Posted by psgels on 10 September 2012 with categories: Hyouka

This was an interesting episode. I mean, movie or no movie: the series is ending next week, so Kyoani can pour even more budget than usual into it. The result is a really well animated episodic story with weird build-up.

I mean weird build-up in the way that this episode on one hand develops Satoshi, it explains his actions of some of the previous arcs, and on the other hand it suddenly turns Mayaka and Satoshi into a couple. Now, I know that my memory isn’t the greatest with these kinds of things… but have we ever seen hints to that twist before? I mean, it’s not something that blossomed overnight: they’ve apparently been going on for more than a year now. And with the incredible attention to detail that this series has, I find it hard to believe that they’d never hint at this. So did I miss something?

But whatever faults Hyouka may have had there, it made up for it by giving a very different meaning to his part in the school festival arc. What he did there wasn’t jealousy, it was a battle of him trying to win from his obsession. He allowed himself to dabble a bit with trying to solve things, but he never went far into it like Oreki did. It makes much more sense: if he’s such a large sherlock-fan, then why doesn’t he try to formulate theories or brainstorm? Well, that’s why. And that’s also why Oreki’s plan last week went wrong.

Also weird was Chitanda. I mean, the usual progression for a character like her is to done down: as she grows up she becomes more mature in the process. She however is completely different and after the school festival arc, she suddenly got more extreme, acting more and more on her feelings than she already did before. The animators really liked to exemplify that with a particular few scenes.
Rating: 5.5/8 (Excellent)

38 Responses

  1. Jalapeno Bagel says:

    Not exactly sure if Mayaka and Satoshi are a couple or not. Sort of left us on a cliffhanger at the end as far as I could tell. What we do know (and it’s been explicitly noted in the series from the beginning) is that Mayaka has a crush on Satoshi. I guess Satoshi explicitly said he reciprocates her feelings this time around, but he doesn’t want to accept them because he’s afraid of how he’ll change (or revert is a better word).

    as for chitanda, i think she’s quite mature overall, but naive in her thinking. with her family background, she has to be the mature girl for the sake of reputation, but with the classics club, she’s been given more opportunities for her real self to appear.

  2. Qwerty1 says:

    You never caught onto the Satoshi Mayaka thing?

    The basics for it got laid down in episode 2 where Oreki pretty much introduces Mayaka as the girl that’s been crushing on Satoshi since middle school.

    On top of that there are plenty of cues in Mayaka’s behavior around Satoshi. Most recently is how she got all flustered and blushed when he saw her in her outfit on new years, the exact opposite reaction she gave Oreki.

    • animefan34 says:

      For the love of God, how could anyone never “caught onto the Satoshi Mayaka thing”? Besides being explicitly said in episode 2 and hinted over and over, we had the second ending sequence where Mayaka follows Satoshi during the whole thing and blush when she finally handcuffs him! Are you gonna say that you NEVER watched the second ending sequence EVEN ONCE?

  3. Gryph says:

    They’re not a couple yet. Satoshi’s just been leaving Mayaka hanging for a year…

    There’s a large amount of Mayaka/Satoshi foreshadowing leading up to this episode. In fact it was getting to the point where I would’ve been really disappointed if they hadn’t addressed all of the hints they were giving us.

    From the very beginning of their interaction there are strange glances and half conversations between Fukube and Ibara and the reflection of their personalities and relationships is a major sub-plot of the show in my opinion. The back story of the refused chocolate goes a long way to solidify the hints they’ve been dropping…

    Fukube’s reluctance to enter into a relationship because of his personal uncertainties is such a 16 year old boy truism it was almost painful.

    Its been subtle and slow, but so is the rest of Hyouka…

  4. Bunny says:

    satoshi and mayaka have always had a thing so its not just random

  5. vjott says:

    “have we ever seen hints to that twist before?”
    Mayaka and satoshi aren’t a couple but there have been several hints scattered throughout the entire show. From the episode when Oreki introduces Chitanda to Mayaka and said that she’s had a crush on him since middle school to the scene with the two at the end of the Kanya Festa arc leading up to this episode. You should rewatch some of the earlier episodes and the Kanya Festa arc (I suspect you were probably more caught up with the mystery that emerged in that arc).

    “She however is completely different and after the school festival arc, she suddenly got more extreme”
    I don’t think she got more extreme. We’ve seen her anxiousness to be helpful before when she ran around desperately seeking help for her club during the Kanya Festa arc. What we saw here was her trying to fix something that she thought was her fault and she was terribly upset. Given her personality, I would say that her reaction was to be expected.

  6. brianwuzhere says:

    Is Hyouka actually ending next week though? Anime Calendar and ANN both say it’s running for 24 episodes.

    • animefan34 says:

      When is people going to understand that ANN is NOT A RELIABLE SOURCE? And why would anyone go to a site where anime fans are mocked and made fun of anyways?

  7. wicked says:

    It’s pretty much stated the first time you see Mayaka, that she’s crazy about Satoshi. I mean it’s all over the school festival arc and the fillers as well.

