Posted by psgels on 17 January 2013 with categories: Magi

Magi uses its three main characters in an interesting way: episodes in which all three of them are active are quite rare. First they all travelled separately, then Aladdin lost consciousness for an entire month. It’s quite interesting, actually.

Now, as for this episode… the politics… Alibaba sure came with some ridiculous ideas. It was definitely creative, though and I have to say that I did not expect this. If the rest of this series will focus on turning Balbadd into a democracy and the challenges that come into its way, it’s going to make for a pretty interesting conclusion.

Having said that though, there is one thing I realized this episode: Magi is a series based on middle eastern folklore, based on modern ideals. The slavery already was one hint for this: sure, it’s something terrible and all, but back in those days people just found it normal, and were more preoccupied with their own survival. Then this episode with Alibaba’s sudden decision to turn an entire monarchy into a republic overnight. It is that this series suddenly revealed that there are other republics in this world, but still: it just does scream “freedom! equality for all”. Idealistic and inspiring indeed, but historically accurate? Err… Not to mention breaking off an arranged marriage in those days. I’m not saying that this was bad or anything, though it did catch my attention.
Rating: 4/8 (Good)

38 Responses

  1. Rachnid says:

    yeah, the republic stuff kinda bothered me too. This series continues to convince me that its political stuff isn’t very well thought out, but I guess the message we should take away from this is “Alibaba is King material”. I did, however, like the part where tsundere princess used her position to “trick” Sinbad into visiting her, nothing more deliciously devious than abusing power on perfectly reasonable grounds.

    • Airies says:

      tsuncess is the only reason im still watching.

    • HunterWulf says:

      Isn’t well thought out !!!! .. are you kidding me !!!? the guy dodged an arranged marriage .. voided an agreement to sell the people of his kingdom as collateral to another kingdom .. entered the most powerful alliance in the world .. and finally turned his own kingdom into a democracy … all in one stroke .. that’s some of the BEST handling of politics in anime to date .. seriously.

      • Airies says:

        I think you missed the point about it being a modern mindset in a world were it should not be.

        • HunterWulf says:

          Well and you missed the point that there is NOTHING modern about any of the concepts mentioned here, the concepts of democracy and public assemblies where common people rule and have control are as ancient as the Greek civilization (if not more ancient than that), alliances between kingdoms and countries is an even older concept .. so what modern mindset are we talking about here exactly, there is no reason whatsoever the concepts mentioned this episodes can’t exist in that fantasy setting !!!?

          • Sei says:

            Because Greek is very Arabic indeed.

            I know Democracy exists in Ancient Greek and all.

            But if you write a story of ancient Chinese and pull that crap I will call you bullshit.

            The point is, politics is a result of economy and social development. I don’t think that the society in this setting will give birth to the concept of democracy at this time beings.

          • HunterWulf says:

            @Sai
            Now that’s just getting silly, this is -surprise- FICTION .. and ironically you are complaining about the most plausible/realstic thing in the entire damn series so far .. Alibaba didn’t sit in a room for ten days then came out with the concept of democracy or invented a nuclear bomb or something .. he traveled around and saw many other countries .. some of them were republics that apply the concept of democracy (like the GREEKS).. so he thought he might try that in order to save his kingdom .. and well .. hello .. that’s the whole freaking point of fiction .. this is a WHAT IF scenarios.

            And please, none of the cities here even existed, the letters used aren’t real Arabic, Arabic people in real life didn’t have 30 feet tall Djinn, nor did they have any magical dungeons .. so if a fictional Arabic character coming across the concept of democracy in a foreign country he saw during his travels and wanting to apply it to his own kingdom is far more plausible and historically accurate than anything else here XD

      • Rachnid says:

        Maybe I should rephrase, I wasn’t referring to the content per se. I totally agree it’s awesome, but that’s exactly why it didn’t really work, because it came out of Alibaba’s mouth, I don’t think we can believe at this point he is capable of such a feat. Sinbad? Maybe, but it might even be a stretch coming from him. It’s not that it can’t exist, but instead how and who brought it to that place that is the problem. I think you’re mixing up my opinion with psgels’. And even in his case, I think he just didn’t get the point across well enough, like what happened with my first comment.

  2. minstrel says:

    It’s done on purpose, that Alibaba’s naivety will result in tragedy. The politic will soon turn much more complicated to the point of confusing later on. I wish it would stay as a lighthearted adventure. The next arc would be my favorite arc, I can only stick until that part otherwise I’ll get a headache.

  3. Kaiserin Emma says:

    Now, while I still agree with Airies I however feel that the developments in this episode by the sound of it are acceptable given that this is after all simply just fiction.

  4. Deano says:

    “Idealistic and inspiring indeed, but historically accurate?”

    …and I suppose the giant blue magical guys popping out of metal vessals is ‘historically accurate’.

    Come on guys, its an anime show. Allow some artistic licence, or about 75% of all anime can be considered nonsense.

    • Hogart says:

      I don’t think anyone (psgels included) were really griping about it, just noticing it.

      But if you’re interested in debating it, there is a bit of a difference between “historical accuracy” and “physical accuracy”. Having supernatural entities is historically accurate in the sense that the original Arabian Nights mythos this is based on also had them.

