/watching/after watching, it extends our understanding and is pretty much required.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Aidan: Go for it, you might sell me on reading it.
Kaiser Eoghan
Yeah, I generally only write reviews every now and then, and they tend to be kept simple and to 200-300 words. My writing ability only really works when I write in stream of consciousness.
Anonymous855550
Zestiria is such a feast for the eyes... The colors and backgrounds are so vivid and magnificent. Story has improved on the game's weaknesses too!
Lenlo
Given enough time, im sure I could write something, but as I writer I tend towards quick, decisive statements of what I think and why. Engineer, so technical documents are like the only thing I know how to write.
Topgavin
@Supermario ah, I'd say I'm the opposite in that I sometimes don't know why I like something so much, and when I read a review about it I can relate my own experiences and put it in my own words pretty well. Can thank Highschool eco for that
SuperMario
But to tell you guys the truth, I never think that I'm cut out as a reviewer (even now), because I'm a type of viewer who more perceive (I know why I like/ don't like stuffs) than express (just can't never explain stuffs well)
SuperMario
@Topgavin: it's depending on what grabbing you really; as I always find shows with heavy symbolisms like Penguindrum or Flip Flappers the easiest to dig deeper. But those are always my kind of show to begin with
Topgavin
I'd find it really hard to write something about a show without reading about it first; watching it one time by myself I usually only notice the big things. Stuff like Flip Flappers I had no clue what half the episode's hidden meanings were, can't imagine reviewing a show like NGE or penguindrum.
SuperMario
that's exactly how I write my reviews anyways
Lenlo
I cant imagine writing a review, id just repeat myself with different words but the same intended meaning over and over again
AidanAK47
Wonder if I should write a review of this. Might be hard without giving too much away.
AidanAK47
(Finishes Sweetest monster Visual novel)
.....well....fuck.
(Buys all authors visual novels on steam.)
Lenlo
Sadly, I doubt Nioh will get a PC port. Sony is pretty stingy on their exclusives, like Bloodborne. But I am so very happy with Nioh. I love technical combat like this
Kaiser Eoghan
I suppose this means I'm looking into this rpg maker game thing now isn't it? Might aswell.
Kaiser Eoghan
I remember the word animerican used to describe things like avatar last airbender. Filthy word =P
Anonymous853606
God no. Jiro Taniguchi died.
AidanAK47
@Lenlo, I have been hearing very good things about Nioh. Really hoping it gets a PC port.
@Topgavin, No real surprises there.
Topgavin
I'm sure most of you have heard, but looks like New Game is getting a season 2 out of all things. Apparently they had good sales, and I can certainly see why. CGDCT with yuri undertones and clean animation is hard to get wrong, let alone not sell.
Lenlo
Just started with Nioh, and oh my goodness do I love it.
Anonymous852887
anyone play resident evil 7? its so good.
AidanAK47
Thought that's because the term American Anime just feels wrong to me on all levels.
AidanAK47
@Anon, they do not. They are cartoons.
Anonymous852775
DO people call D.C. Comics animated movies American anime?
AidanAK47
@Anon, I am certainly interested in seeing the next episode. Those minisodes were pretty good too. One thing I thought the writting faltered on though was the comedy. It really was a little too slapstick considering how serious the drama was.
SuperMario
@Lenlo: ah remind me the time I went to Texas (Corpus Christy) before X-mas time and I was wearing short pants and thongs (nice!!!), then went all the way up to Niagara Falls and I was almost freezing there.
Lenlo
See, I love winter, but its almost non-existent in Texas
Anonymous852268
@Aidan: I agree. I loved To the Moon. It's so good seeing emotional drama that isn't centered around high-school kids. Seeing the ups and downs of a whole long life of a person gives everything that happens way more impact.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Mario: An Australian friend put it as "A sunbaked rock in summer, a giant zoo, that actively tries to kill its population"
SuperMario
Not that I'm enjoying the winter either. Why autumn always go so fast?