    Satoshi and Mayaka is the romance of the novel series really, but it’s really not like you get pages and pages of them looking at each other.

    What the anime does that you dont really get from reading the novel is up the romantic tension between Chitanda and Oreki. In the book they sort of just struck a balance point where Oreki knows he has to and how to deal with Chitanda and Chitanda kind of just going to Oreki because he’s reliable. It’s mainly a “mystery” book first, so it’s likely they’d just maintain this above friend below lover status.

  8. TheUltimateReaper says:

    Actually now that I think about haven’t all of the characters been acting more extreme in this episode? Satoshi finally stopped avoiding the issue with Mayaka, Mayaka was love struck and fiery. Chitanda was consumed with immense feelings and Oreki actually cared about something enough to get him feeling/moving.

    I don’t necessary think being mature means you are more docile, I like to think that it means your more in touch with your true self, and your emotions.

    Sure plenty of hits though it wasn’t anything major.

    Also let me get this straight. Satoshi, was basically depressed about being obsessed with wining/being better/the best since he always failed or that when he did win he felt empty, so he decided to just enjoy life/not be consumed. Yeah?

    Every new episode of Hyouka keeps making me like it more. Looking forward to next week.

  9. sushi55 says:

    whatever guys. Just enjoy the show!

  10. meow says:

    I loved Tomoe’s Valentine message. I didn’t know there was another japanese character that sounded so much like “Ai” (love). Does it really mean “pity”?

    • ronbb says:

      Yes – Tomoe’s message is brilliant, and that word does mean pity or grief. I guess Tomoe’s teasing her own little brother, and Houtarou’s comment to the chocolate – bitter – is also smart to end the episode.

      • meow says:

        Haha. It’s pretty apt. I mean, in the end, the only valentine’s day chocolate he got was from his sister. That Chitanda having a house rule about not giving gifts to people they’re close to. What a tease. So there’s no way to tell the difference?

        Actually, what does that make the Chitandas and the Juumonjis? Chitanda delivered a gift to them. Hmmm…

  11. Ofx360 says:

    Yeah, you definitely missed the hints.
    Mayaka was crushing on Satoshi the entire show. This show does a bit with overt detail, but it also excels at subtle, realistic detail. Normally in anime, if a girl likes a guy, its thrown all in our faces and the girl acts like a moron all the time. But in this show: eye movements, subtle blushes, awkward pauses, weird shuffles responses and reactions. They all build up to show that one character likes another. And throughout the show, they’ve been showing those hints.

    And you may think it’s too subtle, but it think they executed it well. It felt like a realistic interaction between one person that liked someone after getting rejected, and another that has very immature, but, again, very realistic feelings.

  12. Shin says:

    I’m a little shaken you didn’t get the whole Mayaka-Satoshi thing to be honest… It was so wonderful and felt so life-like through the whole series. THAT’s how teenage love goes the way it should. Not that strange horny-kind … thingie.
    The problem with modern teenage romance animes nowadays is, just as Ofx360 said, that they don’t show subtleness at all when it comes to love between said teenagers. And it really, really bugs me… It always feels like a kind of “body-orientated” love, you know? However in Hyouka I feel like the characters are seriously connected.

    Mayaka is really a sweet girl. I’m happy that Satoshi actually feels the same way about her, I’ve never been sure if he’d actually friendzoned her or something. o_o Well he kind of did, while not really. That’s what I mean: Teenagers just are strange like this.

    • meow says:

      Hm. It looks like a potential train wreck though. I sure hope typical teen romance goes a little more smoothly than this. It takes some callousness to be able to literally break up another girl’s feelings in order to avoid a resolution. And there’s some amazing depth and resilience to Mayaka’s feelings to be able to so gracefully accept what Satoshi did. Well, like Oreki, I kind of figured it was Satoshi from the start. Go way back to Mayaka’s introduction scene where Satoshi called Oreki and her their middle school’s best couple due to their constant bickering. I think Satoshi has some serious personal issues to work out before he’ll be ready to accept Mayaka’s feelings but on the other hand, he doesn’t want to lose what connection he already has with Mayaka. Like Jalapeno said, it’s a cliffhanger. My money’s on a time extension. Satoshi suddenly accepting Mayaka’s feelings feels too much like a cop-out after this week’s drama. I think somehow, Satoshi may have to have some kind of event that will make him want to bet his feelings one more time, this time on Mayaka, instead of solving mysteries without Oreki again like the Mystery Thief case. But that might be a story for another time.

  13. Nys says:

    I enjoyed this episode a lot and I was really looking forward to it. :) I was very surprised that you claim you didn’t notice the hints about Mayaka and Satoshi…it was setup nicely throughout the series as other commenters have explained. I’ll be sad to see Hyouka end.

  14. ujer says:

    A great episode as always… hyouka is the only anime that i waits to watch every week. But the only flaw is Chitanda.