      It’s just a bit jarring to see modern mentalities in a setting where they don’t really apply and so don’t quite blend in seamlessly if you’re aware of the mythos it’s based on (Disney-fication of a sort). As psgels said though, it’s not good or bad in and of itself, just jarring.

      • meaqui says:

        Nope, thats fiction;) Trying to apply rules of our reality doesnt make sense at all. As long as it serves its part in the story, every element is fine.
        But I get it – you dont like it;)

        • Kaiserin Emma says:

          @Meaqui and Deano: Ah, excellent both of you get it!

        • Rachnid says:

          Yes it’s fine, but believable and convincing? Not really. When it stands out like that, it’s saying that there is something inconsistent with the context of the setting, and that is where most of us who didn’t like it, i think, don’t like about it. Yes it is fiction, but things can be done in a way that is good or not so good. Alibaba convincing people about going democratic? not so good. From what we have been shown so far, there was no hint at all that democracy has been remotely conceived in that setting, especially with the rampant slavery. The only knowledge of that is given to us seconds AFTER Alibaba suggests it, hence the “jarring” experience. I don’t agree with the use of the word “historical accuracy” too. But I totally understand where psgels and Hogart come from.
          I think nobody is saying that it is bad in and of itself, really. It’s like hitting a road bump you did not expect, and some of us get hooked up on that more than others. Just like you’re about “historical accuracy” ;). Either way, we will all be watching the next episode.

        • Hogart says:

          I guess that’s about the thick of things, yes. In my case it’s simply being forced to compare it to 1001 Nights because they shoehorned their way into the mythos so forcefully. It strikes me as lazy, since I can otherwise enjoy this on its own merits. It’s the price I have to pay for being an overanalyzer, I guess.

  5. hoiut says:

    I feel the same way as psgels concerning the “setting” right now. Pretentious, self-righteous sermons about the beauty of democracy (and somehow equating that with equality) and modern values contrast jarringly with the setting, characters, supposed upbringing, political climate, source material, historical period (albeit one of fantasy), and to some extent, common sense.

    The ideals he spouted are the last thing a believable protagonist would desire after witnessing firsthand the influence of “powerful/good” kings (Sinbad, and to lesser extent his father) in contrast with the abject dependence of the masses and their propensity to easily be misguided by the likes of Kassim and HIS controller. The only lesson to be learned from those particular circumstances from a lad in his position is to install a different (and more powerful/noble) king. Or that revolts are “okay” now and then. But a circumstantially inconsistent and entirely uncalled-for change in the fundamental system of governance?

    Many anthropologists take issue today with the imposition of “western democracy” by Western Superpowers as an artifact of their ongoing cultural hegemony and neo-colonialist global tactics. If anything, the intricate system of financial domination proposed in earlier episodes (a country selling itself out of power/rights) is closer to the modern norm. It can be argued the vast majority of so-called “democratic regimes” in the world today are only successful because one was — and is — and that one is pulling the strings and propping up the others. Proto-democratic city-states of centuries past met overwhelmingly with complete failure, as any student of global history will tell you. And Rome isn’t an exception (or even a “democracy” by anything close to the modern standard).

    I have nothing against democracies. But one look at American history will tell you that without a hell of a lot of luck and the perfect geopolitical environment (not to mention a whole boatload of bloodshed and repeated indoctrination), there’s little chance the One Democracy would have come to fruition in the first place.

    Minstrel’s comment (third on this page as of my post) excites me for this reason, though, at the same time the execution this past episode frustrates me. This particular turn on the road to political intrigue may have been shoddily contrived, but if the destination holds potential, I’ll give it the benefit of the doubt for the time being.

    • HunterWulf says:

      Well you seem to think that Democracy is a new thing or as modern as USA .. it isn’t .. and America isn’t the first country to have democratic rule to use it as the main example in your comment … the concept of democracy and giving power to rule over to people and common folk is a very old concept … there are many types of democracies and many nations had their own brand of democracy .. Alibaba traveled a lot on his way to his kingdom and saw many nations .. one of them was probably like ancient Greece .. because if you want to talk about democracy in ancient times then we have Greeks who applied the concept of public assembly and democracy in many aspects of their lives and in many of their cities –>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greek_democracy … and they weren’t the only one’s who did that.

      • hoiut says:

        You got my point right, but your rebuttal misses the mark.

        The concepts and ideals Alibaba is using to try to create a democracy sound altogether too modern — which the Greek/Athenian version was certainly not (and notably faced heavy criticisms in its time…and today). Democracy was seen as usurping the natural order and quite arbitrary by many scholars of the period. It resulted because of the permeation of philosophy and intellectualism throughout the state and the shabby treatment of the poor by the rich who were running the economy into the ground — the same final stimulus that occurs in Magi.

        But the characteristics of the people, the climate, the social system, and the region’s history make concepts such as these laughable in context, and would not be rationally proposed by a Prince who observed firsthand the corruption of the people’s will by external influence (something that didn’t happen in Greece). Also, a common feature of all early democracies (with the exception of one city-state): they failed. Often miserably.

        That’s not to say some concepts we associate as being “democratic” (or of “people’s republic”) are necessarily part of a particular system. “Almost all cultures have at some time had their new leaders approved, or at least accepted, by the people; and have changed the laws only after consultation with the assembly of the people or their leaders.” — Wikipedia

        ^ ^ So, totally this. This is what I was getting at — Alibaba would have rationally been more inclined to install/become a new, strong king with popular support. It is next to impossible to establish legislative legitimacy without some form of popular consent (btw, the method of extracting such consent doesn’t have to be pleasant to modern ears).