SuperMario
Believe me but summer here is way too much. When it's too hot and dry it starts bushfiring really badly. And it's too hot that even a big fan straight in front of you don't do you any good
Kaiser Eoghan
What is this mysterious creature known as summer you refer to? =P My country is grey as a black and white film =P
SuperMario
I'm wondering how freezing you guys have to endure right now, but the place I came today in Aussie just reached 50 degree celsius this noon. So hot I felt myself burning
Lenlo
I think the part I liked the most, was just how satisfying those mud splatter sounds were. I dont know why, but its in my head
HelghastKillzone
Youjo Senki 6 subs came out at 11pm PST.
Lenlo
Atleast Rakugo didnt get held up. Still amazing as ever
AidanAK47
Well I spent my time waiting for it to come out by playing and finishing To the Moon. Got to say, it takes some real skill to make a game in RPGmaker that can make you really feel something. But maybe I am just a sucker for this kind of story.
SuperMario
Hey, I would be very frustrating if Hand shakers got delayed. But I agree this delay is caused by Being X. And Scum's Wish, haizzz, this is the show we love to get pissed at. Haha
Anonymous850298
I blame Being X.
AidanAK47
Sigh, Youjo Senki 6 is delayed. Why is it always the best shows that get delayed? If an episode of hand Shakers was delayed no one would give a crap but nope. Gotta be the show you want to watch right away.
AidanAK47
@Anon, in both anime and manga I never liked that character much.
Anonymous849783
Meh, dropped Masamune-kun. Seriously why do they always have to shove in these one dimensional characters with a crush out of f* nowhere. It never made any of these shows more interesting, it's always the opposite.
Vonter
@Kaiser Eoghan - I find it weird having the teacher being so unashamedly evil. In a way I like that, but at the same time I can't relate to the notion of people like that existing IRL.
Kaiser Eoghan
As I continue to watch scums wish, it becomes an anger inducing as much as it is engrossing experience.
AidanAK47
Or the UBW movie over the TV series. You just don't do that.
AidanAK47
That's like recommending someone to watch NGE death and rebirth instead of the TV series.
Kaiser Eoghan
Meh, I just got fed up with the padding in the tv version.
AidanAK47
Jojo has the kind of entertainment that clicks with you or doesn't so I understand if you didn't get into it. Though to give it a fair chance I would recommend trying the first episodes of Battle Tendency. It starts at episode 10 of the first season, you can jump to it. If that doesn't catch you then Jojos really isn't for you.
AidanAK47
Don't listen to Kaiser. The OVA is bad.
Kaiser Eoghan
....found out where a friend had been off to lately, making a movie and he ended up actually making and finishing and I got first dibs. Had a hard time commenting on it as I know the guy personally.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Mario: Totally with you on the academy thing.
@Lenlo: If you ever try jojo again and get onto part three go for the ova instead as it trims down an overly bloated arc.
Lenlo
For JoJos, I couldnt get through the first season. It just didnt hook me
Lenlo
What I dont understand is how anything other than Mob Psycho won best animation, cause my god.
Lenlo
I think Erased lost not because of the libido, but because Yuri was "gay" and "progressive" and most important of all, recent. Yuri had just finished airing so it was stuck in everyones heads. Of course it was going to win everything
AidanAK47
Erased truly deserved to win that category and it only lost because people voted with their libido instead of their head.
AidanAK47
If there's one thing that really makes me angry about these awards it's Yuri on Ice winning most heartwarming moment for "The Kiss". Because A) It wasn't a fucking kiss and B) Even if it was that isn't heartwarming. Oh I am sure something is getting warm but it sure as hell isn't your heart.
AidanAK47
Likely the main reason Kira didn't win main villain because Jojo has grown to a episode count which makes people hesitant to pick it up. Not to mention many would lose interest by Stardust crusaders midpoint.
AidanAK47
When it comes to judging quality you have to leave it to the people who have experienced enough of the medium to truly be able to critical judge it. Pretty darn sure most who voted didn't even bother watching everything worthwhile each season and just gravitated towards whatever they were exposed to.