    She is very annoying from her attitude, movement and voice…
    This is the third annoying female character i ever saw in anime after shana and louis…well, they annoying for this so called ‘tsundere’…
    chitanda’s almost whispering voice in early episode really annoy the hell of me…its getting little bit better though in latest episode.
    Still, she like to stick her nose into people business and her movement is really forced. It’s not natural.
    OH GOD ANNOYING…
    Write this comment cause can’t stand it any longer.Need to channel this annoying feeling.

    • Shin says:

      I also had a problem with her sometimes. She has had some really, really nice moments, but on the other hand I feel like the creators are overdoing it a bit sometimes… I like KyoAni’s character animation very much (in this episode especially, Chitanda looked very nice here I think~) but sometimes she moves waaay too bubbly and cutely. Like, no-one could do that irl without being told by someone ‘dude what was that about’ – cute girl or not. O_o Sometimes she’s depicted just too cute and pure for my taste. I didn’t really like her role in the festival arc either.
      Uh… I still think she’s a nice and sweet character, and imo the voice actress fits her perfectly (even though I can understand why her voice would be considered annoying). I especially liked her the last few episodes – seeing her pouting over something Oreki said or making a lame, dumb/sarcastic joke herself is much more enjoying than some moe-ing.

    • wicked says:

      Ugh I hate overly positive and compassion people with no sense boundaries, Don’t you? Damn you, naive goody two shoe cute girl that wont leave me alone….

    • meow says:

      Hm. I dunno about unnatural. This is probably one of the more realistic depictions I’ve ever seen of this type of “moe” character and I buy her completely, even though I’ve never met anyone like her in real life. The way she shot out at the Astronomy Club about the missing chocolate is the same “shoot-before-you-think” mentality that we’ve seen so many times before but in much cuter circumstances during the Kayna Fest. She’s ditzy and adorable to the point where it’s sometimes hard to take her character seriously but I think she showed a lot of elegant poise in the temple visit episode and this episode should have blown her ditzy image right out of the water. And I’m amazed at her seiyuu’s performance. I mean, if KyoAni were to somehow put Chitanda and Ritsu together in a scene, I think you’d have a hard time figuring out that they’re voiced by the same person.

      • wicked says:

        she does more fluffy soft voice characters than Ritsu type characters really. You can say it’s more of her bread and butter. I mean she was Manami in Oreimo, Aria in SYD, and Wendy in Fairy Tail

        • meow says:

          Aria…that Aria. I’ve watched SYD so many times (trying to decipher what they talk about) but I never caught it. I have complicated feelings right now. XD Very interesting.

  15. ujer says:

    About the seiryuu, don’t take me wrong. Each of them performed greatly. All of them fit perfectly with the character.
    My only problem is when they overdoing it. In early episode especially the episode where chitanda ate the wine chocolate, the movement look so fake and forced. If you do watch the series acted by akb48 idol, you understand what i meant. It’s almost they been forced by the director to act cute and moe.

    It’s understandable.Maybe this is one of the fanservice to make people adored chitanda more. This is obvious because there isn’t any character have a problem like this.

    The best thing in hyouka compared to other anime in this season is character development and look like even the voice actor is improving along. Like i said, in early episode, chitanda voice got this screeching sound that reallly annoying. However the screeching sound is started to dissapear in latter episode even though not completely. If you sensitive to this kind of sound, you would realize it.

    However i vote this anime is the best of this year after natsume yuujinchou. Always like this kind of anime.

  16. sato says:

    I’m kinda surprised nobody has mentioned this, but all along I’ve actually had the impression that Satoshi was gay, or at a minimum unsure of his sexuality.
    By his own glossy words he started fresh in high school. This means middle school was “back then,” and yet he still rejected Mayaka at the height of his obsessive time. So it doesn’t add up.
    It would actually be a good character study to show a realistic teenager dealing with sexuality issues in a non-lgbt focused anime. But who knows how it will end up, haven’t read the novels.
    Maybe that’s too much to expect from this demographic. Would that change your opinion of him?

  17. meow says:

    Ordinarily I would say the topic never really came up but after Satoshi’s confession to Oreki at the end of episode 21, I would say he treasures Mayaka, although, yeah…it’s really uncertain if you could call that love. He thinks highly of Mayaka and wants to always have her around but that could be friendship rather than love. I’m not sure if he’s attracted to her the way Oreki is attracted to Chitanda. Then again, I don’t know see Satoshi showing signs he’s attracted to other guys like Oreki either.

    I think there’s just not quite enough character development to say either way. Somehow, I don’t really care either way either. Satoshi’s an interesting character, whether there are reveals about his sexuality or not. Well, I think it would be nice for Mayaka if he were to fall for her. XD Dammit. 22 was such an open, to-be-continued ending episode. What happens after that? The “Little Birds Can Remember” series seems to be all about character development rather than mystery-solving, which is great for me, cos I like all the characters. It was really nice to see Irisu again one last time too. And….was that ARCHER?! XD

    • wicked says:

      Now that it’s over, I’ll just spoil it. Because it would’ve been mentioned as a passing comment anyway if a movie about the 5th book was made. Mayaka and Satoshi indeed became a couple though it was not immediately after Valentines day, they sort of just came back from holiday a couple.