        “America isn’t the first country to have democratic rule to use it as the main example in your comment” — you bet your bottom dollar it is. I am as convinced of this as I am convinced the author only hoists this idealism into his work as a result of living under its modern (American) incarnation. That or the author is far smarter than his naive young protagonist and has plenty of turmoil and sociopolitical criticism in store for his new state.

  6. Sheba says:

    From Ali Baba’s point of view, the democracy was the best solution he could come up with. He saw that his brothers were not fit as kings, he knew that he don’t have the shoulders to stand the burden of power. The best he could do was to give the power to people, or at least a council representing the people. Remember that there are many forms of democracy as well many forms of monarchy. Ali Baba needs to exercise before finding the best compromise that will work for every parties. What he have proposed is just the first step.

  7. HunterWulf says:

    How are the politics not historically accurate !!? .. democracy and public assemblies aren’t modern things .. they are as old as Greek civilization if not older (and Greeks weren’t the only ones to apply the concept of democracy either .. many ancient civilizations did) .. so what historical inaccuracy are we talking about here ?

    • Sei says:

      oh, yeah, the all so mighty Greek again.

      The point is, social advance must be logical. Character action and choice must be logical with their life experience. It’s called consistence.

      WE KNOW that Democracy exists in ancient Greek, but please NOTE that different kind of society give birth to different kind of politics and they will have some other kind of advance. I cannot see that Alibaba could pull that ideal out of his head without the author putting words into his mouth.

      The thing is, that Democracy stuff is literally out of nowhere.

      Politics is difficult to handle, and I don’t think the author of this series could handle it well. As for now I guess we will just see some shallow development that lend way to some cheesy drama, which is not so rare in media nowadays. Not so good, but well nothing out of expectation.

      • HunterWulf says:

        I don’t know if you were asleep during the episode or what, but Alibaba didn’t make this up in his head .. .. i repeat .. he didn’t come up with this by himself.. he saw many EXAMPLES on his travels to his way home .. some of the countries/kingdoms he came across were ALREADY republics and he WITNESSED how they rule and how it is much better than the other monarchies .. it didn’t come out of nowhere.

        And seriously, the series handled politics very well so far .. i don’t know about your expectations but they seem pretty darn unrealistic.

        • kazid1 says:

          Totally agree Hunter, this posts have to much biased comments, “historically accurate?”??? wth? Magi is nottt a historicall anime and repeat “not” is based in 1001 nigths but is not only based in that material, the autor build a whole new world that no enter in the logic of the real world, thus the historicall argument is totally invalid. Second: of course the democracy concept is very weird at first glance but if you put atention to the show is the most convenient solution to the problem Also Alibaba do this knowing that his arguments have to much flaws, but also knowing that other factors are in his favour. For example the imperial princess clearly not want to marry that pig. The other brother is follow him blinded, The king previously have lost to much credits, and others factors, Common I have seen politics whit far more idiots arguments and win, is not about the logical of the argument but the psicological influence they have, the people want a great change, ok I would offer this big change. And the revolutions starts. Also Hunter and the anime explained that in THAT WORLD Republics have been established and Alibaba based his arguments in this. Third. This chapeter is not a wierd follow up that came of nowwere clearly Alibaba was thinking all over past chapters how to save Balbad and finish whit this conclusion. So is a logical follow up. Sorpresive but logical.

          In the end Magi is to much over the top, but are people that not liked how the autor manages this history and is plausible. But for something Magi is the 9 in manga Japan rattings and i this is not for being the tipical shounen manga.

          • Green says:

            Asking a shounen to be historically accurate is too much. The Arabic nights setting was used as a foundation. Example full metal alchemist, zetsuen no tempest, naruto, one piece, ruroni kenshin etc etc. alchemist, ninja pirates and samurai portrayal, none of that were historically accurate. Alchemist, samurai ninja doesn’t work like that. They weren’t meant to be historically accurate. Have everyone forgotten what fiction means? Furthermore it’s shounen.

      • hoiut says:

        Very true. And the democracies he claims to have seen are the icing on the cake of unbelievableness.

        I would propose that Alibaba simply mistook what he saw — or saw only what he wanted to see, and that wasn’t necessarily democracy. He simply saw the leaders supported by the people and who involve them (or take into account their concerns) when forming new laws.

        • HunterWulf says:

          He never used the word democracy .. he said the people in those republics made their choices by themselves .. whether they had public assemblies or were ruled by an elected ruler or by a parliament or a senate is unknown to us as he never gave the details of how those republics worked .. the fact stays that there is NOTHING unbelievable about it .. as the concept of public assemblies and democracy is as old as dirt .. it just wasn’t as widely spread as it is today.

          In fact it’s pretty much one of the few believable things around in the show (same as the negative effects of having a valueless paper currency forced on you instead of using gold or silver coins that have inherent value and global acceptance for use in trade)

          • hoiut says:

            No. Good sir, with these ridiculous assumptions you betray you know too little of their historical scope and context to use them as evidence.

            Yes, the concepts of democracy (people-rule) are ancient. Everyone today knows this. Everyone who has passed through middle school. Thank you for the insight anyway.