AidanAK47
Lets not forget someone voting multiple times and bot voting. Because yes, people really do that. As you two pointed out, a public vote was never truly going to be a accurate gauge of quality. For you are not only opening the vote to anime lovers but also newbies and those who simply haven't refined their tastes yet.
SuperMario
so they either abstained their votes (which actually was reasonable); voted for something popular or even voted based on what their kids liked the most (which was flat out unforgivable).
SuperMario
This from my own frustration mostly when it comes to awards like this. But I've been following the Academy Awards for way too long now and every now and then you heard something that really disheartened about their voting process. Like for example many of the Academy members admitted that they don't care to watch anything animated because... it's kiddy stuff
SuperMario
TL;DR: my point is I have mixed feeling about the whole Crunchyroll awards. One more thing that I noticed about the nomination is that the pool was dominated by shows from the first half of last year.
Lenlo
I dont think public voting is the way to go is the thing. Popularity contests are horrible. With popularity contests moe is going to be near the top every time, while shows like Rakugo never really have a chance. And I think there is little doubt that Rakugo was one of the best shows last season
SuperMario
@Lenlo: there is an issue with the first thou, because reviewers like us don't actually represent the whole public opinions. So it's all come down to the very reason they create an award in a 1st place (your second point). But with voting we can't really reason why the winners win the trophy, right?
Lenlo
The problem with awards like that is for them to mean anything they need 2 things. 1) A board of voters who are actual reviewers who have watched a large portion of what was on shelf that season. 2) Reasons for why each thing won its award. An award without reasons means nothing
SuperMario
Other issue about voting for these awards is that the nominating body and the voting body aren't always the same. Usually the voting body is broader and more generic in taste, so I'm not at all surprised when shows like Rakugo couldn't win. Too art-house for their liking. Well, at least it got nominated which for me is good enough.
SuperMario
That's the thing. When it comes to awards, they are more 'popularity' contest than actual quality, since people tend to vote for the safer choice (the one that are both popular and mildly critical success), YOI fits the bill here.
Lenlo
Those awards were not the best and little more then a popularity contest imo.
SuperMario
Actually with that line-up I had no problems with YOI taking the top spot
SuperMario
I actually forgot about the Crunchyroll Anime Awards so I came to check the winner. Guess which show won AOTY huh? Alright, at least it wasn't Kabaneri or Jokers Game
Kaiser Eoghan
But the best one was Mask of Phantasm.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Aidan: And return of the joker also.
Kaiser Eoghan
It has aged admittedly very poorly, but I always got a great kick out of that old 1994 spiderman cartoon.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Mario: I think its fair to use the term K-anime or C-anime for the Korean and Chinese influenced stuff, or maybe just anime would be just as appropriate. If some Argentinian guy can write/draw a manga for a Japanese manga magazine (big comic superior thats the magazines name) and have it actually be called a manga, it should be the same for China/Korea.
Lenlo
Mhmm. Marvel had the movies, but DC had the animated series
AidanAK47
Man, I loved the villains of Batman Beyond. Inque and Shriek had such interesting powers. The DC animated shows tended to be the one that didn't treat you like a kid while watching.
Lenlo
Well, they released a trailer for Samurai Jack S5, so its coming. Batman Beyond I also enjoyed
AidanAK47
Ah Samurai Jack. Wonder how that Adult swim revival is going? Batman the Animated Series as well didn't need Batman to crack off jokes every minute to be great.
Lenlo
Agreed. Samurai Jack was one of my favorite cartoons for that very reason. It ran the gamut of genres, each episode being something different.
Also I used Nichijou cause it was the first to come to my mind as a "Kids Show", though Love-Ru works as well
AidanAK47
One thing I think Cartoons could do to move away from the stigma of being for kids is having more genres than Comedy and Action adventure. Or at least stop putting comedy in everything.
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