      • meow says:

        Mmm..leaving all the juicy details up to the imagination, huh. It’s a bit of a pity the story isn’t ongoing. There are a lot of interesting side characters that get very little development like Kaho, Mune (the school prez), etc. I was expecting a major arc involving Kaho to show up somewhere. And…wow…she looks good in a miko dress.

        Lots of loose ends too. Kudryavka’s Order hasn’t been published. I was wondering if Tanabe might get Ayako Kouchi involved in reviving the project or perhaps act as a rival to coax Muneyoshi into drawing again. And then there’s Hyouka. It got published and all but I really do wonder if anything would fall out of the tree if it got shaken up, like the identity of the black rabbit and maybe even an appearance by Sekitani Jun. Would be nice if he were able to make peace with his troubled past. And of course, getting to finally see Tomoe’s face!! I kind of had a theory that she might have gone traveling all around the world trying to track down Sekitani Jun. Maybe she found him. It also might be interesting to see Houtarou grow enough to go head to head against Tomoe.

        • wicked says:

          I have no reason to believe this is valid, but I have heard floating on some random forum that Chitanda’s uncles will make an appearance in an OVA episode. Though exactly how I have no clues, sinc eit would have to be an completely original story

          • meow says:

            Well, Hyouka got a high sell-through and made it into many hands. Some even got sold online, which means a potential nationwide audience. What if it were to fall into the hands of survivors of the old faculty who expelled Sekitani Jun, or the black rabbit. The black rabbit, possibly a person of power now, might reappear to try to cover up the issue by complaining against the Classics Club and expel it’s members for slander. In order to protect the Classics Club, Sekitani Jun makes a reappearance. Something like that? Haha..too shounen, I guess.

            Sigh…I wonder if Houtarou will wind up with Chitanda. I hope he grows up enough to catch her properly or they might wind up in a 3 centimeters situation. She is something like a princess after all. An arranged marriage is very possible.

  18. Arno says:

    No more mysteries ? Just teen couples now ? Why is it still called Hyouka ?

  19. Satoshi says:

    Satoshi is gay. Period. No erase. His actions and everything about him tells it.