            But I can’t understand why you fail to grasp that there were no successful examples in the middle east.

            It would be wise to do a little reading (or go back to sit in on a middle school world history class) before applauding the feasibility of an Arabian/Persian prince suggesting democracy (republic).

            Points to consider:
            – There were no documented democracies in the middle east in any time point corresponding to the original or historically re-imagined Thousand and One Nights. This makes his “I saw ’em around, you know, here and there around the region” a product of his own (or his author’s) wishful interpretation of “hybrid-type” local regimes with a central autocrat. Maybe he mistook a small city council meeting for a scalable, non-autocratic political model. Maybe he just saw nice kings deferring to the people.
            – From the collapse of the Roman Republic to the mid 1800’s the pervading sentiment surrounding the Athenian model was extremely negative and critical by (even Western!) political thinkers, who considered it “mob rule.”

  8. Green says:

    Forrest Gump uses historical events as references and were never meant to be historically accurate. In fact most references were to point of being ridiculous.

  9. Rachnid says:

    The point is…the anime has failed to have us believe that Alibaba is capable of conceiving the idea of democracy, (please don’t assume that we’re all ignorant about democracy, even if we were, Alibaba’s lines about it existing in other countries should have been enough to convince us, but it didn’t, and that says something). That is an indisputable fact, since me and some other people here seem to share the same feelings. I think we are all also willing to overlook it if the coming events at least try to make an attempt to address this. It’s quite common that serialized manga pull something like this, what we need to see is how it deals with it later on. Who knows, maybe the next episode will have all it needs to resolve this.

    • Rachnid says:

      “conceiving” is not a good word, i’m aware he did not invent it. I meant “capable of thinking of using democracy as a solution”

    • Anca says:

      >That is an indisputable fact, since me and some other people here seem to share the same feelings.

      Heh.

      Anyway, I agree with HunterWulf. Democracy in an old as dirt concept, and Alibaba has been shown to be educated and well-traveled. I did find the scene jarring initially – because it came out of nowhere, but it was easy to accept once I thought a bit about it. The show should have foreshadowed it better, but there was nothing wrong with the concept itself.

      And since the manga was written by a modern mind, I’ll bet my knickers that the republic will fail spectacularly.

  10. momotsu says:

    It very amused for me to see you guys critique with Alibaba’s democratic idea is out of no where, though he clearly said that he saw this system work well in other regime while he was traveling.

    hmm

    • Kina says:

      Maybe they want some flashback or proof of Ailbaba’s travels to other places where the cities/town have democracy. Personally, I read the manga so its pretty funny how everyone nitpicking about how historically inaccurate/accurate or out of place Ailbaba’s proposed idea about establishing a republic is when later on in the manga everything is explain/playout. I don’t wanna say any spoilers so just have some patience lol. I really recommend reading the manga though because it is really well written and interesting.

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Kaiser Eoghan
At most moonbeam city seems sylistically interesting.
Kaiser Eoghan
Archer I simply lost track of and it ended up getting to long to catch up on it.
Kaiser Eoghan
Relatively old news, although I've been joking with friends about what if scenarios for a streets of rage film. I know there is a cg/live action hybrid sonic film in the works. I kind of want to think a shinobi or streets of rage film could work if they went full on 70s style action film.
AidanAK47
None of these games are played for the story. You would be better off just making a new game for them instead of a movie.
AidanAK47
I haven't even seen Archer. On another note SEGA is planning a bunch of live action movies of their franchises and boy do they all sound like a horrible idea. Shinobi, Golden Axe, Virtua Fighter, The House of the Dead, Crazy Taxi, Streets of rage and Altered Beast.
SuperMario
@Anon522497: hmm, I found Moonbeam City underwhelmed and for Archer up until their last season I actually got a bit tired of the cast (couldn't finish that season 7)
Anonymous522497
If i wanted Archer i would just watch Archer or Moonbeam City like everyone else.
Anonymous522338
Bloodivores
SuperMario
Anyone here watching Pacific Heat? It's an Aussie Archer-ripoff aired in Netflix last week. I actually enjoyed the 1st episode, not that great but everyone panned it like a plague.
AidanAK47
@Anon, Who?
Anonymous521123
#StephanieJaworowiczIsBeautiful
Kaiser Eoghan
@Mario: That'd be the compiliation film. I watched that based on hearing that the film version trimmed back on the shows weaker moments.
SuperMario
@Kaiser: was it the compilation film or the series itself? That scene is the highlight of that first season. I'm always a fan of KyoAni so it's very natural that I enjoy this series a whole lot.
Kaiser Eoghan
I watched the first season of sound euphonium, not much to say for it other than I liked the teacher guy and the scene where the black haired girl tells the main character that she thinks shes hiding behind a mask. Animation was as expected of kyoani good. All of those emotion shots though and some of the melodrama...
AidanAK47
@Kaiser, it does stop if you make an account.
Kaiser Eoghan
Hmmm there we go again, it delayed sending my message for longer than it should have.
Kaiser Eoghan
Anyone notice today and last night that the site has had some loading issues? I kept getting an error page for a while and it was also loading a bit more slowly. A server issue?
Lenlo
Have to say, Flip Flappers ep 5 was pretty good. I love atmospheric settings like that.
Lenlo
Looks like an Epee. The large bell guard, the fact that they are focusing on thrusting attacks instead of slashing (mostly). Fencing is alot of fun. Be prepared for some bruises though, as some people put their full body weight behind their thrusts.
SuperMario
I have one last dumb question, Can you tell what types of blade of Juri in Utena? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fGsVSSUv_i0
SuperMario
@Lenlo: the more you described the more I found fencing interesting. I might take a look around my town to see if we have Fencing here (the curse of living in a small town).
Lenlo
Blades are slightly different, yes, but mostly just in their guard and how much they bend. Sabers bend easily, Epee's not so much. Surprisingly Epee is the slowest, because people tend to be more careful. Saber is actually the most aggressive of the blades, atleast at my skill level
AidanAK47
That's all they had to do. Just stay inside and let it pass. But for some weird reason they just keep panicking over nothing.
As far as time/alternate world stuff goes this was ridiculously underwhelming. Just finished another movie called triangle and now that's how you do Time travel mindfuckery.
AidanAK47
@Mario, I am not fond of movies where people make stupid decisions for no good reason. For example:
"We should just stay inside"
"No, staying inside isn't realistic"
WHY IN THE HOLY HELL ISN'T IT REALISTIC.
SuperMario
Showed that movie to a bunch of friends last year and I remembered one of the girl just shut off the movie after 15'
SuperMario
@Aidan: too bad. I found Cohenrent really funny and entertaining. Some of their twists are stupid but I was actually invested in much of their characters. Maybe because I always love movies about a bunch of characters in an isolated setting
SuperMario
@Lenlo: sounds like Epee is the most "all-out-attack" and aggressive one. Their blades are different as well I assume?
AidanAK47
Just watched a movie called coherence and man, what a bunch a pseudo-intellectual garbage that was.
Lenlo
For Right of Way, its basically Person A attacks, Person B parries, Person A hits, Person B hits, Person B gets the point because they took right of way with the parry. Saber and Foil both have that, but Epee does not. Epee is simply "Whoever hits the opponent first, doesnt matter where, whole body is target area"
Lenlo
Theres Saber, Foil and Epee. The main difference is this thing called right of way, but there are other smaller ones like how Saber can hit with the edge and Epee is allowed to hit the entire body, instead of just the chest like Foil
SuperMario
For news, Blood Blockade Battlefront getting second season next year. As it was one of my favorite last year I'm really lokking forward to this second season
SuperMario
@Lenlo: that sounds great. From what I know from fencing there are 3 different types of blade right? So what are the differences between them? (Fencing 101 here)
Kaiser Eoghan
Although a fantasy sports thing could also generate interest, such as combining sports together to create something totally new.
Lenlo
@SuperMario, Fencing was great. Favorite sport ever and it helped me stay in shape in College. I find Epee to be the best blade, mostly cause I fenced it, but its a very intense 3 minutes. Unlike sports like Soccer and such which is alot of sustained running, Fencing is 3 minutes of Dont-Stop-Moving then wait till next match. Gets really fun once you figure out your own style.