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SuperMario
According to ANN, this new Owarimonogatari will be a special 2-day events, which honestly I don't know what that even means. Most of you might grin your evil grin right now but I'm crying inside with that news.
SuperMario
The LWA finale didn't do much for me sadly. Croi's roles as a main antagonist is just not good. And I feel like in the end I don't know much about Suzy or Lotte. I think the worse episode for me was the one right after the twist about why Akko can't perform magic, because it's as Aidan said
KT
Thus Little Witch Academia comes to an end. I will miss it. Despite the mistake IMHO of the Croix Arc, this was a good series, and the last episode went back to the very elements that made me love it at the start. It was a happy series, and gave me a warm fuzzy feeling in some hard times. I thank it for it. It could had been exceptional, but I guess they wanted to try something more.Ah well.
AidanAK47
Really glad they used that Scarborough fair song one last time before the finale. I really love that song.
Anonymous1215349
SukaSuka's finale was beautiful, a great way to end a great anime.
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Aidan: I guess the big question I have is, do the character interactions coupled with what assume will be some kind of tragedy element work together well enough to make the viewer care and invest in the characters?
AidanAK47
So that's the end of SukaSuka. Better than I thought it would be. Honestly didn't give it enough of a chance in my preview. As far as light novel adaptions go it's above average. Though it does still suffer from it's cliches. Nothing outstanding but a worthwhile watch nontheless.
Anonymous1214845
Have you seen Shonen Jump is making an international manga contest? https://medibang.com/jumpplus/entry/
SuperMario
@Lenlo: you know it when you see it. At first I didn't believe they jumped the shark, but based on the events after that twist, yep it has settled for something much cheaper imo.
Lenlo
For Bahamut, im still enjoying it and we have another cour to go. I think it, and the first Bahamut, are good shows. For Kado, im only on ep 4 so im very curious what shark gets jumped
Kaiser-Eoghan
I think given the pace I'll watch 1-2 or 2-3 episodes of re creators instead of once a week.
Kaiser-Eoghan
In the end Bahamut suffered the same fate as the first one, I could never call it a bad show, I just never ended up feeling it.
Kaiser-Eoghan
I've given my thoughts on tsuki ga kirei before on here but I'll add by saying that I never expected it and uchouten 2 (despite the weak wrap up I liked the lead up) to be my favourite of the season.
Kaiser-Eoghan
About five years ago or so could have seen myself really having been in the mood for LWA.
Kaiser-Eoghan
I wasn't as impressed with Uchoutens finale as Mario was,I found myself more annoyed by how clumsily done it all was.
Kaiser-Eoghan
For me kado jumped the shark with its latest direction and Aidans review along with flicking through this weeks episode kind of confirms I'm done with the show. A show I was initially unsure of but thought might become something.
AidanAK47
@Anon, Yeah....at least LWA's finale was pretty good and I think there's a possibility of a second season. With the Criox/Chariot plot line out of the way I say they could really bank on it's potential. Even if they don't, this series was still quite enjoyable.
Anonymous1211365
Man I couldn't agree more with Aidan about LWA and Kado. I still like and enjoy Kado but damn it could have been so much more.
Kaiser-Eoghan
Ntr trap appears to be a non-seinen/shounen yuri manga given its publication magazine.
Vonter
Not all people work as fast, but that's what companies expect nowadays. Which is why CGI is preferred over practical effects. Or even why anime has used more 3D that painted backgrounds, cars or other props that take time and work to be drawn.
Vonter
No. I get deadlines are tough. Companies and customers want everything made as fast as humanly possible, yet reality is that making things good takes time and money. I wouldn't be surprised that's why Berserk comes out every 6 months, the art is too detailed and the story is slow paced. Yet the anime was planned to be made in a year or two so it's evident either way, crunch is expected.
Lenlo
I think you misunderstood what he meant when he said the industry was a mess. Mangaka routinely work themselves into a hospital because of the demanding schedule
Vonter
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Vonter
It's also a heavy flaw of the internet, having mainly binary opinions of good or bad. Which makes it hard to tell if you'll like something in the 7s like Nier or Alien 3 (might not be a 7 but opinions make it sound like it is). Divisive products that may or not may suit one's tastes.
Vonter
Personally I think the issue has become what suits your tastes, what are you willing to give a chance and what hits beyond the medium it is presented.
Vonter
@AidanAK47 "Manga in general is great but Jesus Christ the industry is a mess". - I mean, movies, games, and other entertainment have the same issue, since everyone has a big slice of the pie, yet there are like a million things competing for one's attention.
SuperMario
On that note, apart from the 3 shows I'n currently covering (Eccentric Family, Tsuki ga Kirei and ID-0), I will give a full review on Grimoire of Zero, a show that I feel rather difficult to pinpoint exactly on its quality.
SuperMario
Can't believe we approaching the final week of this current season. Gonna be a busy week of blogging with the usual weekly posts plus the final impressions.
SuperMario
@Anon1206174: I agree with you on both counts. And Sakura Quest has never been bad, but it could have been deeper and less messy. If you plan to watch ID-0 (I suggest you do), don't get your expectation too high because it works much better when you expect nothing of it. Like each episode I was genuinely surprised how good ID-0 actually is.
Kaiser-Eoghan
I remember one of Aidan's visual novel posts where he said theres potentially hundreds of VNs un-translated and LNs too, makes me wonder just how much un-translated manga we are missing out on.
Anonymous1206174
The ID-o posts sound pretty interesting, I am really thinking of dropping Sakura and watching this instead. Really loved the beginnign of Sakura and that abandoned town atmosphere it had, but I am not feeling it anymore. The recent episode about Shiori was great again though..
Kaiser-Eoghan
*looking
Then again he's an extremely forgetable person.
Kaiser-Eoghan
Oh Godammit, looing back over my comments I meant to say Souta not Setsuna, I suck at remembering non-English names.
Anonymous1205999
Meh - I really like this season but I already have my first cases of 'good-show-disappointing-ending/second half'
Anonymous1206022
KT Here:RE:Creators , we need to know more about the rules for Altair to see if that works. It might, and it might not. With what they know they have a good plan. But I was thinking why not just do a Super Smash Bros type game with the characters? I am sure that would generate enough stuff in order to lock her.
SuperMario
On Re:Creators, I find a better solution instead of going all cross-media like the show suggests. Someone could just make some fan-fiction on Altair that purposely show her weakness (like get busted when expose to the sun, or the magic word that render her skills useless). Less efforts, more effective
SuperMario
Man, I agree wholeheartedly with what KT said here: mass media actually sells, so it keeps the industry to a more stable position; then the art-house/more adult oriented anime can have some freedom to do what they like.
Kaiser-Eoghan
I think its more that I have to read it all at the same time as expecting action to come , it might change my mind if I watched it in English.
Anonymous1205580
KT here: I accept the mass media because it raises the funds for the less mainstream stuff I like. That is how I make my peace.

On RE:Creators. I get what you guys say. But for some reason I do not find the exposition heavy in this series. Every person has his own limit I guess
Alonaria
@Kaiser: Yep, that sounds about right, lol. I take my Sheldon in concentrated doses. I might give the Young Sheldon spin off an episode or two because it's highly exaggerated but still somewhat relatable to me.
Kaiser-Eoghan
I feel big bang theory is a show for people who know nothing about nerds/nerd culture to find funny.
Kaiser-Eoghan
And then theres this thing about Sheldon being some kind of autism spectrum thing , which is kind of annoying to hear when I am on the spectrum myself and never really found the character all that amusing.
Kaiser-Eoghan
Probably not the strongest reason to go off a show but, it was people around me going on and on about big bang theory that eventually put me off it.
Kaiser-Eoghan
lol is it any surprise Miura and the hunter x hunter guy take so many breaks =P
Alonaria
*Sheldon
Alonaria
I pick and choose Big Bang episodes that I enjoy. Shelden in the ball pit never ceases to amuse me. Still, it's definitely overrated haha.
Lenlo
IT Crowd > Modern Big Bang. Early Big Bang was good.