SuperMario
haha, I wouldn't mind either if each episode focus on a single sport/ character/ country. Or even the positive aspects like role models, sports inspirations and stuffs
Lenlo
That Olympic anime sounds great.
Kaiser Eoghan
And it would be a good excuse to have characters of multiple backgrounds included too.
Kaiser Eoghan
Could be an 13 episode ova series with 48 minute episodes, and if its to be an ensemble character drama you could have 10 minutes to a each character (the ones being focused on in that episode) in each episode.
Kaiser Eoghan
Ah yes, aswell as cheating it could also get into "stage parenting", "abuse", "Disabilities" and also the general politics of sports, the backroom stuff.
SuperMario
I'll be the first in line if that olympic anime ever come out. Could be interesting to see the interactions between athletes in different sports, and then fans/athletes/coaches relationship, then the gold rush, doping... So much to talk around to
Kaiser Eoghan
I don't think theres ever been a manga about hurling either. Hey heres an idea, someone do an ensemble drama anime that deals with the olympics, fit in multiple sports that way.
SuperMario
Personally I find Australian football much more exciting than rugby. Or crickets.
SuperMario
@Kaiser: ha! Interesting that you mentioned Gaelic football, because in Aus we have AFL (Australian Football League), that really similars to Gealic Football to the point sometimes we have the 2 national teams compete each other with modified rules
Kaiser Eoghan
Hmm, lets see, sport under-represented in anime? Fencing, golf , Gaelic football, bowling, boat racing.
SuperMario
Hey, fencing is actually really cool. How did you like it Lenlo?
SuperMario
You have your point there Topgavin, as I clearly remember many instances where players' legs, backs or even necks got snapped during rugby's tackles. But in regards to Rugby I never really care about it. That and car racing
Lenlo
Its mostly the type of injuries you get that differ I think. Football you get concussions and broken bones and such, while in Rugby you probably get alot of bruises and cuts. Granted I have played neither, I was a Soccer man in highschool and fencing in College
Lenlo
American football has alot of rules, and really is just a bunch of millionaires running around chasing a ball. Rugby however, as Topgavin said, has no pads so when you get hit you get hit HARD
AidanAK47
I never ceases to surprise me just how high and mighty visual novel fans can be over Mosaics present in localized games. I mean they are literally complaining about not seeing genitalia yet the way they phrase it, it's like they are fighting against great injustice. If these VNs were Nukige they might have a point but in most cases the sex scenes in question are pointless and shoehorned in.
Topgavin
@Mario Rugby is more extreme *because* it has no protective gear. No hiding behind helmets and cushioned shoulder pads when ya get bowled over.
SuperMario
@Lenlo: I'm no expert but isn't American football a variation of Rugby? And I believe american football is more extreme, considering they have to wear helmets, protection gears and all that
Lenlo
I dont think theres alot of manga about it because its simply not that popular outside the US. As far as it being a battlefield, eeeeh? Not really? You want a battlefield watch Rugby.
SuperMario
I can think of other cool sports that could be interesting to see in anime: Kick Volleyball (Sepak takraw), Bossaball (combined soccer, volleyball in a trampoline), or in the same vein of skate figures this season, why not pole dancing competition???
Anonymous504493
What other sport is cool and popular that remains original to write about by now? There isn't a lot of manga about it compared to anything else.
Anonymous504493
American football looks like a battlefield with a visible battleline and everything. Id like it if there wasnt so many darn commercials.
Lenlo
I mean, its a sport. Far cry from best, but its definitely a sport.
SuperMario
@Vonter: or maybe because american football IS the best sports ever?
Kaiser Eoghan
@Vonter: Most likely due to the middle section of the original anime being the most popular bit.
Vonter
Can someone explain me how Cobra, is apparently getting an anime around some sort of space american football? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=54kNWPr43zE
Kaiser Eoghan
@Mario: Its not safe enough a film for me to properly recommend. Even to exploitation fans, they might find it too slow others would be too sensitive to it. Really una vita violenca, mamma roma, accatone, hawks and sparrows are what Pasolini is really about.
SuperMario
Now that you watched Salo, would you recommend the film to other people? I personally think it's a masterpiece but it's one of the title that I think people would break up with me if I show them this movie
SuperMario
@Kaiser: even him as a director, both Braveheart and Apocalypto don't do much to me, will see if Hacksaw Ridge going to change my mind (but I'm not to fond with war movies in general). La Notte is in my sooon-to-watch list for years, haha
Kaiser Eoghan
@Mario: Mel Gibson as a director, not as an actor =)
Kaiser Eoghan
@Mario: Thats why I prefer the neo-realist/quasi-neo-realism stuff as it deals with the worse off in society. But Antonioni was the master of being able to do films about angsty well-off people, L'aventura, the passenger and La notte for example
Kaiser Eoghan
@Mario: Its not so much that I dislike post 50s fellini moreso I feel that his throw everything at the screen and hope what sticks method can be hit or miss.
SuperMario
While I don't really mind his later stuffs because he was masterclass, I have a pretty hard time for Paolo Sorrentino's later works. The thing is I don't care much about the high class society so everything is just ridiculously over the top and glamour and I'm tired of it.
SuperMario
I haven't watched nights of cabiria but I did watch La Strada and boy, I was sad for few days after watching it. Fellini mentioned that he was inspired to make this movie when seeing a woman pushing a cart from behind. The film really carry that sense throughout its running
SuperMario
Michael Haneke put Salo in his top 10 films. Quite understandable when you think about it. Still for me one of the movie that affected me deeply.
SuperMario
I really admire Elle for its ability to maintain its sharpness because under other inexperienced directors it could easily becomes a mess. Mel Gibson, really? He's one of the few actors that I absolutely dislike
SuperMario
@Kaiser: The Red Turtle remains one of the the most refreshing time I had this year in cinema, but then again I haven't watched much films lately. Agree with you on Sonia's performance, and I still think they could cut out the first 20' of the film because it feels out of place compare to the rest of the film
Kaiser Eoghan
Debating whether to bother catching up on I am a hero or watching the film adaptation. I haven't read it since they got rid of that one female character.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Mario: I've a feeling you'll like nights of cabiria, Fellini was cranking out some solidly effective social-realist dramas in the 50s before he fell into self-indulgence.
Kaiser Eoghan
Now I have that sound euphonium compilation film downloaded, I should get to that sometime.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Mario: I also finally watched Salo, I ended up meeting it pretty much halfway. Some parts still retain the ability to effect a modern viewer, having seen his other works though its crazy just how different Salo is to them.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Mario: Seeing I, daniel Blake tomorrow and rogue one in a few weeks.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Mario: I hope Mel Gibson and Isabelle huppert win at the next oscars.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Mario: I liked the red turtle for its visual style of storytelling and animation even if I didn't get as emotionally attached to it as others did. I also watched Aquarius nd was pretty much blown away by Sonia Braga's performance. Elle is now one of my favourite Verhoeven films and its a miracle he managed to maintain such a great balance successfully throughout the film.
SuperMario
I don't care for the sequel of Code Geass at all. Why Spice & Wolf still hasn't got season 3 though is what really bugged me. From what I know their manga and LNs are selling very well
Anonymous494677
I wonder why that is...
Kaiser Eoghan
Ah, they were always milking code geass though what with those bajillion-million-billion manga spinoffs.
Kaiser Eoghan
Still say I was more fond of the character chemistry in spice and wolf as opposed to everything else.
Kaiser Eoghan
I'll likely pass on the code geass sequel, the memory I have of it has already led to its appeal dimishing for me, I don't want to ruin things further watching an un-neccesary followup. Still avoiding utawerumono's second season for same reasons.
AidanAK47
After all there are things which need sequels and things which don't. And Code Geass never needed a sequel after R2's ending. Giving something a sequel can just ruin the conculsion of the orignal series. Case in point. Eureka Seven Ao. Remember that? Cause you shouldn't. Because it was terrible.
AidanAK47
Honestly I would have preferred Spice and Wolf Season 3.
AidanAK47
So...is anyone gonna mention that Code Geass is getting a sequel?
....Because Code Geass is getting a sequel.
AidanAK47
@Anon, I am watching it as well. But I am a bit behind because I am watching the funimation broadcast dub. It's a very good guilty pleasure. I don't find it quite as funny anymore but it's still pure dumb fun.
SuperMario
@Anon487524: I'm still following it and it still remains a fun show to watch. I love the way they do the fan-servicey completely straight.
Topgavin
@anon I'll admit to watching it. While it is very simple and follows the sport anime formula religiously, it's still a blast to watch every week. This is also helped because you have no expectations for it before watching other than "oh god what's gonna happen this week".
Anonymous487524
Granted, nothing special, just one of those anime whose only worth is being fun to watch without being deep, but Keijo really is fun to watch, easily the best guilty pleasure anime in a long while to me.
Anonymous487524
I started watching it expecting an crappy fanservice anime with nothing of worth, but it ended up being actually pretty fun and awesome to watch.
Anonymous487524
Anyone here seeing Keijo?
SuperMario
What's up with 3-gatsu no Lion? Delayed for a week huh?
Kaiser Eoghan
Checked out Hedeki anno's godzilla re-boot earlier out of curiousity, its a bit plodding/dull at times but sometimes its high camp value played straight is kind of funny, having godzilla evolve during the film was a cool touch and I enjoyed every scene with him and making a Godzilla film today is still very relevant. Not a patch on the old ones though.
Anonymous482380
I think that movie was just so terrible that people made it into a meme. Stuff like "The Entire Bee Movie Except Evey Time They Say 'Bee' The Movie Speeds Up"
Kaiser Eoghan
I'm sorry lmao I had to, it seemed so appropriate a moment: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-1GadTfGFvU
AidanAK47
Fun Fact: The whole Bees shouldn't be able to fly thing is a myth.
Badesh
I think that was just a dry realization...
AidanAK47
@Topgavin, It's a meme to post the entire script of the bee movie in random places?
....I don't get the joke.
Topgavin
For anyone wondering, I think anon just copy/pasted the entire script for the Bee movie. Memes are goin strong
Anonymous479946
According to all known laws
of aviation,