And yes, the work conditions in the Manga Industry are terrible. Oda, One Piece Mangaka, works stupid hours. He requests his assistances be "Willing to die for One Piece" because of the amount of work.
Kaiser-Eoghan
And hell yeah"! someone else thats hates on big bang theory.
IT crowd > big bang.
Kaiser-Eoghan
*more safer
Kaiser-Eoghan
And yet now here I am at same time, I think it might be kind of a shame that I can't see the value and fun anymore in some less safer offerings.
Kaiser-Eoghan
I thinking I might go insane if I looked up comments defending the visuals in occultic; nine.
Kaiser-Eoghan
Hate to say it but sometimes opinions, mainstream ones are actually wrong. Its a fact that superhero films have bad action scenes and cinematography and Hardboiled, a chinese action film is better filmed in terms of choreography.
Kaiser-Eoghan
As dickish as this is to say, I really do recoil when ssomeone says something like the Notebook or fifty shades is the best film of all time/their favourite.
Kaiser-Eoghan
See theres also factoring in the people whos favourite film or anime of all is the most recent they finished.
Kaiser-Eoghan
I remember mentioning recently that I was re-watching the twilight zone, the response I got was "I thought that you were talking about twilight"
Kaiser-Eoghan
See thats whats so great about being able to talk about more niche stuff online, theres an easier to find common ground.
AidanAK47
In general when it comes to mass popular opinion it's the tried and true safe stuff that ends up selling. The highest selling Mario games are the New Super Mario ones. The same generic Light novel and harems keep selling. There are plenty of examples but majority opinion tends to gravitate to the safe and familiar.
Kaiser-Eoghan
See, most (offline) people (and or teenagers)who aren't really all that interested in film or don't look into it that much will turn out for things like fifty shades, transformers or twilight, thats why those are popular. Most people aren't going to watch something made more than a few years ago or subtitled.
Kaiser-Eoghan
Oh...lol fuck thats a blunder...yes I meant Re:creators.
Kaiser-Eoghan
But by all means, people are fully entitled to like what they like. But there is a reason why so much rubbish gets popular.
AidanAK47
@Kaiser, Re:Creators.
Kaiser-Eoghan
As someone who would actually consider themselves creative and interested in things being imaginative I really do hate the whole anti-creativity /anti-art, anti-intelligence movement and way of thinking that allows un-deservedly popular things like what Aidan mentioned to fester.
Kaiser-Eoghan
Yes Re:zero's poor pacing and leaden dialogue is becoming too dominant and there should be more action, its good Setsuna opened up, but I still don't particularly like him.
Kaiser-Eoghan
I imagine the magazines/editors probably consider themselves the writers sometimes.
Kaiser-Eoghan
Pretty sure I only read nisekoi because I was keeping up with conversations about it, then dropped it before the Chitoge doublie showed up, just stopped reading.
AidanAK47
On the matter of Re:Creators, I feel the same as the Anon said. I find the exposition to just drone on far too much.
AidanAK47
On the matter of the manga industry being shit...it is. Manga in general is great but Jesus Christ the industry is a mess. Work conditions are utterly abhorrent and it's even worse that most series live or die based on a magazine popularity poll.
Because just because something is popular, does not mean it is quality. Example: Transformers, Twilight, Fifty shades, Sword Art Online, Big Bang theory
AidanAK47
@Anon, Still not getting your logic here. I mean if I have a problem with it after trying it then why am I not allowed to complain about it? Anyway it is only popular for the pandering. Even those who like Nisekoi admit that it's a mediocre harem and they mainly enjoy the waifu wars on the internet.
SuperMario
and now we will resort to illegal streaming sites for this one. "Piracy is almost always a service problem and not a pricing problem", this f*cking true
SuperMario
Huh? Welcome to the Ballroom Anime Gets Amazon Prime-Only Streaming Inside and Outside Japan. Now that just unbearable
SuperMario
Don't know about this new Re:Creators episode since I haven't watched it, but I don't really mind Meteora. Her dialogues scream "exposition" but she still fits well to the story. The fights are good, I agree, but why didn't they go all the way with the world's collapse last episode?
Anonymous1202407
Whether Nisekoi is pandering or not, it is not enough proof for you to suggest that manga industry is shit. If u want good mainstream then its not that hard to find. Also for every success like Nisekoi which u claim to be pandering, there are dozen like it that failed to be popular. Why? Because it clearly is popular for a reason other than just simple pandering.
SuperMario
Ha, Ping Pong. I need that kind of show again in my life.
Lenlo
Also, Ping Pong is amazing.
Lenlo
Theres a difference between pandering to a large audience, and an anime/manga with a quality story that everyone ends up liking. Ive always found moe shows and things like Nisekoi to be the former.
Anonymous1202407
If you have a problem with it after trying it just dont read it. Its that simple. Also what a surprise that a show like nisekoi that appeals to a large demographic is popular. U want the mangaka to apologize it's not some art house story like Ping Pong?