there is no way a bee
should be able to fly.


Its wings are too small to get
its fat little body off the ground.


The bee, of course, flies anyway


because bees don't care
what humans think is impossible.


Yellow, black. Yellow, black.
Yellow, black. Yellow, black.


Ooh, black and yellow!
Let's shake it up a little.


Barry! Breakfast i
Kaiser Eoghan
Actually I think it was up to about episode ten or so I saw.
Kaiser Eoghan
From what I can recall I watched legend of the galactic heroes somewhere past the part with the Caligula guy.
AidanAK47
That is one thing I wonder about the remake. How are they going to make the space battles interesting? Cause for me theres only so many times you can watch tin boxes shoot lasers and explode.
AidanAK47
I didn't like LOGH until the third episode. That's when it started to catch my attention. It also helps that I have a interest in history as the plot of LOGH practically reads like genuine history.
AidanAK47
In my case the overhype didn't kill it for me as I generally try to avoid that. When I walked into LOGH I was under the impression that it would ahve merit but not be for me. After all I heard it was mostly politics and the politics of Gundam bore me to tears. Funny enough the opposite happened. The space battles bored me but the politics got me really interested.
AidanAK47
@Leahcimali, The problem is that the people who say that something is the best thing they ever seen don't actually mean it. Often it's just hyperbole. When talking we other people fans tend to blow certain things out of proportion unintentionally. Overrated is likely the wrong word but you get what I mean.
leahcimali
@AidankAK47 oh and are you going to write a review about it or because psngel already wrote a review of it you are not gonna write it ?
leahcimali
the problem is trying to rank art . Even comparing a comedy show and a story focus show is clearly impossible. @AidanAK47 do you think the overhype of some hardcore logh fan killed you enjoyment of the show ? Because sometimes when you expect nothing of something you can enjoy it more than when waiting for something incredible.
leahcimali
i hear the same thing from fan of lord of the ring, star wars and game of thrones, star trek ... etc. The hardcore fan of those says that they are the greatest things in history ... but saying there are overated is discrediting the quality of those. Nothing is perfect and again maintening equal quality in a longuer running show is impossible. But having a longer story create a more rich background
LookingForKeys
@Mario Kimi no Na ha is pretty damn good. Watched it while in Japan a couple weeks back. The story has well done surprises, and on the graphics side you can *really* see Production IG worked on it.
leahcimali
I don't think saying logh is overated is a good way to say it. All media with great aclaimed critics or even highly popular show suffer from the fan reaction. If fan claim that it is the best things that they have ever saw and you don't agree, it feels overated. But this is only pure subjectivity. Saying he is greastest thing in history is a way for fan to exprim there love
AidanAK47
However it has been placed on a unreasonable pedestal that nothing could live up to. Eva is sort of in the same boat. So yes it is overrated but that does not mean it isn't great.
AidanAK47
@Leahcimali, if anything is claimed to be the greatest thing in the history of mankind it is overrated. The basic idea that there is a single anime out there which is fundamental and universally better than all other anime regardless of genre or intent is inherently a flawed concept. I do certainly see why LOGH is so highly acclaimed and I believe it is well worth watching.
AidanAK47
@Anon, I didn't look into the details of the new LOGH remake. I was planning on doing that when I am doing an anime season preview for it whenever it's going to air next year. For a long anime it does rate highly but even then I am not certain it really needed all 110 of those episodes.
leahcimali
about your comment are you thinking the LOGH anime is overated ? i ask Because you said that there is plenty of anime you consided better .
Anonymous476875
about the remake won't it be a straight adaptation from the manga remake by the artist that made shiki ?
Anonymous476875
AidanAK47 personally i really loved legend of the galactic heroes and it is one of the anime that make one of the biggest impact on me. I found it the best "long" anime that i ever seen (more than 24 ep). But comparing it to anime with shorter format is a bit hard. you can make something that have perfect pacing in 1h30 but it is impossible with a 110 ep anime.
AidanAK47
Either way I am pretty certain that all other isn't crap to me now seeing as I have seen the so called pinnacle. In fact There are plenty of anime I consider better that LOGH.
AidanAK47
There are aspects of its story which wouldn't really work by today's standards.
AidanAK47
And I did it. I watched legend of the galactic heroes. I have slain the white whale of anime. It certainly was interesting to say the least but I think the remake coming is going to have trouble. I am in between giving it a 8 or a 9 but it's clear that LOGH is very much a product of its time.
Kaiser Eoghan
I didn't really care for this weeks flipflappers, the fanservice and also it was even more trigger than I could take.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Gavin@Mario: I'll get round to your name someday but I think this might be my last chance with shinkai.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Aidan: That disgaea review made me nostalgic because I remember my friends and I playing it back when it first came out. We found it difficult but were amused by it/liked the characters.
Kaiser Eoghan
@Aidan: Are the manga posts exclusively for series with only a few chapters translated or series that came out in the past year or so? I've been reading gunka no balthazar and enjoying it enough and think it should get recommendation out there.
Topgavin
Just booked tickets to go see it on Sunday with my little sister. Was surprisingly reluctant but I know she'll like it, I've already seen it but pumped either way.
SuperMario
Your name movie has been showed theatrically here in Aus, I'm planning to rewatch it soon in theatre and then do a review on it. Is that alright with other admins?
SuperMario
so I guess the top 6 will advance to the final are: Otabek Altin (Kazakhstan), Giacometti (Switzerland), Yuri, Yurio, JJ and Phichit? Will be very cool final event haha
SuperMario
At the very least Yuri on Ice shows me how entertaining ice skating can be
SuperMario
@K-Off: have a good trip ahead K-Off. Well, it's still better than Japan (earthquake) I guess
K-Off
Well, heading to Korea tomorrow. What a time to go. In the middle of Korea's biggest financial scandal since the 80s.
Lenlo
Is it just me, or does the Yuri on Ice opening get more colorful and detailed every week?
SuperMario
Badesh, if you like to check out their other songs, give "Tunnels of Love" and "Romeo & Juliet" a listen. Though I just discovered Telegraph Road quite recently, those 2 songs are qmong my all time favorite
SuperMario
I prefer their ealier version when the band was still together (aLCHEMY 1983), but that Rome 2005 was magnificent too. Seriously with this band diifferent live versions feel like another experience... And that song is criminally under-heard in radio too, because of its running time. A crying shame
Badesh
uhh, found it in better quality. now, THAT is a fitting present for my dad :)
Badesh
well that commentator, that sounds like he's in a soccer match, will get on my nerves though...
Badesh
if you're talking about the rome 2005 version... hell, that's some sweet music. i'll inhale that for the rest of the evening, thanks for that
SuperMario
Anyone here listen to Dire Straits? I just in the mood for their music lately. Checked out the band playing Telegraph Road live the other day on youtube and I was completely stunned.
SuperMario
@Lenlo: I considered Flip Flappers 3,5,6 to be its best so far so continue on to see if Flip Flappers is your cup of tea or not
SuperMario
For me I have a lot of stuffs to catch up on this time a year, both in terms of anime and in my RL. Time goes fast as hell
Lenlo
Started watching Flip Flappers. Thought I had it figured out, then we got Mad Max going on. I may start liking it more, cause the first 2 eps didnt do much
Lenlo
Its also nearing Thanksgiving in the states and end of semester for University, so those sorts will be busier than usual.
AidanAK47
You are far too young to be reminiscing. You can build a place for a community but you can't force one to come. I for one would think it would be easier to form one if people stopped using the Anon tag. You can change your name with the customize button you know.
Anonymous469664
I remember a time when people other than site admins were regular posters. Those were the days...
AidanAK47
But I suppose watching Westworld isn't exactly a waste of time.
AidanAK47
Downside is that I really don't have a lot of time these days. It's rather annoying. The day goes by and it doesn't really feel like you did anything.
AidanAK47
On the upside, I am nearly finished Legend of the galactic heroes. So when the Remake airs next year I will have a lot to say about it.
AidanAK47
Personally I have been rather busy lately and wanted to finish off a few things. Hence why my posts have been getting later.
Total users: 15

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