Lenlo
Meteora is pretty hit or miss with her dialogue imo. Sometimes its great, othertimes its not. I can say though I enjoy most of the fights.
Anonymous1202113
I really want to like Re:Creators. To be honest though, I'm getting tired of the dialogue. It has its high points, but it sometimes just seems to drone on and on, especially with all of Meteora's "hypotheses."
KT
Both Bahamut and RE:Creators had great episodes. But I was indeed mentally screaming Super Smash Bros at RE:Creators. You will get the point when you watch the episode.
AidanAK47
Taken on it's own, Nisekoi is harmless. But it is undeniably proof that you need not be creative or innovative to succeed in the industry. In fact declaring creative bankruptcy could turn more fruitful than genuine effort.
AidanAK47
And I said how can you decide you don't like something if you haven't read it?
Of course you are likely mean that if you don't like something then give up on reading it further which of course does not mean that someone cannot complain about it regardless.
Anonymous1198985
No, Im said if you dont like nisekoi dont read it
AidanAK47
@Anon, How do you know you don't like it if you don't read it?
Anonymous1196967
Don't like it don't read it.
AidanAK47
I went and read Double Arts. This really was a great manga with tons of potentail and truly didn't deserve the axe. It's so depressing that this was cut off so soon and the author went on to make the most generic Harem ever Nisekoi, and that got over 200 chapters.
Lenlo
All of the important dance scenes for Yuri were fantastic, its just some minor one off characters and some reused ones that were an issue, so no they are better than the CGI
Anonymous1190387
Is it worse than those CGI dance scenes in some anime?
AidanAK47
@Puran, It is pretty surprising how well that story turns out. I say IG might do the job even if there animation isn't the most consistent. The one thing I am worried about is those necks though. In the PV those things were ridiculously long.
Puran
Fair enough, recycling the animation was bad, agreed. But the animation itself was really good.
Lenlo
See, I found the repeated dances in Yuri one of the worse parts. Alot of it was recycled animation and certain characters were obviously rushed/not done. Some were amazing, cause they took their time, but others looked terrible.
Puran
I kinda wish Mappa was doing the anime though. Yuri on Ice had really nicely animated dances (and was more or less the only actually good quality of that show :P )
Puran
Reading the Ballroom e Youkoso manga has made me really excited about the Anime.
Kaiser_Eoghan
@Aidan: I'm particularly turned off by bully/bullying cliches these days. I've only read the first two volumes to see how awful she was but I ended up simply losing track of the series and stopped reading.
Kaiser_Eoghan
@Mario: Actually that has changed, I had to pick a different day to see it given changes in schedule, I've booked it for NEXT Wednesday now. I've watched Akira about four times.
AidanAK47
Oh, Rising of the Shield Hero is getting an anime adaption. Hmmm...honestly after finishing the series and looking over it as a whole I am not sure I even want that. Plus seeing Bitch Animated...would fill me with rage.
SuperMario
I intend to re-watch Akira soon, probably this weekend. It has been almost 10 years since my first watch and now I don't remember much about that one. Thought it was intriguing and complex but not as acclaimed as people hyped it to be (I'll pick Ghost in the Shell anytime). Wonder how I'd feel now after re-watching it.
SuperMario
@Kaiser: I remember you mentioned that you were going to watch In this Corner of the World today right? How was the movie Kaiser?
Lenlo
Oh cool, food wars is getting a 3rd season
Kaiser-Eoghan
Ballroom youkoso appears to be leading the polls.
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Mario: Fumiko is a female mangaka yes. Also I found bokura no hentai worth reading.
SuperMario
yep, I finished that manga too and I have conflicted feeling about it. Yuri(!) part and fanservice are to blatant but they have a purpose. This mangaka (not sure but I think she's a girl) has some unique voice.
AidanAK47
....well I skimmed that manga. And it was weird
SuperMario
By all appearances,Sakura is normal,albeit sheltered junior high school girl who enjoy talking about love and walking home from school together.However,they also happen to inhabit a strange and supernatural world populated by mysterious,gigantic beings and unusual plant and animal life.Amid their peaceful lives,Sakura becomes very interested in something only alluded to exist in old books: dicks
SuperMario
Here's a synopsis of other manga from the same author, I think you'll have a better idea of his theme -
Sakura no Sono
AidanAK47
Pretty much what Masky said. I am not really praising it. Anyway I plan to read one or two more chapters to see where it's going. But if it's going in the direction I think it's going then I am dropping this one fast.
Kaiser_Eoghan
There is of course the underlying concern that it will go a very ugly route with that development or it could become edgy/horribly minipulative, but for now it is as mario said, a hook.
SuperMario
Well. overall I don't dislike what I read there. It has good hook and I'm intrigued to know more what the hell will happen. Good set-up for me. I'm in
SuperMario
@Masky: it's fine Masky, since I will chec itk out any way and see it for myself ^^
Masky
So since you guys started being interested, I checked it out and uh.. Yeah, not reading. I think ye guys misunderstood Aidans warnings since that was just fucked up and not in the interesting way.
Lenlo
@Aidan: Berserk will never again go more than 3-4 months without a hiatus.
SuperMario
Hmmm, that manga Cutie Mutie sounds good to me. I might check it out later today
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Aidan: But had you not alluded to that scene, I may have seen the cover of that manga and skipped over it.
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Aidan: I had a feeling, sort of, sad, I am intrigued to read more.
AidanAK47
Hyping and warning are not the same thing.
Kaiser-Eoghan
Well with Aidan hyping up the horrors of cutie mutie I may as well glance at it to see what he' on about.
Kaiser-Eoghan
There are three manga with the name rec.
Kaiser-Eoghan
I am familiar with the artist for cutie mutie, she did that manga about the three kids dealing with gender/orientation issues.
AidanAK47
Oh look Berserk is on Haitus again....
.....the sad thing is that it comes as expected now.
AidanAK47
For reference the two I read were Cutie Mutie and Rec. Be warned, the first one goes to a rather uncomfortable level.
AidanAK47
@Masky, Read two manga. One started lighthearted and then went to really dark territory. The other one looks like it's about a really dark subject but turned out to be something more lighthearted.
AidanAK47
@Mario, Alright. Tested it now so it such be fixed. Try again.
Masky
@Aidan: Huh? What you read that turned dark/didn't turn dark? .-.
SuperMario
"too many answers selected for question 1! only 3 answers allowed!"
SuperMario
@Aidan: I still have the same issues. Weird
AidanAK47
@Mario, Wasn't my intent. Try it now and you should be able to pick as many as you want.
SuperMario
@Aidan: I'm not allowed to vote more than 3 votes. Is it your intention Aidan?
AidanAK47
Well that was weird. I read something that looked innocent but turned out to be really dark. Then something that looked really dark only to become innocent.
Masky
Yeah, nothing that interests me I see :D Like my strongest reaction to season preview was "Someone made isekai with smartphone? Really? REALLY? Thats best idea you had"
Masky
Ah Knighs and Magic, found that manga. It was boring enough for me to forget its name. Also besides being boring, I kinda find MC unlikeable since their only personality is that they like mechas and were a programmer before renicarnating as short bishie kid
Masky
Woo, time to vote stuff
SuperMario
@Kaiser: that movie In this Corner just getting more and more acclaimed huh? Thou I think it'a a type of movie that if you have high expectation for it you will likely be disappointed. It works best as a sleeper hit
SuperMario
As for cute monster girls, most of the time I don't find them cute at all. I know I'm being racist, but...
SuperMario
@Lenlo: I'm guilty with that cute girls genre, as i enjoyed K-On tremedously for example. Or If I have more time I'd follow Hinako Note this season ^^
Kaiser-Eoghan
They don't always adapt all that well or work as well outside of manga format, especially 4-komas.
Kaiser-Eoghan
*three
Kaiser-Eoghan
The only two of any interest were hidamari sketch, azumanga daioh and yuru yuri and that was largely down to being in the mood for them a few years ago.
Lenlo
@Mario: Personally, I have 0 interest in this Monster girls doing cute things subgenre, just like I have very little interest in the cute girls doing cute things major genre.
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Mario: As it turns out I DID read in this corner of the world. I'll also be seeing it next thursday.
SuperMario
@Kaiser: at this moment I'm very skeptical with the whole Monster girls doing cute girl subgenre, so I'm approachig Centaur with a caution. Of course, it all depends on how I feel after the first episode
SuperMario
@Kaiser: Happy End isn't as bleak aa his other works. But it's certainly Hanake's films, as it explores many of his favorite themes: the voyeurist of camera in his Benny's video, the detachment to the world and the underlying violence. Not his best thou but it's still very good
Kaiser-Eoghan
I think I'd be up for watching jigoku shojo, its been a long time since I watched the original two seasons and this one won't be as long, so it won't get as repetitive.
Kaiser-Eoghan
I voted centaur no nanami on the poll, think Mario could cover it.
Kaiser-Eoghan
@Mario: How did did you get on with Happy end? I heard its like a mix of his best works. Is it as dark and depressing?
Kaiser-Eoghan
I have vague memories of in the corner of the worlds manga, unless I'm mixing it up with something else.
SuperMario
Some news, Lu Over the Wall won the best prize at this year's Annecy (the 1st anime won the award since 1995's Pom Poko), with In the Corner of the World took the Jury Prize. Quite a good showing for anime this year.
AidanAK47
@Anon, Hello.
SuperMario
Really, still no vote for Kakegurui?? I thought it would take the top poll for sure
SuperMario
That 18if, even the poster doesn't make much sense, but it looks dazzling ^^
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